Paid mods are not a bad idea

Paid mods are not a bad idea.

When money enters the mod equation, the competition increases. Mod creators will make their mods higher quality because they risk being outperformed by a competitor.

At the end of the day, this will result in fewer but much better mods instead of the hundreds of shitty free mods taking up space- no one will buy badly-reviewed mods and the creators will either make their mod better or abandon the market entirely.

Other urls found in this thread:

youtube.com/watch?v=U2Nad1b_3yY
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Circular_reasoning
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Free_market
youtube.com/watch?v=OYhWiNsIR6A
youtube.com/watch?v=QLDYlSLgWoQ
twitter.com/NSFWRedditImage

Paid mods are a terrible idea.

Wrong.

I know this is bait but it's funny that you use a picture of a paid mod armour suit that wasn't even implemented in game and needed a console command to receive. Not to mention the many clipping issues.

>Paid mods are not a bad idea.
It is when it's a community driven effort. Like you know, mods.

>Mod creators will make their mods higher quality because they risk being outperformed by a competitor.
Yeah, that sure has worked out fine for Steam and the Google Play store. It's not like there will be mountains of cheap copies that destroys any sort of quality control.

With mods now, a lot of the time there is no need to make copies, because all you have to gain for it is some small recognition, If you add money, then people will start to make shitty versions of anything even slightly popular and the overall quality will plummet.

>your post, in green text

>When money enters the mod equation, the competition increases. Mod creators will make their mods higher quality because they risk being outperformed by a competitor.
Then, how do you explain the quality of the games on Greenlight?

No need to increase the quality of mods, a lot of mods are already professional quality & are just fine.

Modding is the last bastion of freedom against monetization and corporate greed in the vidya community. It has always been, is, should always be free of charge of any kind.

Modding is a result of creativity, not a product to be sold. The game is.

Now fuck off, you goddamned mongrel.

Correct

Cred Forums is shit, its not good like it used to be. Make it worse

Especially when the only meme is babycon frog and pedo bear 2010

wrong

Paid mods are a great idea.
When valve was selling mods on steam, i grabbed as many mods from the nexus as i could
Made over $300 before they shut that service down

If they had actual quality control it would not have been so badly received.

You are wrong

>When money enters the mod equation, the competition increases. Mod creators will make their mods higher quality because they risk being outperformed by a competitor.
Modding isn't about competition or money you fucking idiot.

Daily reminded to email the Script Extender team about adopting GPLv3 license to ensure all paid mods are shitty armors and weapons

If paid mods are such a good idea why did they get shut down?

Checkmate, atheists.

>learn basic modding
>make the first futa/MLP/other meme shit for each game
>literally become a billionaire on the backs of autists

>Modding is the last bastion of freedom against monetization and corporate greed in the vidya community. It has always been, is, should always be free of charge of any kind.
Everything will be monetized in a free market society, you silly socialist hippie. Might as well get used to it, because paid mods WILL return. It's only a matter of time.

>Modding is a result of creativity, not a product to be sold. The game is.
Says who? You?

>Now fuck off, you goddamned mongrel.
/r/latestagecapitalism awaits your return

>consoles get a yearly fee for infrastructure but get free games as a compensation
>jajajajaja le paying for le playing le online
>pc gets paid mods
>well, the creators have to survive somehow. i'll glady pay 10$ for a single armor for one game
Pkeks everybody.

Wrong. (See I can do it too)

But that's wrong. You're more likely to get app style developers, where they have a "free" and paid version. There was that guy who had some spell, where each time you cast it, or maybe once per game, it would pause gameplay to let you know there was a paid version where it would not do that.

...

Who are you quoting?

Fuck off Todd

They're not a bad idea. Steam just implemented them terribly. In TF2, if a mod like a hat or whatever gets added to the game through some user, that hat becomes Valve's property and their problem if the hat doesn't work. It's some Valve employee's job to make sure it works in all subsequent updates to the game. For Skyrim, it's not Bethesda's responsibilty to make sure that mod works in all versions and on all computers. I could easily just sell a mod that ruins your character and save. There needa to be some kind of oversight from the developer.

Even if you weren't baiting, sir faggot OP, I'd still find a way to get all of those paid mods for free.

Especially since a large cut of money in the paid mod's price is going to the publisher, who was not the least bit responsible for production said mod.

