Which dev is capable of making new Dune RTS?

Which dev is capable of making new Dune RTS?

Other urls found in this thread:

youtube.com/watch?v=2B6jgkcANRE&t=8m32s
youtube.com/watch?v=7whegFR6Lz0
youtube.com/watch?v=PlUU2U-Sn_g
twitter.com/SFWRedditGifs

what was his problem?

he is a dickhead

You have failed to give me an intelligent response, user.

I would have gladly used my powers of prescience to turn your desolate, barren thread into one full of life and prosperity. But alas, I will now depart, and leave you and your dying thread to drown in the sea of shitposting and memes

Meh, It was already done. There's not much interest. But I would welcome it if someone would try.

God, everything after Messiah wws so stupid.

Which dev is capable of making new RTS that isn't AYO HOL UP HD EDITION and sells?

God Emperor of Dune is objectively amazing. Best book in the series

Wargames devs
Oh wait no act of agression sucked

no It was retarded.

present an argument instead of just saying it is retarded

I just bought the first Dune book. What am I in for?

No you are retarded

confusion, until you become familiar with all the dune words

then enlightenment

Sand

THE SPICE MUST FLOW

Some reading. I recommend drinking a nice latte while you do for maximum comfy.

As for Dune games there will never be a good one. Game devs are functionally illiterate and the movies were so bad that's all they know about the series.

Wait a minute... rare resource being extracted from sandy locale with violent superstitious natives?

Is this... a... metaphor?

>buying books
every city in the western world has a library

Yes you fucktard

not as stupid as you shithead

Jeez, that lack of proper stillsuit discipline. This guy is losing so much moisture.

that was mean.

don't bother with him, for me i enjoyed it as well, since mutations were a thing with the guild, and more alien attention focus was great.

Literally nothing wrong, fucking bitch Siona. I know it's what he wanted but fuck Leto II was based

Boring, overrated story with the most deus ex machina character ever.

Messiah isn't even close to as good as Children of Dune

...

So, hang on...

What are the bene gesserit then? Illuminati?

>he doesn't understand the phrase Deus ex machina
>he doesn't get the point of Paul being as perfect as possible yet doing unforgivable things for a supposed "greater good"
Literally too stupid for the books

cmon step it up

That image is actually my mousepad right now

Is that what he supposed to look like after turning into a worm?

There are people who hate sci fi on Cred Forums
There are people that aren't worth your time user, you need to filter these baits out more, many newfags and even oldfags succumb to the bait too easily

mods are asleep, post shai hulud

No idea what you are talking about with greater good, only read the first book. It is definitely a deus ex machina character setup and now you are using ad hominem because you are butthurt I called its shit out. How many meme terms are we going to lay out in this thread?

I bought the first book but I haven't gotten around to reading it. I'm currently in the middle of reading both Huckleberry Finn and Call of Cthulhu.

Also waiting for Forza Horizon to download (it's 50 fucking gigs, jesus). should I spend this time finishing up reading my books so I can start Dune?

ITT: We find out what the extreme limit of shit taste is in humanity.

It's not 100% accurate to the book description, but yeah pretty much

Kek

By God Emperor yes. They describe that only his head and part of his arms aren't engulfed in the worm body and actually his human physiology is almost all been changed within the worm. At the end of Children he just wore the sand fish like a suit though.

is it possible to explain why the god emperor wears a sleeping bag without any spoilers?

I don't want my book experience spoiled any more than it already has been.

Yeah but the tiny orange one just has that authentic shitpost quality

How do you set your mind in motion Cred Forums?

That's a cock

It would be Deus ex machina if some random unstoppable force came out of nowhere and solved everything, that did not happen. If you mean he's a Mary Sue then yes, that is one of the major points of the story. Paul is supposed to be the best possible person you could have to rule you, yet even he can't just fix everything and in fact recognizes that he's done more horrible things than anyone in history in order to unite/subdue the universe and mold into what he sees as perfect.

he is half man half sandworm

Call of cthulhu is a novella at best. You can get through it easily. At the mountains of madness is lovecraft's longest work iirc and even that can be read in a few hours if you're a slow reader

> I recommend drinking a nice latte while you do for maximum comfy.

Come on user, at least drink something appropriate.

>illustration that doesn't get the tri-hinged mouth right
ffs.

this seems like a spoiler, but i'll admit it alleviated some confusion.

it didn't really make sense that hopping around in a giant sleeping bag would be becoming of the leader of a far future civilization.

>At the mountains of madness is lovecraft's longest work iirc

implying

PLOTS WITHIN PLOTS WITHIN PLOTS

REMEMBER THE TOOOOOTH

isnt that the one with the spooky flying space cucumbers that live at the bottom of the ocean?

None of the three libraries in my city have a copy of dune in stock.

One of them just removed its entire european history section to replace it with chinese language books for the foreign hordes.

So salty.

Oh, well, I didn't read past the first book, where they end on him suddenly being the perfect being as a solution to their otherwise unsolvable problems and I chose not to read the next book. I don't really want to read multiple books to see if something turns good, it is like people saying to play FF13 for 20 hours before it "opens up." Compare that to something like Hitchhiker's which is good as soon as you open it.

I would fucking KILL for another Dune RTS. I loved those games to fucking death.

Bethesda

all sorts of muslim dicksucking.

>He doesn't have a bookshelf because he's a fucking jew of all reasons
you need to scrub that feces off your tongue if you ever want to be rid of that shit taste.

Paul does foresee that he'll do horrible things in the name of order immediately after him and Jessica escape into the desert, not to mention he just mobilized a fanatical religious cult against the entire universe

I haven't read Dune, but I have recently read Timeweb.

Entire first book is basically a feint.

grimes likes dune

her first album is full of references. she's the reason i even got the book. also cause i heard its the best science fiction book.

gonna start it soon cause this thread got me hyped like pic. thanks anons.

>your city only has three libraries
>my city has a huge library with 22 branches and 14 partnered libraries around the city
>can digitally search their inventory and reserve a book, which they will send to the location of your choice for you to pick it up
>books check out for 1 month, but auto renew unless someone is waiting for it
Living in a larger city with a competent library is fucking amazing.

She was waiting for Kyon to wake up! B-but she doesn't l-like him, baka!

Why are there literal Jews in the series? You know what I'm talking about. It's from the fourth book, I think.

If you're enough of a pleb to not like the first book, there's basically no hope for you.

I lived in a district with like 50,000 people before, the libraries worked fine.

Then a gorillion asians moved in and everything is busy as fuck now and nothing works properly.

Anyone with half a brain can guess where I am, but this isn't vidya so I'll stop being salty.

I was going to say a pumpkin spice latte at starbucks but I don't want to sound like a shill or viral marketer. That's just my go to drink/place to do my reading.

Did you really miss all that TERRIBLE PURPOSE BLOODY JIHAD TERRIBLE PURPOSE BLOODY JIHAD TERRIBLE PURPOSE BLOODY JIHAD foreshadowing?

wtf i hate dune now

It's explained in the very same book they're mentioned at.

good taste user, those are max comfy.

im a fan of hazelnut cappuccinos from my lazy-man's instant coffee machine.

