Now that the dust has settled, can we all agree that this was a good game?

Of course it was.

It just didn't live up to DS1 or the e3 builds of the game.

Except Scholar of the First Sin does live up to the E3 builds, so maybe you should educate yourself?

>But it was never trash

>color correction fixed the simplified geometry and textures

yeah okay

It's garbage that screwed over the entire ideology behind the level design these games need to actually be good.

Yeah, it was pretty good. Thought Dark Souls 1 and 3 were better, but it's still a great game.

That being said, I got SotFS edition: Never played vanilla.

It's WAY more than just color correction, you disingenuous faggot you.

It's a 7/10 before reaching the DLC
It's a 9/10 when you reach the DLC

rite?

DaS > BB > DS3 > DeS > DS2

None of them are particularly bad games, but DS2 clearly stands out as the worst of the bunch. Anything else is a meme opinion.

First post best post. Anyone with an ounce of objectivity will tell you that DaS2 is a good game with a disappointing launch, made into a great game by its DLC.
Memers on Cred Forums will never agree because 90% of them haven't played it since March 2014.

>Except Scholar of the First Sin does live up to the E3 builds
god you are so full of shit

>made into a great game by its DLC.
Its a little hard to gauge the game with dlc, since the gap in quality is so massive.

The DLC gives us 3 really cool endgame areas, but it doesn't make the vanilla game any less of a slog. DaS, BB and DS3 can all stand on their own without DLC. DS2 really can't.

But it ruined the lore. And the world isn't connected in a way that makes sense. And it's about a guy going to kill the most powerful beings in the world to bypass rubble.

Still the worst souls game

That's not an argument tho.

no it was shit, and i didn't even looked at the trailers, or i would be way more disappointed

Im just playing through now (SotFS) and im getting close to the end minus the dlc.

With bloodborne as my only comparison my opinion is very slanted but heres a very quick summary for me.

Pros
-Some great scenery
-Combat feels good

Cons
-Lore is meh
-NPC Summons trivialise most bosses

they only changed the lighting, its nothing like the e3, the textures are still shit.

>Combat feels good

I thought it had the worst combat in the series

>muh textures
Literally the only argument you have, and it isn't even good.

DeS>DaS=DS3>BB>DS2
I found Bloodborne to be EXTREMELY overrated
Don't get me wrong, it's a great game, but not as good as DeS, DaS or DS3 imo

>same repeating textures
>same washed out colours
>same RE4-tier geometry

You are full of shit
QED

What didn't you like about BB?

for me its
BB>das>das3>des>das2

>if you ignore all the differences then it's exactly the same as the E3 build

Such a riveting argument

ds2 is floaty as fuck
>isn't even good
yea because theres not much difference between the e3 and the released at all right you retard fanboy? soft is just the regular release with another lighting, same shit.

I agree with BB being overhyped and overrated, I enjoyed it though
DaS>DeS>BB>DaS3>DaS2

At least with SotFS it has a really neat story. Whereas DaS3 was pretty much fanwank references that went nowhere plot wise (though the upcoming DLC could change that like DaS2), DaS2 was trying to take the story in a new direction with the Buddhist-like "suffering stems from craving" theme it had going on, and I'm a bit sad that it didn't really get used in DaS3 despite the new ending easily setting itself up for further continuation. Aldia and memory Vendrick are easily the best characters in the series.

Gameplay wise it brought many good improvements as well
>Estus heal isn't instant (not talking about the animation but the actual healing effect) and can't be used to cheaply tank hits
>Introduced gradual Estus upgrades
>Power stance
>Off-hand weapons have a proper moveset instead of useless pseudo-shield
>Removal of utterly broken non-scaling paths and spells that allowed you to forgo offensive stats altogether
>Bow and crossbow improvements
>Improved crafting and new infusions
>Poison and Toxic are actually useful in both PvE and PvP
>More ring slots and different rings (even when disregarding +1, +2 and that shit)
>Weapon durability fucking matters
>New mechanics to old covenants and replacing useless covenants with new ones
>PvP covenants in general accessible much earlier
>Item stats screen clearly shows useful information like poise DMG, cast speed, counter multiplier etc.
It really shows that DaS2 had a different team, since while DaS3 inherited some good parts it for some obtuse reason also completely ignored others.

like

Cherrypicking.jpg

>Whereas DaS3 was pretty much fanwank references that went nowhere plot wise
nice meme, the refferences of ds3 made sense unlike ds2 refferences that are just pure fan service for no reason, like the sunligh altar and ornstein being in the game

Why was it even downgraded in the first place?

"Dark Souls II is bad" was one of the most prolific memes of modern times.

