Would you like it if we had more translations like pic related?

You dont even know English m8.

is this real thing

Hey, Japanese people aren't all dipshits.

And even then there must be a good reason for sticking with honorifics and stuff like that, it has to serve some actual purpose in the dialogue if it is to be left there.

Yeah it serves the purpose of the translator being a lazy asshole

>So you are just a fucking idot then.
Just to satisfy my curiosity: what makes you so angry right now? What exactly had I said that offended you so much that you need to shit your pants like this in the public?

Seems like you are still a dumb otaku.

What makes you think that? I'm genuinely curious: you are throwing a tantrum here but I can't for the love of God figure out what about exactly.

>he needs an excuse to throw a tantrum

If it takes place in an area that is clearly Japanese or Japanese inspired, I'm mostly fine but this person is also going way overboard with the honorifics. They're not used constantly in daily conversation like that.

I'm fine with it when it's appropriate but if they're making the conversation more jilted than it would be in real life, they dun goof'd.

What the fuck? No. Translate properly or don't translate at all.

>Tifa, we must join up with our allies from Avalanche
You don't say "Crips gang" or "Bloods gang" or "Mafia gang", you just say "Crips" or "Bloods" or "Mafia" - I'm assuming this is the same for Avalanche.

>No, Cloud. First we must stop the Shinra Corp's Makou reactor
or
>No, Cloud. First we must stop Shinra's Makou reactor
Some companies go by X Corp or X Co or X Ltd. or plenty of other suffixes, but many just go by the company name. I'm assuming "Makou" is the type of reactor.

I have never played FF7

It's not like honorifics don't have English translations

>Sir
>Mr
>Master
>Lord
etc

Thankfully I didn't ever get that bad. I'd rather learn Japanese than read these kinds of translations, since they don't even bother to adapt the character subtext and tone, which is very common in Japanese dialogue.

OP's translation looks like mechanical garbage with needless details which were already implied into context. If a certain character addresses a character with a different honorific in mid-game, translator would have to account for that by getting as close as the original intention. Basically something like said.

This.

People post the autistic honorific/'translation with translation notes' pics to try and justify translators taking and changing whole sections of dialogue to localize it for Western audiences.

Yes but those are more towards adults. Kids use them in everyday life with their own peers. You will never go up to a 6th grader when you are in 4th and go "Hi Mr. Smith"

I love how P3/4 swaps between English and Japanese honorifics regularly.

It's not the honorifics that are the real problem (you can still argue that the honorifics present a level of meaning that simply can't be well translated).
It's the use of words like "nakama", "gumi" and "shi" which really don't need to be kept in Japanese, there is no cultural distinction or additional level of information conveyed in those. They are merely a masturbation of people over the fact that they know some Japanese.

>Thankfully I didn't ever get that bad.
When I was about 13-15 years old I liked my translations as filled with Japanism and as "truthful" to the original Japanese version as possible, mostly because I was a dumb otaku and understanding that kind of shit made me feel good about myself.
As time went on and I understood more and more of the language, and as I slowly drifted away from being Otaku to being actually interested in Japanese culture, this need slowly disappeared.
I think it really is fundamentally a self-esteem and identity issue, really. People are looking for something that makes them feel unique and special, and obsessing over these kinds of stuff are means to achieve that.
People can grow out of that though.

If i remember correctly bravely default translated them in a weird way.

At some point i clearly noticed that they probably used honorifics in the original dialogue.

It's definitely better than the original, but doesn't change the experience as much as one would hope. It's still the same game, after all.
But I'd say give it a try.

Direct translations are for non-fiction. It doesn't work for fictional characters you're trying to make people like and relate to. No one actually talks like that.

I don't watch much anime, but I'd accept direct translations in the subtitles because I already understand that they're speaking a different language and the personality is already being portrayed by their Japanese voice. Though I'd still prefer some interpretation instead.

In FF7's case, the character voice is the text itself. It's fictional as shit and the setting isn't in Japan so just make them speak whatever the fuck language the version of the game is designed for because there is no significance to it.

It really pisses me off when people keep in "Hai" in their translations

We have fucking dozens of ways of saying "yes" for fuck's sake

>Nobody here is aware that the OP's image is actually from a video critizing the overuse of japanese terms and honorifics in current translations of japanese media and not actually from the recent retranslation.