Except the first book is amazing. Maybe you should try being an adult. It typically helps.

You live a goddamn metropolis then. My city has one library, but at least it's modern. Before they moved it was situated in a cramped as fuck 80m2 basement of a building, though.

This reminds me I need to check out Seattle's public library before I move.

I feel for ya. Asians ruin goddamn everything.

>pumpkin spice latte
Do you happen to be a white woman, between the ages of 14 and 30?

Blizzard
You know I'm right

>RTS

I wouldn't make one. Maybe we can FINALLY get a proper adaptation of the books.

Yeah, pretty much. Pop's about 2 million.

Suburban life is comfy.

>Do you happen to be a white woman, between the ages of 14 and 30?

No, I'm a >fucking white male, I just picked up the habit when I was studying History in college. There's nothing more comfy than reading about the Bolshevik revolution and Stalin's rule in the Soviet Union while drinking a pumpkin spice latte in the autumn sun.

>that part with alia training in the nude to alleviate her sexual frustration
That made my dick diamonds when I was 15. Alia was my original waifu.

Seattle's library is fucking weird

Not only does it look like some sort of abstract geometric abomination, it has this weird escalator with these creepy eyeballs and lips that stare at you and cute japanese girls yelling at you

Well, at least your good taste in books makes up for your shit taste in coffee.

you're enjoying yourself in the club when this guy walks up and slaps your gf's ass

what do?

Ah, I stopped at children. It was too political-ey for me. Figured I didn't want to read 1000 more books of it.

You obviously need this more than I do. Take it.

Go "Allaka ibah"! On his ass.
Or maybe call the Fremen.

>city of 150,000
>pic related
must suck having a neglected library

C..could you put on a sun dress and let me squeeze your butt? Everything's fine. Everything's gonna be fine.

Dune RTS isn't the way to go. KOEI historical simulation series instead. Somebody call up them nips.

>She

god woofer of pupperkind

Fuck off.

Literally everything he said is said DIRECTLY in the first book you fucking fool

>and cute japanese girls yelling at you
SOLD

Please no, I'm trying to put that phase behind me.

FUCK YOU

I can't take responsibility for the book, it's not even mine!

>Maybe we can FINALLY get a proper adaptation of the books.

Well, we kinda did. And it was shit. Way back when original Dune game was also an adaptation, albeit a somewhat loose one.

Metro library user here

My library has 3 versions of Dune and another one on order, and has 60 copies total right now.

For some reason 28 people are on the wait list for one of the 6 copies of the original printing, while there are 15 available copies of the reprints. Fucking morons.

Brian Herbert lives in my town and I see him at the local Safeway sometimes

>I'm trying to put that phase behind me.
Don't be like that, honey bun. I'll treat you special.

fuck huck, read dune

if CofC takes you more than hour to read, go back to the berenstein bears

an hour is very, very generous

>Paul Atreides, I'm Harkonnen

did you ever ask him why does he hate his father legacy so much, was he abused by him or something

>the berenstein bears
Check yourself, this is a different timeline.

Next time you see him, tell him that Hellhole is awful and he should be ashamed of himself.

user, i'm way too beta to start a confrontation like that.

I know, all his books are terrible. He's just an awful writer, and only managed to get published because of his name

I read books off and on. I'll read a chapter and will forget about the book for weeks. Last time I picked up my lovecraft was in like June after I finished the chapter where the investigator talks to the sensitive lad.

Yeah, that would be awkward. I wouldn't be able to confront him either.

>he brags about how fast he can read his words printed on paper
How pathetic can you get? Why does it matter how long someone takes to read something for their own enjoyment?

>Grimes
Fuck off pls

>Just mobilized a fanatical religious cult against the entire universe
This is not how it is presented at all at the time he foresees everything. It is presented as a nearly perfect character becoming part of an exotic culture and rising up against a pretty clear cut villain who is something like his eighth cousin thrice removed. Maybe it becomes something else later, but I am only judging from the first book.

I don't know, maybe, I haven't read it in a long time and I was ready to get the fuck out of the book by that point because it was so disappointing. The plot solution reminds me of something the writers of Dr. Who would pull, sorry to say. He definitely glossed quickly over doing anything bad as a means to an end if he did mention it, because as soon as he could predict the future the writer shoved a shitload of information into a very quick ending. Maybe it is meant to draw people in for what is to come, but it didn't do a very good job.

What, in like the last fucking paragraph when the character can predict the future like these guys are saying? Get real, that is not satisfying or fleshed out at all, nothing happens in that first book like that.

I'm sorry user, but I would say just give up on reading.

what's wrong with grimes you fuck

Sound to me like you tl;dr'ed out of the book.

Dune's only like 400 pages, are you that lacking in an attention span?

why's that?

Dune requires effort from the reader to familiarize themselves with pieces of another language. It is not simply a normal book that normies can pick up and enjoy. Only the most patrish of readers will put in the effort to enjoy dune

I was just kidding

but really how do you get any enjoyment out of reading one chapter every few weeks? It would ruin any kind of atmosphere or pacing a book has for me

because then their time is better spent elsewhere

like in the garden, where they can play with all the other vegetables

The Harkonnen situation is the central conflict of the book, but it's not the central conflict of the universe. The terrible purpose and jihad is a major theme of the game, I mean Paul feels his terrible purpose in the first scene he's in (not specified what it is yet), he has the jihad epiphany around the middle of the book, and every scene with him acting later has him weighting his decisions to avoid the jihad.

And he fails, he fails spectacularly. Thousands of years of oppression Fremen suffered before and on Arrakis (I love how one of their DAILY rituals is remembering their exile from Betelgeuse that happened I don't remember how many thousands of years ago and meditating on it), oppression both from the Empire and its servants and from the environment, all that is unwound on the rest of the Universe.

But yeah, the other books dive into it in more detail. It's the major theme of the cycle, after all. "No more terrible disaster could befall your people than for them to fall into the hands of a Hero."

Couldn't jack off.

>One of them just removed its entire european history section to replace it with chinese language books for the foreign hordes.
jesus christ.

I loved Heretics because it felt like I finally hit the ground after God Emperor. I was back in the realm of (as close to) normal humans and could relate with characters. Plus Miles is so fucking cool. The story needed a champion after God Emperor.

In fact, it sort of lines up with the series pattern:
Dune - charismatic and exciting.
Messiah - Heart-breaking, with a small glimmer of hope
Children - you build faith in the twins throughout the book
God Emperor - you get to hear the monster speak and it's bone-chilling
Heretic - Back to the action
Chapterhouse - rebel base, last hope vibe.

It's a simple up and down cycle between each book, presented in expert form. I might just be saying this because I see people hate on Heretics and I really enjoyed it. It's not better than others, just different.