DS1>DS2>DeS>DS3
Bloodborne is not a Souls game

not even him but stop baiting you autist, this happens on the entire game eveyrwhere, you cant be serious, how is one of the first areas of the game cherry picking?

because MUH 60 FPS

>>/r/Cred Forums/

...

>obsessively shits on a game everytime it's brought up with cherrypicked and insincere images on low settings
>calls others autists
Yeah, okay.

>Whereas DaS3 was pretty much fanwank references that went nowhere plot wise
DS2 fans are so fucking disingenuous

>Ornstein just happens to be hanging out in a random cathedral across the ocean for no reason
>copypaste Gargoyle fight with the exact same music
>The lordvessel just happens to be broken in a random house across the ocean for no reason
>4 random mooks possess the lord souls for no apparent reason
>Manus was behind it all again

Not that guy, but I hated it how DaS3 make it blatant.
Heck the only good reference DaS3 make for previous game is for Gilligan from DaS2.

>ladders properly incorporated as part of the level
>died on top of pile of treasures

>the Blood Vial mechanics (Having to grind blood echoes so you can afford BVs, twenty fucking potions, minor healing dosages, no options to upgrade them etc)
>Forced farming (^One example above)
>Dungeons being extremely repetitive and half-assed designed
>Having to constantly and I mean CONSTANTLY pop in and out of Hunter's Dream
>The clusterfuck that is Insight. Basically, Insight is just a cheesy, money-grabbing ploy to force you to sign up for Playstation+ so you can bug other people to help you farm. And of course, make your friends buy Bloodborne to play with you and help you farm. It has absolutely no value from a game design standpoint, it's pure Modern Gaming bullshit. This one I'm especially ticked off that people aren't pointing out for the bullshit that it is. I mean, Insight is spent even if the summoning is unsuccessful? So based on pure random chance, you could lose too much Insight and be forced to farm! I can already see Bloodborne defenders lining up to say "optional this, optional that, you don't have to farm" but yes you absolutely do! Farming is a fundamental, required, aspect of Bloodborne and it's shitty game design any way you slice it.
I liked the upgrading mechanics and firearms though.

I completely agreed until you said DeS was better than anything. Its objectively the weakest in the series.

Drangleic Castle was probably one of the most nonsense levels in the game.

I like Souls level design because it feel organic. Drangleic Castle felt like something that belong in a DMC game rather than a Souls game. Just a bunch of linear hallways, traps and rooms thrown together without a single thought.

fuck you

>cherrypicked and insincere images on low settings
sure, autist...

Question:

I've got the Base DS2 game. Next sale should I buy the DLC or just go for SotFS?

I've played through the game twice already so enemy placement isn't a huge deal. I'm more worried about what has more active multiplayer?

>Not that guy, but I hated it how DaS3 make it blatant.
see
You're holding a double standard

Most of the levels feel that way to me.

This, people only like DeS because it's a PS3 exclusive.

Dark Souls 3 is better than the first two thanks to its improved controls and added variety in playstyles.

>the refferences of ds3 made sense unlike ds2 refferences that are just pure fan service for no reason, like the sunligh altar and ornstein being in the game
But that's the same for DaS3.
>Sunlight Altar in the Lothric Castle vs. Sunlight Altar in the poison valley
>Ornstein in DaS1 gets retconned to being an illusion (despite you getting his soul) who actually chased the firstborn vs. Ornstein in DaS2 is a reborn soul due to the cyclic nature of the world

>4 random mooks possess the lord souls for no apparent reason
If you had actually paid attention, DaS2 makes a rather big deal out of the same souls flourishing again and similar events repeating.
>Manus was behind it all again
Versus "Serpents were behind it all again" of DaS3 when it comes to Lothric and his bro or New "Not New Londo"?

>IT'S OKAY WHEN A-TEAM DOES IT

>the Blood Vial mechanics
agreed
>Basically, Insight is just a cheesy, money-grabbing ploy to force you to sign up for Playstation+ so you can bug other people to help you farm.
what? I got 99 without even trying
the biggest problem with insight was there was nothing to spend it on

>lol fucking contrarians overreacting fucking no life neet Cred Forums parrots haha it's a good game just deal with it

You can't look at it in a vacuum, there's no room for what is merely a passable Chinese knock-off in a series that has 4 other truly good games.

It's not quite terrible, but merely irrelevant.

SotFS has all the DLC. It also changes up the base game.

The level design was better than DS2
The matchmaking system was better than DS2
The characters, setting and lore were better than DS2

Did you even play the game, bro?
>Insight is consumed whenever you summon
>You can buy 1 (one) Bloodstone Chunk for 20 Insight
>You can buy 1 Bloodstone Rock for 60 Insight
Also, the more Insight you have, the less Beasthood you have, which is complete shit.