I haven't played it, but honestly, FF7's translation is such a mess that I'm surprised it took this long. I am dumbfounded as to why SE didn't release a retranslation "remaster" back then considering how popular the game was.

>I am dumbfounded as to why SE didn't release a retranslation "remaster" back then considering how popular the game was.

There's a pretty good chance it would have ended up worse than the original.

There are a few errors like "This guy are sick" but the translation is far from being "a mess". I love the way the characters talk in FF7. I also can't play Chrono Trigger's remakes because they fucked Frog for me.

Just weebs being lazy.

wtf mako sounds like "wacko" and not the kind of shark?

Technically yes.

Nah that's shit too. Honorifics are never ok in English.

Having recently played the retranslation for VII, I feel like all chatacters spoke the same, their sentences were just slightly better worded and overall nicer to read.
So I'd give the credit of how the characters speak in VII to the original script, rather than the translation.

>filled with unneeded japanese words that end up getting a translators note anyway
no

>It really pisses me off when people keep in "Hai" in their translations
Again, it's a reference and self-confirmation of a shared cultural knowledge and context. It's a "yes we all know it's Japanese" nudge and wink.

Argument could actually be made that "hai" and "yes" actually don't overlap entirely, because in Japan, "hai" is often used in the sense of confirming your attention rather than necessarily agreeing. It's not unusual that people will start their sentence with "hai" even when they are disagreeing with you, because they used it basically in the sense of "yes I'm aware of what you are saying", rather than "yes you are right".
Sometimes it's also used to empathize the sense of Japanese eagerness (which is why people tent to translate "ee" as "yes" while leaving "hai" untranslated: "ee" conveys agreement in the same sense that "hai" does but it lacks the sense of interest and eagerness "hai" usually connotes.

But really - that is something any translator should be able to work around and that does not actually add anything to the text if left in.

The issue is that FF7 has a lot of weird heart to it just made by people without any idea how to write English it seem. Sadly if they retranslate it I feel a lot of the heart will be taken out.
I can't really play FF6 GBA because of how weird the translation is. They wanted to keep a lot of Woolsey's weird lines but also redo everything else. So most of the time it's pretty serious but randomly you get that funny line out of nowhere.

Yes.

How do they handle it when Barret or Cid get angry? They would often #&$! and shit, is it still like that or did they replace it with something else?

He never said he was a native English speaker.

You have to keep in mind FF8 was the first FF with a really good translation while FF9 was the first with good translation AND localization. FF7 had a lot of goofy moments derived from its awkward translation.

They say "bastard" "hell" "damn" and "crap!" a lot but not the "@#$!" stuff.

Why not just translate the words? Doesn't make any sense

Either go full jap or full english, no middle terms except for words that don't exist in the other language

I wonder how just well written FF12 is in original Japanese script.

>The Death of Lord Rasler Heios Nabradia was but one of many Tragedies to befall the Kingdom of Dalmasca.
>The Air of Hope that had surrounded H.R.H. Princess Ashe's Wedding was now quite lost: Dalmasca had been set adrift at the Mercy of History's restless Tides.
>At this Time, two Great Empires struggled for Dominion over Ivalice: Archadia in the East, Rozarria the West.
>The Invasion of the Kingdom of Nabradia was Archadia's first Step in its westward March.

>With Lord Rasler's beloved Homeland consumed by the Hell-Fires of War, it seemed clear that Archadia would soon mete out a like Fate to Dalmasca.
>The Fall of the Fortress at Nalbina tolled the Destruction of the greater part of Dalmasca's Forces.
>A Counter-Attack was mounted by the Order of the Knights of Dalmasca, ever Brave and Faithful, but against the martial Might of the Archadian Armies, they stood little Chance of Victory.

>Indeed, their defeat was to be absolute.

>Soon thereafter, Archadia came forward offering Terms of Peace. Or, as one might rather put it, Terms of Dalmasca's Surrender.
>Lord Raminas, King of Dalmasca-and my Dear Friend - had no Choice but to accept these Terms. It was, thus, only with Reluctance that He set out for Nalbina Fortress - now under Archadian Occupation to affix His Seal to the Emperor's Treaty of Peace.
>The King had scarce departed His Royal City of Rabanastre when the Remnants of the Order made their Return. And not a Moment too soon, for a terrible Revelation awaited them.