>There's a line in the book where he contemplates building a synthetic penis just to shock women

truly Leto is "our guy"

meant to quote

So he became a wizard. He even had a waifu.

>normal humans
>sardaukar the mentathog

I pirated all the dune books. Which ones are the ones written by the author's son? I'm guessing I shouldn't bother with those.

Whities getting rekt

You aren't doing a very good job of defending your book by saying things like that.

See, this sounds actually interesting, and what I was hoping for when I read the book. Instead I got all that other uninteresting content.

none

bring back westwood

600pages of fucking nothing

also,

spice

It's all literally in the book. But if you don't find Fremen culture and how it was influenced by all the external factors interesting, if you don't find the Great Houses scheming and plotting interesting - well, maybe it's not for you then.

Dune
Dune: Messiah
Children of Dune
God Emperor of Dune
Heretics of Dune
Chapterhouse: Dune

Are the one's Frank Herbert wrote..
1
2>3
4
5>6
That is the order of how they are "continued" So 1, 3, 4 & 6 would be stopping points.

Nothing, but I'd tell him that really stings

I wonder what it must feel like to know you completely missed the point of your father's works with your inferior sequels.

i'd describe the way my mind works as an incalculably massive set of mood rooms built into a huge collection of towers that exist in a very dense fog. I exist in these mood rooms at different times, upon leaving all knowledge and feelings of that room are imperfectly frozen. My mind naturally wanders rapidly through them all, and trying to maintain interest between these mood rooms is nigh impossible. Also once you get far enough away the fog swallows them and it's very hard to remember the way back. it can be years before the same mood room is found again, but that's very rare. often I cycle through some 50 or so mood rooms, and it can take anywhere from 1 hour to a few days to change mood room. upon re-entering a mood room, all things associated with that room come flooding back very quickly and naturally.

it is very possible to force the mind to stop wandering, but it takes an extreme amount of energy and it not only leaves me mentally exhausted but if sustained for too long can result in depression.

the result is sometimes I can read a book cover to cover. sometimes I get the extremely unignorable urge to do something else after the first page I read so I stop after I finish the chapter. these are extreme cases. Often I'll read 5-8 chapters or so in a night when the mood strikes. this applies to all things in life, not just reading books.

it's like that weird disorder where someone can't finish something mixed with adhd

i'm not sure if it's a blessing or a curse, it's made me completely incapable of being bored as I've found I can switch between mood rooms at will (though it's always in a random direction so it's very easy to get lost in the fog doing this) and doing so is like viewing an inspiring piece of art. on the downside i'm extremely unreliable and finishing large projects is a very daunting task.

the only thing that's ever seemed to help is microdosing acid which allows for effortless staying power with no depression.

/autism

That is some Ulillillia tier shit right there, user. Congratulations.

Wait, are you sure? Does the first book not end with him only just at that moment being able to predict the future? Pretty much everything described in that first post I don't recall happening at all, but the Fremen culture and Great House stuff is what I definitely did read and no, it did not interest me.

I think the problem is I came in looking for space tariffs, treaties, borders, political systems, and a well thought out plot that goes with them via something like exploitation of the existing setting such as loopholes or fringe societies, but instead it read more like a standard fictional book with a protagonist and antagonist and I tend not to be interested in any of those hugely popular series such as Harry Potter, ASOIAF, LotR, etc. The villain like I said just seemed very clear cut and the exotic culture thing just seems really played out to me.

feels like money in the bank, I imagine

Honored matres were dumb idea for the story, bene gesserit had a terminal case of the stupid, and it just wasn't entertaining watching two matriarchies flail against each other ineffectually.

Also Duncan Idaho being a Kwisatz Haderach was dumb.

>Does the first book not end with him only just at that moment being able to predict the future
Ah, you mean the "first book" of the book called Dune? Because by "first book" I was literally referring to the entire "Dune" book, not to the "Book one", which is only the first part of "Dune".

Though if you aren't hooked after reading Book One, well, I don't know if you should read the rest of it.

The first book is a fantasy narrative setup placed in a sci-fi setting. People who can only do fantasy and dislike sci-fi for often-unexamined reasons tend to drop out of the end of the first book after they get turned off by the sea change and don't go any further into the series. It's just how some people are, and the limitations of any niche work.

Thank god I am a polygamous lover of fiction genres and devoured the whole thing.

1-3 is the classic and safe trilogy. After it it gets really trippy, cerebral and strange. I don't think that's a negative unless you are expecting the more straightforward experience of the first 1-3.

However I kind of struggled to understand the odd dynamics at play in Heretics and chapterhouse beyond:

-Let's clone Duncan Husbando again for some reason
-Honored Matres use sex as a weapon and utterly detest the Bene Gesserit or whatever remains of the Bene Gesserit.
-Honored Matres are the villains but I'm never quite clear what their agenda and long-term goal is.
-Arrakis is dying and they were trying to reintroduce the sand-worm.
-Arrakis gets blown up
-Tileaxu freaks develop synthetic spice

Dune is clearcut as can be. Harkonnen and Corrino and other vested interests conspire to fuck over Atredies. Forget why Corrino did, harkonnen hated them, others had rational self-interest policies. Atredes want revenge, Paul sees the golden path and fears it but I think tries to pursue it and fails later. He becomes Messiah, brings on Jihad.
Messiah - courtly intrigue facing the new Messiah, his crisis of confidence with the golden path. Chooses asylum and ascetic death in the desert
Children - new order is being made corrupt and foul with the courtly intrigues. Leto and his sister represent the good, Paul's sister with the abomination of fatman the bad. Paul is preacher.
God Emperor - Leto is an unnatural god-emperor who is still working on setting man on the golden path.

Then I forget wtf the over-arching themes of the last two are.

>Forget why Corrino did
If you have played CK2 you would know it not a good idea to let one of your dukes become to powerful.

let him fuck me instead

or challenge him to a knife fight then i yell at his body and crack the ground

unironically relic entertainment.

Yeah, Shaddam regrets having to do that, as he actually likes Duke Atreides and doesn't like Baron at all, but he feels like Leto's popularity places endangers his position and he feels obliged to act to defend it.

ty

I hit him so hard he looks like a homemade tattoo.
youtube.com/watch?v=2B6jgkcANRE&t=8m32s

Oh, then I only read Book One. I think at the time I probably assumed they were compiled as an anthology after-the-fact. But yes, it didn't really hook me. Maybe my bar is just set way too high for reading as an entertainment medium, because I have gave a pass to some pretty fucking shitty video games and TV shows in the past. Usually if I read it is from a textbook for information.

Does anyone else actually like the 1984 movie?

Yes, maybe your bar is set way too high to enjoy what is commonly considered to be the best science fiction book ever written. Or maybe you didn't enjoy it because the subject matter didn't appeal to you? Nah, screw it, it's obviously shit.

Petroglyph.