In DS2? yeah

The best levels in DS2 were the ones that didn't just feels like hallways. No-Man's Wharf actually felt like a pirate cove. Lost Bastille actually felt like a prison fortress.

>>obsessively shits on a game everytime it's brought up with cherrypicked and insincere images on low settings
>implying graphical options in the game change the textures

>summoning
>ever

Was the bloodstone rock added in a patch? I haven't played since the Old Hunters dropped

I think the Rocks were the equivalent of Slabs in Dark Souls. I don't remember.

Yeah they were patched in as a vendor item

No, it was way better in a lot of things than the other souls games, like the cutscenes, a real story, a real reason to play the game other than killing things,better npcs, more memorable bosses, a safe place with npcs that care about you, etc.
of course the online was messy, but still fun. if you play souls games for online online only you are autist

>I think the Rocks were the equivalent of Slabs in Dark Souls
Yes. Made to upgrade your weapons from +9 to +10

It was added in patch 1.09 if I remember correctly. After beating Mergo's Wet Nurse

Maybe you were just happier in 2009, and you're projecting this on to the game

If Demon's Souls dropped today and From hailed it as a "spiritual sequel", you would have a lot of very unhappy fans

everyone says that, ''its just nostalgia''
I played des after dark souls 1 and 2.

>a real story, a real reason to play the game other than killing things, better npcs
Time to take off nostalgia goggles senpai. I personally also love DeS, it was my first game in the series and I can totally agree on things like boss fights (while they were easier they were also more unique in gameplay), but its story isn't any more special than the other games, in fact I'd say it's even flimsier.
>King summons evil Demons
>You enter the Fog shrouding the demon filled kingdom
>You're dead now
>To leave Nexus you have to kill the Arch Demons who funnel souls to Old One
>Kill real Allant inside Old One and become a super hero or become super mega dickhead

Can't make this up

see
what i was talking about, its not about the story itself, but in dark souls 1 2 and 3 you are just lost and don't know what the fuck to do. in bloodborne you are crazy on drugs or something. While in demon's souls you are a hero that want to save the world and that is very clear on the first seconds of the game, then, there are cutscenes explaining what happened with the monumental. while in dark souls you are like ''what the fuck is happening why even live'', you end up killing the 4 bosses to die in the fire for nothing, it's useless, while in demon's souls you can actually change the world by saving it without dying(its temporary but then you can just save the world again if the maiden is alive) or let the world be fucked forever.
It's not about the story itself, but demon's souls actually tell you the history and it's not like ''go read item descriptions to have a clue of what is happening''

Even matt said that the game is good though

Its definitely a better game than DS2

I struggle between DeS and DS3 though. To be honest, DS3 probably felt the closest to DeS for me. You have all these creative boss fights with varied gameplay. You're given the invasion and summoning items right away without any bullshit. All the individual stages are expertly designed, but they're mostly isolated from one another.

Both games blew me away, but I think DS3 will probably cinch it with the DLC.

Yeah, DeS and DaS3 definitely had the most enjoyable online experience, though there were also some issues as well.
>DeS had no covenant bullshit, revival items are were, online items were accessible very early and thus both co-op and PvP were tightly tied to the single player experience as well. Completely broken balance that extended to solo PvE as well though.
>DaS1 added the retarded restrictive covenant system, though there were a few good new online elements, but the main PvP covenant is permanently missable and locked in late game and thus PvP is nothing but twinks and guide using faggots. You can't invade unless human despite the MAIN FUCKING REASON for invasions being getting your human form back. HP doesn't decrease on death so there isn't a real reason to play online to improve solo play. Broken or redundant covenants like Princess Guard or Gravelords.
>DaS2 added some improvements and mechanics to covenants like less strict restrictions (for changing between them) while removing shit ones, but made online PvP not matter at all when coming to human form restoration despite reinstating HP decrease on death. Covenants accessible early though. Best PvP balance when coming to builds due to removal of overpowered non-scaling shit, but Soul Memory is too restrictive and final. No infinite invasions items lol.
>DaS3 made PvP accessible early again and reinstated it as a core mechanic for regaining full HP human form back. Complete removal of PvP sin and related invasions for some god damn reasons. And shit covenants like Sentinels and Darkmoon being one and the same and straight out not working at all. Better attempt at eliminating twinking than DaS2.

Sometimes it feels like From Software really have no fucking idea what they're doing and they're just throwing shit everywhere while hoping that some of it sticks, not only when it comes to online, but other mechanics as well. Their other games like Armored Core series too.