>The Treaty would be signed with Steel and Writ in royal Blood.

So, "right" or "sure"?

While I disagree and feel that honorofics really don't work in English and can be replaced by our own "honorifics" such as sir, ma'am, or terms of endearment depending on the situation, if the game explicitly takes place in Japan and deals with Japanese culture frequently, it's fine.

Mako is never pronounced may-koe, whether shark or fantasy energy.

Even "yeah" and "uh huh" works.

This thread reminds me of how boring Chrono Trigger DS' translation is. Makes me wonder if I'd remember the game as fondly if it wasn't for Woosely

I think proper nouns would be fine. Imagine playing a game set in Tokyo but all the district names were translated.

>So, "right" or "sure"?
In some context, that could be it, in others it may be still slightly off... But again: this is really just me being a nerdy freak: this can be worked around in a million ways. Unlike the honorifics, where you can STILL make the point that the complex social hierarchies they denote are an important and unique part of their mentality and culture, this really does not mean anything but slightly different language convention.

There is literally no reason why to leave "hai" untranslated other than a wink at the audience because it pleases them to be reminded they are watching something Japanese.

>Cloud-san
>not Cloud-kun

Think the #&$! was the localizers trying to be funny either them censoring it.
I say FF6 was nice but handled by someone that loves being playful with his localization. And I really wish to see what it would actually be liked if it wasn't for the fact he had to work around Nintendo's localization policies. FF8 is when SE actively settled down and made sure every localization must be handled in a certain way. Like how spells are named.

That's what I said, but if "shi" means corporation, why not translate it?
OrAnd this tooGoing overboard with japanese terms in an english translation is pretty cringy, weeaboo pandering

I want more completely changed up scripts though. I don't really care for authenticity as long as the result is good.
youtu.be/SxJ4VWoeOzs

This shit is for Japanese only, they don't exist in the English language and shouldn't be in any translation or localisation.

I'm totally with you on this

To be honest, the only reason why Ghost Stories got away with that is because the original was just so fucking BAD there was absolutely nothing to lose by re-writing it.
Seriously, I watched the whole damn thing in original and my god I don't think I've seen any anime as absolutely pointless and dull as this shit. And I've seen some BAD anime in my life.

>they don't exist in the English language

You're am idiot and a weeb, I understand why japs hate people like you.

Protip: to properly translate Japanese (any language, really) you must first have an astoundingly firm grasp on your own native language and the culture, know its literature like the back of your hand (not just because of mastering the language, it's also to get accustomed with certain character archetypes and how they're classically represented), and must have written very good amounts of both formal and informal pieces of text, so that you can understand your own writing style and judge it objectively. A little of self-learned psychology wouldn't hurt.

Only then, you can get immersed in the Japanese culture, learn the language and find a way to bridge it with your own using your extensive knowledge. It's like connecting pieces in a puzzle. Japanese in particular takes a lot of interpretation, so you're basically doing TONS of rewriting, to the point that, even though the translation/localization is 100% accurate, it is mostly your own work than the original author's at this point. Book translators have any right to feel like they are the legitimate makers of the localized book, because they literally are. Not as omniscient as the one from whom they translated, but they have higher level of competence of the work, especially since most translators receive feedback from said original author.

There is a MASSIVE difference between the way Japanese and English honorifics are used. It's related to a whole system of social hierarchies and customs that are not equivalent.

That said, you can translate around that. And once again, the main problem is not the honorifics, but the dumb words that just have a legitimate English counterparts.

See
and

Yeah but it's not uncommon for someone to call their love interest sama in japanese if they really idolize them.

Also senpai really doesn't have a direct translation.

I mean do you really want upperclassman junichi to be uttered all the time?

Those aren't the same thing, learn Japanese, it's a completely different thing.

>You have to keep in mind FF8 was the first FF with a really good translation

Ehh....

This is partially translated. There's no excuse for this shit.

Official translations don't have that notice at the top to inform you of these things.