He cucked himself and had his best bro Duncan clone #18382 make love to his wife since he no longer has a penis

I thought it was fuckin rad. Shame they never did the rest of the series.

you are allowed to like it, but you have to agree that it is objectively bad and unfaithful to the message of the book

none. anyways, i'd much rather have a game like dune 1 than 2

It has some nice visuals here and there, though, for example, in the picture you posted it triggers me how they wear incomplete stillstuits and don't wear robes on top of them.

Yeah, it just plays the "Paul is amazing and does everything right" part straight.

youtube.com/watch?v=7whegFR6Lz0

...

>that moisture just spilling on the floor
wtf woman

Don't get too carried away, if it didn't beat the bar then it didn't beat the bar regardless that is set high. I already said I enjoyed Hitchhiker's from the get-go and there is no way I would take what I read of Dune over it. Someone else already mentioned that it is a fantasy narrative and I think sums up pretty cleanly why I didn't like it that much. For instance I have heard Star Wars get the same sort of criticism from the "normies go home REEEEE" sci-fi crowd despite how popular it is.

i've learned to cope with it and hide the fact that im literally insane very well at this point in my life. i'm nowhere near ulillillia-tier or chris-chan, thank you. i'm a normal functioning member of society who pays taxes... but only because i literally can just zone out doing IT work and it makes no difference.

some other mental fun facts:
-I can feel impulses that I shouldn't be able to, like the ones telling my heart to beat. I've found I can slow it down and speed it up much like I can open and close my hand. I bet I could make it stop but I'm too scared to try.
-I can wiggle my ears. Like, a lot.
-I've collected evidence that the subconscious is fucking bullshit and psychology is a field of hacks but I am incapable of transferring my evidence into words. This is my eternal torture and I've learned to shut my mouth about it because people get offended when you tell them their shrink is a pseudo-scientist.
-I'm 5% convinced that I'm the antichrist.
-I've developed extremely advanced theories on sociology but I'll never tell anybody about them because they sound insane and extremely depressing even to me and i once spent a week off my ass on some research psychadelic and during that time I ate Yaweh's soul and found it extremely disappointing.

Hitchhiker's isn't really sci-fi either.

>Maybe my bar is just set way too high for reading as an entertainment medium
You know this makes you sound like a condescending, self-important prick with an inflated opinion of themselves and not the reasonable person sharing their reasonable position, right?

I mean just think about the situation here. The series is apparently well-loved and highly acclaimed, and by some in this thread no less. After stringing people along, thinking you had read and yet somehow misunderstood the entire first novel of the series - a misunderstanding, no fault there, but take it into consideration - it turns out that you read the first part of the novel and just jumped ship out of boredom. This is fair for any reader to do, surely, but maybe when things go this wrong it is no one's fault, no? Like a first date where both parties are just in mutual agreement that there was some sort of mistake and there is no spark there.

And in these circumstances, you casually say the equivalent of "I guess I only read stuff that's you know, ACTUALLY good; I just wasn't giving it any free passes, KNOWWHATI'MSAYIN... because it wasn't."

I dunno, do what you like. Seemed sort of needless to me.

Hey, Cred Forums, should I watch the Extended Edition or the Theatrical one?

>-I can feel impulses that I shouldn't be able to, like the ones telling my heart to beat. I've found I can slow it down and speed it up much like I can open and close my hand. I bet I could make it stop but I'm too scared to try.
>-I can wiggle my ears. Like, a lot.
That's just basic prana-bindu, user.

>I'm 5% convinced that I'm the antichrist.

oh please elaborate

Still mad they went overboard with making the Baron too evil, he was evil but smart, not evil and dumb

It's fantasy narrative that flips on itself, an utterly absorbing exploration of science fiction that I probably won't see again in this lifetime.

Face it, man. You had a winning poker hand, but folded before the turn.

Star Wars is fantasy all the way through; Dune used a fantasy setup as a launching point for something truly remarkable.

He was smart, but not too smart. He made some really stupid mistakes, like underestimating Fremen consistently.

Now all you have to do is to craft a mask of stone, find the perfect gem, and become the ultimate being.

Stilgar, have you noticed how very beautiful the young women are this year?

I miss you Leto II

a boy who uses religious propaganda to radicalize desert dwelling muslims who hold a monopoly on a valuable desert based resource and take over the universe. no really

Daily reminder that Lynch's Dune was decent

The guy who didn't like dune seems to be in the opposite camp, oddly enough: someone who came for science fiction but couldn't stomach the apparent fantasy structure and cut his losses early.

If you leave after the Pledge, you miss the Turn and glory of the Prestige.

...

that was more understandable, he was just stuck in the mindset of "savages can't ACTUALLY beat us, we have technology!" But everyone forgets when you're on someone elses home turf they can pull a lot of tricks

you're probably schizo user

I would agree that it is not strictly sci-fi and is obviously unrealistic. Strictly scientific futuristic works of fiction that are actually realistic are not very common from what I know, but no one said it has to be perfect. The point I was making is that the beginning of Dune did very little to exploit the fact that it is in a sci-fi setting. They might as well have had it all take place on a single planet in the middle ages. In Hitchhiker's you do at least have things that take advantage of the setting such as aliens, the improbability drive, the babel fish, interesting quirks involving things lost in translation between the characters, etc.

And it isn't condescending to shit on someone's opinion of not liking something? And did you forget that you are on Cred Forums, where no one likes anything and shits on each other?

Starts slow but gets gud

>And it isn't condescending to shit on someone's opinion of not liking something?
As far as I could tell in that post, the person wasn't shitting on them, just explaining to them something they didn't seem to get.

>Cred Forums, where no one likes anything and shits on each other?
Being in a shitty place doesn't really wash away the tragedy of being a shitty person.

>duncan fucking the god emperor's sister

You're wrong.

if they'd just remove the whispering into the mic. seriously. mute it when its on and it works out just fine

I lost my shit when the Baron mentions to the Emperor jokingly about turning Arrakis into a prison planet like the one people suspect the Sardaukar might and in fact are trained and the emperor thinks but doesn't reveal he is making a huge threat to him. Only for the Baron to realize what he has done later and starts shitting himself.

I BEQUEATH TO YOU MY FEAR AND LONELINESS. TO YOU I GIVE THE CERTAINTY THAT THE BODY AND SOUL OF THE BENE GESSERIT WILL MEET THE SAME FATE AS ALL OTHER BODIES AND ALL OTHER SOULS.

WHAT IS SURVIVAL IF YOU DO NOT SURVIVE WHOLE? ASK THE BENE TLEILAX THAT! WHAT IF YOU NO LONGER HEAR THE MUSIC OF LIFE? MEMORIES ARE NOT ENOUGH UNLESS THEY CALL YOU TO NOBLE PURPOSE!

WHY DID YOUR SISTERHOOD NOT BUILD THE GOLDEN PATH? YOU KNEW THE NECESSITY. YOUR FAILURE CONDEMNED ME, THE GOD EMPEROR, TO MILLENNIA OF PERSONAL DESPAIR.