>revival items are were
revival items were rare / expensive

>Best PvP balance when coming to builds due to removal of overpowered non-scaling shit
haha what?

DS2 did not have builds. It was just a race to SL828

des online system was better, you had to be in phantom form to invade, and not in human form like in dark souls
in demons souls when you killed someone you got human form, what was a big deal because you got 50% more hp so this incentivated people to invade, while in dark souls 1 you only get 1 humanity what is not a big deal at all since you can find it everywhere, while items to become human in des are rare.

also Old Monk is probably the most "git gud" bossfight in the history of the series

unless you puss out and go offline

...

reptiles are shit tier pets

>DS2 did not have builds. It was just a race to SL828
I'm talking about PvP as it was intended, as a part supporting the single player experience. Only the few autistic 1v1mefag honor duelers who treat PvP as a separate game mode cared about the soul level and other ranges made up by their community, no matter the game. I agree that Soul Memory was kind of a bad solution, but people also overblow its faults as something that "destroyed" PvP.

DaS2 had the best build variety due there being more viable and actually craftable infusions, more unique rings and ring slots, best equipment % range mechanic where there was more than one viable breaking point, certain armor provided VERY noticeable buffs against certain elements instead of shitty diminishing returns, poise actually existed without being brokenly overpowered like DaS1 or DaS3 where it was removed, the removal of non-scaling paths meant you needed to invest in one or more offensive stat as well etc.

If you don't have a SL cap, then you don't have builds. Builds require risks and rewards. There is no risk to grinding souls and hitting the softcap in every stat.

I want an iguana

>There is no risk to grinding souls and hitting the softcap in every stat.
Reread what I posted, no one apart from few autists who treat Souls PvP as a fighting game does that. PvP exists without the honor code community, and is in fact how it was originally intended to be played. Fire up a new game of DaS2 right now, start PvPing or playing online in general and then come back to tell me that "there is no builds and everyone plays the same".

Everybody in the top SM bracket has softcaps in every stat. This doesn't mean they'll all use the same weapons/armor/spells, but it does mean that at that level there is only one build.

This is a common sense argument. You don't know the levels of the people you are PVPing, but they would have to be retarded to stop leveling when there is no downside.

I started playing the scholars version not too long ago.

Gotta say, there are a lot of improvements over the first DS game.

For some reason you seem to think that there is nothing but a huge fucking blank between the start of the game and the very final SM bracket.

Like I said, Soul Memory is an inelegant solution, but it doesn't affect the vast majority of players the way you say it does. Build variety definitely does exist in virtually all the brackets that are relevant for NG for a very long time, even if you take your time to stop advancing the main game and just PvP for a while. Only the people who take their time to autistically grind for the 1337 duel scene are affected.

Yes. It's a great game. Possibly the best game in the series.

this nigga

meh

I like to make theme builds and invade/help with bosses at certain points throughout the game. That's what creates longevity for me, and DS2 completely fucked that up. That and them removing the full red eye orb. What a bunch of cunts.

If I didn't have Cheat Engine to get around this shit, I would have dropped DS2 after my first or second playthrough.

>Sunlight Altar in the Lothric Castle vs. Sunlight Altar in the poison valley

There is a reason for the Sunlight Altar being in Lothric Castle. The Lothric Kings are dragonriders just like the NK. Why do you think so many dragons are flying around Lothric?

>Versus "Serpents were behind it all again" of DaS3 when it comes to Lothric and his bro or New "Not New Londo"?

I will give you Londo, but Prince Lothric refused to link the fire because either aldia or pontiff sulyvahn told him not to.

Not really. It was a bad game Scholar did not fix a damn thing

I liked the story in DS3
>Tracking down all the lords of cinder and finding out why they're too pussified to link the flame
>The batshit Lothric royal family
>Finding out how much Pontiff Sully had fucked things up
>time fuckery with the false firelink shrine

Oceiros, the Lothric Princes, Yorhm, the Abyss Watchers. All those fights actually had some gravitas to them. I can't think of anything in DS2 that made me feel like that, save maybe for King Vendrick (and fuck the DLC for never letting us fight him in his prime)

>this is what cucks believe

No, it looked and played like shit

I saw footage of Scholar from a Let's Play. Like a 10ish hours of it.

It didn't fix a damn thing and SotFS was so bad for that guy he stopped playing it and went on to a different game

fucking garbage

>a Let's Play
>10ish hours
Are you 12?

>shitposting on Cred Forums
>24/7

We're all 12, user

the guy stopped playing because I sure as hell am not going to t buy a re-release of a game I found to be bad without making sure it's actually good.

In this case, SotFS was not good.

this