He's not completely wrong.
FF1 is your basic NES localization Honestly DQ was handled much better but whatever.
FF4 is awful in a beautiful way
FF6 was honestly great but not if you want something to really build upon with how you want to localize all your games.
All you really need to know about FF7 is that it starts with Executive Produce
FF8 honestly has a pretty good localization. It's just most of the casts are not that great.

It's never okay.

It was a mess, though, despite what "charm" it might have. The game was translation inhouse by japanese people who spoke english (instead in the us as was previously done in the snes FFs) and to varying quality. Different people translated different parts lf the game, and this lead to how inconsistant characters sound throughout the game (the most obvious being how barret and cid sometimes use actual swear words like fuck, then don't swear at all, and finally at the beginning @&*% is used to replace them). The game despretaly needed an editor to make this consistant correct places that were completely bad and outright wrong.

Speaking also about Woosley's translation in the SNES days. There are ways to keep authorial intent, while still keeping the text flavorful without having to outright change it. Woosley would completely change characters' lines and personality for no reason other than to make it fun, when more care or effort could have been done to keep the original intent and making the text flavorful without changing the meaning. The newer final fantasies, I think, strike a much better balance.

>They're not used constantly in daily conversation like that.
Uh... so you have never been to Japan, I guess? Because I can assure you, they are.

I think it depends. In Persona itself, some of it is alright (x-san, even senpai) but then they do shit like make up new ones to sound authentic (Yuka-tan).

I'm sure I don't need to bring up the whole "Whatever" thing which effectively replaced many lines which weren't even supposed to be his catchphrase (warukattana), and I didn't play FF8 in Japanese so I'm not the one to judge, but people who did found out different "Americanizations" in the dialogue, like making the various Ultimecia's speeches feel more "villainy" than they actually were. This is not the sign of a good translation. FF8 may be less butchered, that's all.

senpai is just for self insert reasons.

Ff1 translation is basically perfect imo. Although there wasn't much to fuck up in the first place.

that seems to be a really good way to learn jap

Woolsey was a guy that didn't really have much care of the original game. Just whatever sounded more colorful to him. Which personally worked in that era. Yeah you can hate him all you want but personally I really love his localization. But I also personally love Lunar which is more or less his style. Might not be good nowadays but in the 90's it worked.
I honestly never really was bothered by Squalls "Whatever" lines. Mostly because I didn't really like really any of the present characters so I most likely would have said "Whatever" to them too.

And you can really complain about most games for being too "Americanized" especially with Japanese RPG of that era. FF8 however set standards that they still use today.

Better than what we got now.

I prefer subs done by japs. It results in a more accurate translation with hilarious errors

That's not a translation, it's just keeping some of the original language.

None of those words are English and are spoken differently in English.

If we translate from Spanish we get shit like "the door of red" but it's supposed to be red door if your translated right.

>I honestly never really was bothered by Squalls "Whatever" lines.

But wouldn't you want to know what he ACTUALLY said most of the time?

fyeahffviii.tumblr.com/post/72672083380/squall-whatever-leonhart

I can excuse throwing that line as a catchphrase replacer, but most of the actual uses were inexcusable.

I don't mind that kind of direct translation if its subtitles and takes place in Japan. Anyone who speaks like that in an English dub should be killed.

And I can make a list of tons of great games that have done that. And games will keep doing it. The people doing the localization knew Squall had a catchphrase and decided "Whatever" would be his in the localization. And so did it whenever they felt it would be funny. Did they go overboard? Maybe but "inexcusable"? Not really.

>Note: this is what happens when people present ""creative"" localisation and dry translation as a false dichotomy.

I feel like we should keep honorifics as it does change dialogue context at times. Other than that it is total harbage.

I've actually been playing through FFVII to practice my Japanese using the eng/jap game script on the side, it's slow going still but at the same time it's real neat to see the original dialogue and all the differences and such.

It's one of those things I've been wanting to do for years and it's cool to finally be able to understand enough to actually get to it.

>pic

I will never get over that amount of butthurt. This is a person that truly believes that if they didn't add unnecessary amounts to "spice things up" that the game wouldn't sell.

Yes, Japanese can be rather dry and to the point, but so can English. Man, that makes me want to find an example of someone giving a rather brief statement in a western game.