MY WORDS ARE YOUR PAST,

MY QUESTIONS ARE SIMPLE:

WITH WHOM DO YOU ALLY?

'WITH THE SELF-IDOLATORS OF TLEILAX?

WITH MY FISH SPEAKER BUREAUCRACY?

WITH THE COSMOS-WANDERING GUILD?

"WITH HARKONNEN BLOOD SACRIFICERS?

WITH A DOGMATIC SINK OF YOUR OWN CREATION?

HOW WILL YOU MEET YOUR END?

AS NO MORE THAN A SECRET SOCIETY?

I found hitchiker really boring actually. They were just on Earth and stuff, and that Arthur guys house was getting demolished... I just didn't see the point. I was there for galaxy-spanning adventures, and all I got was a fat hobbit of an Englishman crying over his flat getting dozed. So I stopped reading.

Did I miss something good?

Now you are just being a baby, whining about someone on Cred Forums hurting someone's feelings. And come on dog, you have to be a bit more specific about which post you are talking about, we have post IDs for a reason. was probably the nicest and tamest post I could possibly make, I said it is possibly a fine book and I just didn't like it because of extremely high and picky standards. Do you really consider that to be cruel?

But everyone knows psychology is a bullshit pseudo science that doesn't rely on the scientific method, sociology is a more legit science.

Don't Panic

this is just pangalatic gargle bait

Not his first wife. Did you even read God Emperor?

I didn't like Hitchhiker either, but for different reasons

I found the writing to be really cringe and unfunny. And there are no other merits to the book besides its supposed "humor"

>Comparing what happens in the first 2 pages to several hundred pages.
I promise it gets good 10 hours in, I promise, just keep reading please.

youtube.com/watch?v=PlUU2U-Sn_g

>In Hitchhiker's you do at least have things that take advantage of the setting such as aliens
Wait, is that what sci-fi is to you? Rubber forehead aliens and pseudo-scientific doodads? "These aliens are sooo alien, their poetry is so bad it will make you want to kill yourself!"? I mean, sure, it's funny, I had a giggle reading it, but is that more of "science fiction" to you than exploring what a culture evolved under a tremendous pressure of a water-starved planet would look like?

You know, I don't think your bar is set "too high". I think you are just very shallow as a reader.

I'd prefer an RPG set in the Dune Universe

I am glad you threw out every other part of that post to create your own little strawman that you could kick down. Good job dude, you look big.

I'd like to have HomeWorld 3 from them way more than any DoW/CoH capture-the-point shit.

Also the original cockholes who made Men of War 2. Newer MoW games are basically new game modes.

LETO!!

IS SEE IT!

THE GOLDEN PATH!

SAIYNOQ!

Poor Moneo

Long love story between a Duke/prophet and his sand princess.

Then he thanks his wife empress for sneaking contraceptives into his sand princess' tea because it kept her alive all this time.

I did, and are you refering to the necessarily batshit daughter to one of the decedents of Ghanima and the court scribe?

>tfw you realise Shadowrun is the exact inverse of Dune

ITT: Cred Forumsiggers pretend that Dune is some vastly complex literature and not just a copy pasta mixture of several other classic sci-fi and religious works

I actually replied to them point by point, stuff like Dune having its share of interpace travel by folding space, shields and their influence on warfare, lasguns, Mentats as human computers being a neat sci-fi idea, hunter-killers etc., but then I deleted those replies because I'm pretty sure I found the core of your problem.

Mow isnt an rts, while coh and down are
This rtt meme like dow 2 and 3 needs to fuck off and die

>I did
Then how did you miss the part where Duncan fucks Hwee?

the Dune mod for CivIV is okay

I'm not sure that feelings or cruelty are the issue here lol. More than one person has gone out of their way to mention how funny it is that your standards for the written word are too high to enjoy what is surely an icon in science fiction writing. But Hitchhiker's, an episodic radio show compiled into a collection of novels after the fact, makes the grade.

I love Adams' work on HGttG, but you've got to understand that you're talking about high standards, making it about quality and not tastes. I think most people can understand why that's weird.

maybe im destined to be the real life emps.

will set to work on that if the next US president initiates the nuclear holocaust and I survive by grafting a sleeping bag to my skin.

I think the supernatural exists and will elude the sciences for all eternity because it can only exist outside of observation.

I've however been to places that man's own gods don't dare go. Gifted visions of halls of very alien temples. Indescribable horrors carved into the walls. Gargoyles of evil things that elude description in the most vivid way. I've seen men of the future walk these halls. Their shiny suits of some metal that looks like ivory. They walk between voids, voids being what separates planes of reality. To describe what a plane is, it's an entirely different existence. Yaweh, who has unlimited power over all domain is limited to this reality. Rules may or may not exist between realities. A reality may lack the existence of description as a concept. A reality may be completely devoid of the capability of supporting the concept of a concept, yet still contain things. Mathematical constants are almost always different between these planes, as a more generalized example (IE Pi equaling 1).

Ultimately these men have spoken to me but I don't know their language. Whenever they get a good look at me they run in terror, to another plane. What would men who have not only mastered nature, but all forms of nature and bend rules that one can't possible hope to predict the existence of, run from in abject terror?

this has crossed my mind quite often. i continually come to the conclusion that I'm not. I am a paranoid person in my gut, but I'm also a very stable person. I don't hear things that aren't there, I don't have delusions. I'm just a very strange person with very vivid dreams and some weird talents.

more mental fun facts plz

>/lit/ards pretend every modern work is not a rehash of already existing Greek literature

Leto's soldiers were approaching Sardaukar levels of proficiency. His military strength on his own home planet was calculated to be unbreachable even against Sardaukars.

Then the Duke was also extremely popular. His men being close to fanatical.


Not bad for a rice farmer.

Name these other classical works.

Not calling you out, just want new read material.

I think I could be your friend. Though I would argue that Shadowrun isn't very fantasy, depending on what you mean by fantasy.

>MoW
>rtt
Only if you count singleplayer. MP games tend to result in about same numbers and gameplay as CoH. More realistic CoH, pretty much. Inventory system is rarely used there.

Eh, I dunno about that. I read it when I was a kid and loved it, then read it when I was an adult and still loved it.

It throws lots of jargon and worldbuilding stuff in, but saying that you have to wrap your head around that to enjoy it is like saying you have to do the same to enjoy A Clockwork Orange or Firefly which both do the same.

>Just keep reading past the first few hundred pages bro, I promise it gets good.
Why are you defending something I am not even shitting on? I am sure that part is great buddy, you don't have to worry or defend it.

Yes, and the quality of that first book is absolutely less interesting from a sci-fi perspective. The ideas in the first book of Hitchhiker's were infinitely more interesting and take much better advantage of the sci-fi setting. it is like I said, that first book of Dune could have taken place entirely on a single planet with horses as the mode of transportation and it would hardly matter.

I am completely unaffected by bad trips on potent psychadelics to the point that I could be having one and not outwardly be showing it.

I once had a trip that my guts were spilling out of my belly and I just sort of rolled my eyes and dealt with it.

not really a mental feat, I guess. I dunno, the way everybody talks about bad trips makes them seem like they are these bad things, but they aren't so bad really. I kinda think of them as personal horror movies. They're kinda fun like that, I guess.

Messiah was easily the worst out of the original series

I'm not really from Cred Forums, was just referred here by a friend. Since this is my wheelhouse, I can confidently say that Dune as a series was definitely not just a slapdash admixture of pre-existing sci-fi and religious works, and in fact hinges on sociopolitical changes in the world that didn't really have any close cognates in world history.

So unless you mean what you said in a universal "there is nothing new under the sun" sort of way that condemns all works as derivative, a truly shiftless position, I'm going to have to disagree with you.

In SR's sense, fantasy means generic sword-and-sorcery stories influenced by Tolkien, etc.
There are plenty of mechanics and places in SR's Earth that are outright fantasyland, like ex-Ireland.

>"No more terrible disaster could befall your people than for them to fall into the hands of a Hero."

I don't know if that's really true. Paul and his descendents certainly do terrible, terrible things, but it's more that they're unable to stop the terrible things from happening, they do terrible things in an effort to stop even worse things from happening.

Paul lets loose the Jihad but he also directs and mitigates it as much as he can.

And ultimately, the whole point is that the Golden Path does save humanity, as it needed to. The story is more about the pain and sacrifice needed for a "utopia" and I suppose that the utopia won't be one.

Why do you assume that the crazy insane things you see are supernatural instead of just generated by your consciousness? It's illogical to assume something so grandiose without any evidence. Those are the same type of arguments that people who have "seen heaven" use and it makes no sense to me.

Imagine what this guy might not have missed, if Herbert hadn't taken the creative liberty of dividing his first novel into "books".

Honestly, though, I prefer Arthur C. Clark's stuff myself.

>they do terrible things in an effort to stop even worse things from happening

COMPLEX

MOTIVES

Lasguns + Shields and the talk of the houses all having their own "Atomics" was fucking boss man. Loved that shit.

>Childhood's End

so far this is the most accurate drawing of him that I've seen

>no flippers

it's SHIT

Had to look it up, it's been a while since I last read the series and the prequel books were the ones that I finished it on, I stand corrected, Moneo's paranoia about Duncan's looming death, and the death of Leto II are what stand out most to me if that makes any sort of difference.

>Hwi Noree

I really wasn't fond of that in the books. Her and Duncan.

because it's fun and it inspires my art, and my goal in life is to enjoy it as much as possible.

As far as my own research has shown, I'm the kind of person who founds a religion. That's not really an option in today's society, so I indulge myself privately. There's no harm in it, I only half-believe it. It satisfies the inner requirement for spirituality and I get to feel superior to my peers who haven't developed their own religion. It's basically a huge win.

The only thing exempt from this are my sociological theories and my hatred of psychology. These are based in evidence that I am simply not smart enough to quantify. Because of this I just keep my mouth shut about them.

forza horizon 3's downloaded, so i'm going.

sorry for derailing the comfy dune thread.

you're crazy, but you're also an interesting guy, user

please make a blog or something i would read this stuff any day

What did you guys think of Hunters and Sandworms of Dune?

>that first book of Dune could have taken place entirely on a single planet
There's a very large amount of science fiction works which do take place on a single planet. You're just a "sci-fi = space" memer.

>this post

Well if you thought children was too much politics, you probably wouldn't like god emperor.

It's pretty much

'How I Made the Universe My Bitch - p.s I love Duncan by t. Leto II

You made the same exact strawman as Sci-fi is science, technology, and space, and it didn't do jackshit to appeal to any of those. And on top of that, I already explained that setting aside, I don't even like the plot itself. It won in neither category.

M8 im looking at my book shelf and i cant find hunters of dune.

What happens in it again?

Genres are just marketing memes anyway so who gives a fuck

>hinges on sociopolitical changes in the world
You know, that's a good point. It really was something that could have only come out as it did, when it did. So maybe it's a generational thing, a lack of context. Or maybe the themes that were so urgent and exciting then (oil, the environment, human extinction, gender politics) have been harped on so much (just look at the environmental push of the 90s) that they are now tired, dull, lifeless, in need of a rebirth to feel invigorating once more.

I forced myself to read it when I was very young, too young to grasp most of it fully but that was really good for me. Forced me to open my mind, make my own understanding of the information presented. But god it is a hard read for many people; I tend not to recommend it to most people for that very reason. But it helped me to come to countless "impossible" realizations that I would not have come to by navigating the rest of my world. Certainly not as young as I did.

I owe the series a great debt.

...

>shogun

muh nignog

The White Plague has been sitting on my shelf for ages but I've still yet to read it. I bought it at a secondhand bookstore for a few bucks. Is it good?

>Sci-fi is science, technology, and space

Yeah man, its not a bad read, actually thinking about it now it makes a good read. Basically terrorists kill biologists wife and daughter, he takes revenge on the world by making a virus that kills only women, china and africa self destruct.

Go get the forever war user, its amazing

I'll push it to the top of my queue then.

>The Forever War
I'll add it to my wishlist.

Friend at work recommended "The Chronicles of Thomas Covenant" series based on our shared love of The Hobbit and Robert E. Howard. Have you read it?

There's a 95% chance you have schizophrenia

Telltale.

Jihad destroys Fremen culture as well, though. Before, they're often cruel, but cruel out of necessity and overall fair. The jihad transforms them.

>Sci-fi is science, technology, and space,
No it's not, that's a very primitive definition of a genre by someone who obviously didn't read much of it.

Didn't a lot of acclaimed science fiction authors think highly of Dune? If I remember right, Clarke compared Dune's monolithic station in science fiction to LotR's station in fantasy. And Heinlein said Dune was... googling the exact words... "Powerful, convincing, and most ingenious." Although I did have an English teacher I really respected say that he was recommended Dune by a friend whose opinion he valued highly who had read it as a young man, but he found himself unable to be "swept away" as an older man reading it for the first time.

Maybe it's a young man's infatuation, like that girl you thought was so great in highschool and learned so much about life and love from that you still hold a candle for today, but if you met her now as an older man there isn't anything to pull you in right from the start and you wouldn't have fun nor learn anything, making her unremarkable and unappealing in context?

as a fledgling author myself, I studied Dune as an example of world building.

imho there is no work of fiction that has a better thoughtout and complete foundation. he even figured out what the spice tastes like. cinnamon

Are you high right now? What about Telltale makes you think they are a good fit for RTS in general, much less Dune in particular? They're great but if even if they succeeded at it it would be an unexpected miracle, like Tiger Woods turning out to be a fantastic soccer forward.

Havent read it user.

But forever war is great

White plague aint a bad read

wow I love Cred Forums
You got your head so far up your ass you can see Wachowski.

I can't bring myself to believe established houses wouldn't just blow that fucker up with a space bombardment.

Not only losing the spice would completely destroy the Empire, most House leaders are probably hooked on it for geriatric reasons, and withdrawing spice from their diet would kill them. Would probably kill Steersman too, you know, the guys who would have to pilot those bombing ships. It would be basically mass suicide.

I have a question.

If the Spacing Guild holds a complete monopoly on space travel, and if spice exists exclusively on a single planet, why does the Guild not hold a monopoly on spice, and by extension, dominion over the Empire as a whole?

At some point it's explained in the books. The guild manipulates chosen houses to be in power for them so they never have to take the eventual fall. They keep themselves separate but necessary to any empire.

...

because the Fremen control the spice. They have the ability to kill all the sand worms, so they control the supply of spice

the spacing guild does get its spice directly from arrakis rather than a middleman, and they tug the strings of the house that operates it

That would give them too much power. At the beginning of the book, there's a fragile equilibrium of power, which is threatened by Leto's popularity, at least in Shaddam's eyes.

There's no knowledge of that in the beginning of the book.

>>Paul will remember that.

Because even the Guild cannot live on spice alone, they still need ore and many other things. And really, they are not really interested in ruling an Empire in that fashion, as says.

Think about it though. Why would a monopoly on spice make you, as the Spacing Guild, want to "rule" the known Empire in an explicit and political way? How would you even leverage your monopoly to do this, actually? I think you are probably quite clever, but it is much harder to exert power to wrest control of a relatively stable power structure than it is to resist such action, and the other people in this thread even if they aren't as clever can probably poke holes in any plans you make faster than you can make them. It's just a situation with very asymmetrical difficulty.

you're probably the worst person ever. i hope you have no friends.

Nobody can hate me more than I hate myself

Well I agree with him and I have friends! Okay, one friend. Better than none!

Are you referring to this passage? Because I fail to see the connection:

>Stilgar squared his shoulders, stepped closer to Paul and lowered his voice. "Now, remember what I told you. Do it simply and directly - nothing fancy. Among our people, we ride the maker at the age of twelve. You are more than six years beyond that age and not born to this life. You don't have to impress anyone with your courage. We know you are brave. All you must do is call the maker and ride him."

>"I will remember," Paul said.

>"See that you do. I'll not have you shame my teaching."

I still think Telltale is a quality developer, full of energy and potential, but it's proven itself on the basis of work with little to no synergy with what a Dune RTS might need, so I think it's a weird pick.

CIA

Kwisatz Haderach is Bin Laden.

he sniffed too much spice

Miles, Dar and Tar were great characters. It was really refreshing to see members of the Bene Gesserit be actual people again.

What the fuck was Chapterhouse's ending? Was Herbert just that broken by his wife's death?

go read Hunters and Sandworms, it'll make much more sense

>Brian books

A shitty map charted by a hack can still shed light on the route taken by a great explorer.

I was actually trying to make a joke, like, "Ha-ha, what a horrid pick," but now you've got me wondering how a Dune RTS with a complex branching storyline and first-person sections would actually be. Like... Sacrifice, only bigger and better.

actually, most of the script for Hunters and Sandworms was written by Frank, he just died before he could get them all together into a book (those two were supposed to be one fuckhuge book), so they are still legit

Nah, definitely gonna be either very out of Telltale's wheelhouse or terrible.

To be fair as of Dune I'm pretty sure no one knew that spice was integral for the guild to make the warp jumps that it did. At least until the end when the representative's false color contact lens falls out

There's no actual evidence for that though. We're just taking Brian's word for it. He may as well have made it all up just to give his books some legitimacy

I read both of them, and they definitely has much much more Frank-feel to them compared to the other Brian books. Also a lot of things from earlier books that were unexplained start to make sense with the explanation in the last two, like the whole background of the honored matres, and why Frank made Duncan such an important character.

I fucking hate Duncan.
>Duncan this, Duncan that
>NTR's Hwi from Leto
FUCK DUNCAN

An alright series that peaked with the first book and is vastly overrated.

Honestly, just watch the David Lynch film.

>forgets Ghanima and the scribe
>forgets Leto II was cucked from the beginning
>implying that wasn't a part of what he sacrificed for the sake of the golden path

They died together that's what counts.

You know what thread you're in right? The Dune games practically invented the RTS

HEY GUYS, I HEARD YOU WERE TALKING ABOUT DUNE.
CAN I JOIN IN?

Not sure how that changes the Guild's lack of motivation and ability to wrest control of the Empire through their monopoly on space travel, though.

Theirs isn't a vertically integrated monopoly, it's a horizontal one. Even if you take their dependence on spice out of it, a monopolized needs inputs to produce outputs like any other; they need ships, cargo, clients, imperial sanction, planetary force projection, and they do not generate these things themselves. They need Ix/Richesse/Vernix, Saudaukar, regular people. They don't want a crown, they want to win the economic game. I think Herbert outlines their philosophy rather well over the course of the series, flaws and all.

I know you're probably for real, but I'm having trouble believing it.

Why there only Dune threads when I have to leave for work?

Because you hang out on Cred Forums. Start a Dune thread (discretely) on /tg/, you'll have a blast.

Other than the Guild's dependence on melange to navigate (which is secret but not absolute, as even without spice prescience they can still navigate, just much more slowly and with a 1/8 chance of ship destruction), spice isn't that necessary to the Empire's function: as far as most people know it's just a yummy spice that extends your life and promotes health, if you can afford it.

Denied spice, rich people wouldn't live quite as long and certain people favoured at court would need to find other ways to make crazy money. Maybe they wouldn't even make as much money. But the system trudges on.

Hell, even if you include the guild's secret, most of the Empire would continue to exist more or less intact. Sure, some shit planets would probably get fucked and people would have to wait a lot longer for the latest shipment of whalefurs rom Caladan, but who cares?

The guild spice monopoly is less like a and more like one of the people sharing an apartment has an X-box in their room. Sure, they "control access" to it and it may be treasured and even "essential" to various activities, but you can't threaten people with that past a certain point. It's a balance of power that allows you to demand certain perks, but doesn't let you become the undisputed god of the apartment.

That, and as soon as they guild tried it they would be burned and gutted as an organization.

>>Denied spice, rich people wouldn't live quite as long
Denied spice, rich people would die. If you're on a spice diet and you withdraw spice, you die, that's it. Navigators would all die as well.
>a 1/8 chance of ship destruction
Ships and stuff they carry costs a huge amount of money, 1/8 is not acceptable.

why rts?

>If you're on a spice diet and you withdraw spice, you die, that's it.
If your consuming addict levels, yes you die. Most people, even the moderately rich, don't go that far; that's why the Fremen-blue irises are so remarkable. You just don't need to go that far unless you're just into spice like that, since the geriatric benefits of the spice kick in long before the addiction threshold.

I'm not saying it wouldn't be a disruption to the Empire. It would. There would be a power vacuum in nearly every level of every faction of the the power structure. You know what would happen to such power vacuums? They get filled. Houses have next in line, as does the throne and most bureaucracies. Sure, they might need to go to the fifth or fiftieth in line, but that's fine. There will be infighting, and power upsets, and stars will rise and fall. Do you think the world would end if every leader of UN countries was killed on the same day?

>Navigators would all die as well.
Navigators are keeping their dependence a secret from everyone, they can't threaten people with that AND keep it a secret.

>1/8 is not acceptable.
But it IS acceptable, that's what they were doing before Guild Steersmen perfected the art of spice-aided navigation. I'm not sure how you can argue this.

If suddenly we were blown back into the age of sail for transporting goods across the ocean, yes it would suck. Entire industries would be destroyed. Many would die, both immediately and on voyages. Some comforts we take for granted would no longer be possible. Would humanity even come close to being wiped out? Not on your life. We would still ship many of the most valuable things. Just mark our priorities, and adapt, as they would have to.

Because the first Dune game was an RTS, one of the codifying pioneers of the genre.

>Dune thread

I have one question to bust out to you people who like the original six as I do

Plotholes are so rare in this, but theres just one fucking thing I don't understand - which is Alia and the Baron.

What the fuck was the Baron doing in her other memory?
Shouldn't she, like her mother have only the other memory of what the Reverend Mother kept piling up and passing it to Jessica and the embryo Alia? IE, females only?

When Paul talked about what the fuck caused the twins he attributed it to the fremen heritage deeply filled with spice - Alia doesn't have that.
Or we can attribute it to Paul having been through the spice essence, but technically Alia was only conceived by 2 normal people without any real contact with spice or spice essence.

The circumstances of Alia and the twins are so vehemently different, Paul himself didn't awaken any other memory with the essence even if he did do some trippy shit.

Can't come to terms with it.

>But it IS acceptable, that's what they were doing before Guild Steersmen perfected the art of spice-aided navigation. I'm not sure how you can argue this.

Not really, it is said in the books that denied spice the imperium would revert to a million standalone planets doing their own thing.

When the Guild did its beginnings there was no gigantic imperium user, that was built once they had space-folding travel.

This loss of communication would be ultimately survivable, but surely would be considered unacceptable. I'm not arguing that Guild should've controlled spice, btw, I'm just saying that destroying spice would not be an action anyone would consider.

It's the genetic memory that Bene Gesserit are conditioned to ignore, Alia wasn't a proper BG so she fucked up. Jessica sees her male memory as a dangerous black hole during the Water of Life ceremony.

Mhmm hmm hmmm

All reverend mothers see that hole, the very point of the kwisatz haderach would be that he can.
But Alia is still a woman, even with the same genetics as Paul she is not a male.

And its never fucking mentioned at all, it all happens like she just got the same deal Jessica got, and then out of fucking nowhere she has her male ancestors too...
Which is again weird because its mentioned that the twins genetic memory goes way back in comparison, I think the twins themselves said it.

was this a book thing or a movie thing? i dont specifically remember it being mentioned in the books

I think the point of that hole isn't that it's a literal hole with no information, it's an area of genetic memory that is dangerous to women - dangerous for the very reason that happened to Alia. Remember, Bene Gesserit know what Alia is - "an abomination", mistakes like that happened before.

Spacemuslims.

Honestly, only the first book is worth reading unless you're a big sci Fi nerd.

Yes I get that - but the BG other memory doesn't really work the same way as the twins, they literally just copy paste the gathered up memories of all the shitton of reverend mothers over the years between eachother.

So Alia either was pre-born exactly like the twins - for which I cannot find a reasonable explanation or understand why the twins tell us they have more than she does.
Or she just received all the female memory copies like Jessica - which doesn't tell us why or where the Baron came from.

>crowbar

Why?

Trump bombed in the debate. We might be back in the Berenstein timeline.

>crowbar
That's a Maker Hook, powindah devil...

Doesn't really look like a pair of collapsible hooks, but I guess thats what it supposed to be, but he still drew a crowbar.

Wasn't Jessica preggers just prior to going through the fremen ceremony?

She was, which is why I think the spice essence is not a reasonable explanation, she was born to, but not conceived by someone already in contact with it.

Holy crap are you me?

Could be that she just had a case of the crazies, it happens from time to time I'm sure.

>tfw Westwood Studios invented base-building and resource gathering RTS back in the days with Dune and moved on to C&C
>tfw EA first destroyed Westwood and later C&C because the latest game neither had base-building nor resource gathering

This is why people think RTS is dead.
The reason is EA.

I mean its not a cold-hard plothole or anything, I just keep probing for holes when re-reading the books and so far this is the only thing that stuck with seemingly contradicting information.

I'm finishing Children right now for the third or fourth time, so I thought about it a lot this last week.

>destroying spice would not be an action anyone would consider
Which is why the guild didn't vie for direct control of the Empire with it.

Alia was premature Kwisatz Haderach just as Paul was, and so had access to that terrifying darkness of male genetic memory to which her mother Jessica was mercifully blind.

Alia underwent her awakening as a developing infant, not preborn and without no BG training, with Jessica herself not a full RM and having no idea of Alia's existence before the ordeal, much less how to protect an unborn child from the onslaught of memories Jessica herself was not expecting.

In that cacophony of unfettered, unmoderated, disjointed experience, Alia - with no identity of her own yet, not even from her mother - was placed on the slope of Abomination. Then, in a moment of extreme psychological distress and mental weakness, the Baron memory-identity asserted herself. Despite her abilities, his familiarity with vice and self-destruction was all too effective at ruining her.

Did I cover everything, or does something still not make sense to you?

>just as Paul

But no, she was a female, the very point was to get a male, because a male would have access to the male line ancestry.
The explanation to the "black hole" was that women are inherently unable to reach there due to not being "takers".

There are 2 points I'm contesting here at the same time
1. why would she have access to male memory AT ALL
2. why would she have access to ANY memory beyond what the fremen Reverend Mother passed to both of them (which can only be female memories)

If I accept she is pre-born, and this means she unlocks her entire ancestry's genetic memory like the twins did - this brings up a huge why?

BG Reverend mothers are breeding all the time and they aren't making pre-born children, even if she was not created by the exact same method - but the same spice essence.

Paul himself explained the irregularity of the twins due to the inclusion of Chani, who comes from a long damn line of full-on spice addicts.
Ofc Paul was wrong several times but still, the twins came from kwisatz haderach lineage + fremen spice addict lineage, which does sound pretty exotic enough to create weird shit.

Basically, the circumstances for Alia were way different, so I'm stumped at the results being exactly the same. Compounded by the fact that this is never ever mentioned anywhere up to the point where the Baron just pops up in her head like its totally natural.

And to throw the final loop in this - theres the "forgotten" Leto II, who lived to be like 4 year old and then got killed by Sardaukar.
He should've been pre-born, no? He was brother to the twins, and after the spice essence for paul.
But nope, normal kid from the kwisatz haderach and Chani, so not even that ascertained the unlocking of genetic memory.