Except we already have a handful of amazing mods. So that argument is moot.

Spoken like a man who has absolutely no fucking clue how the modding community functions and has always functioned.

Get the fuck out of here Gabe. This isn't reddit. This isn't your fucking hugbox

...

>Everything will be monetized in a free market society, you silly socialist hippie
Why stop there? Might as well monetize how much you can play the game then, like they're doing with Titanfall's "drink a can of Mtn Dew to play this gamemode" marketing, huh? You retarded slave.

>Says who? You?
Yeah. Says me and the rest of the modding community, who fucked your overlords in the ass until they dropped this autistic concept you praise so much.

>paid mods WILL return. It's only a matter of time.
And they'll be brought down again if they do. Cry harder.

First post best post.
dumb niggers who think paid mods are alright are fuckers who didn't grow up 80s-2000s.
All the mods you ever needed or wanted were all free.
It's like bottled water. it's a scam

No, paid mods result in cutting work to maximize profit per time spent. Also theft of mods increases drastically.monetary transactions inhibit the ease of acces to modded content and inhances the risk of the person downloading. Finally there will be an over saturation of low quality content due to people phishing for carless consumers that arent paying attention to what they are downloading, wetjer or not anybody will even bite is irrelavent

>At the end of the day, this will result in fewer but much better mods
Pretty much the opposite, ton of stupid easy-to-do shit gets released in attempt to get any amount of money.

But you already knew that, you just made this thread for shitposting purposes or lived under a rock when Steam tried this shit once.

>When money enters the mod equation, the competition increases. Mod creators will make their mods higher quality because they risk being outperformed by a competitor.

Blatant lie
>nobody will make big mods like graphics overhaul or gameplay changes because they'll be expensive to buy and nobody will buy them
>instead they'll prefer to make shitty small mods for cheap prices to acquire quick bucks

paid mods = death of a hobbie

Don Ramon always right on point.

>Everything in this post so goddamn wrong

Jesus, OP, you're supposed to be figuratively sucking dicks, not literally sucking them

Paid mods are like capitalism, neither work like they're supposed to

And somehow modding was fine for decades before paid modding and it's still doing fine right now. You'd add nothing but detract everything OP, go shitpost somewhere else retard.

Horrible idea. They cant guarantee the mods will be compatible with other mods and that video demonstrating that the first few paid mods that were release had shitty quality. The hard truth is that these modders are not professionals and Dont bother making sure their products are 100% polished. It's ridiculous paying a few dollars for a product that isn't guaranteed to be compatible In the future and doesn't have the same Polish as the base game

Is Cred Forums going full circle and defending paid mods now? What the fuck. Why do you autists forget how bad things were if only a little bit of time goes by?

>At the end of the day, this will result in fewer but much better mods instead of the hundreds of shitty free mods taking up space- no one will buy badly-reviewed mods and the creators will either make their mod better or abandon the market entirely.

See also: Greenlight.

We already had that talk when they tried. We said it was a bad idea and still decided to go with it.

Making long story short, they flip-flopped and abandonned the idea. No need to discuss it again. It's a bad idea and decreases the general quality of the mods. Period.

Paid mods are fine, I just wont buy those ones

>monetize how much you can play a game

Already happening, spiral knights had an energy bar that replenished daily and was used to progress down floors and thus compleet dungeons. When you ran out of energy you really couldent play unless you bought more

If it has value, it can be sold.

The actual real step to make payable mods real is to make a system where product is made, the original developer then validates it and then it is sold with premium price.

Selling big mods is much more likely than trying to sell small mods.

Reminder that paid mods were such a bad idea that even reddit despised them, and when Gaben tried to defend them there his defense became one of if not the most downvoted post in the website's history. In fact the response was so negative Gaben cut the AMA short and had to send in his PR the following day to talk to them in his place.

Even Gaben's most diehard dicksuckers didn't drink this Kool-aid

They've actually gotten rid of this to try to keep a playerbase going

Also, dlc wasnt much diffrent. Now its standard. Mods are really just a varient of dlc, and as such they can still be monetized. The process will be very slow though, and must be done on small scale.

Shills and corporate cucks are trying to wear people down slowly by pushing the same button over and over until they give in to their bullshit. This is subversion.

Reminder that the end times creep into our lives gradually, not at once.

Do not give up the fight.

Well if they sell a product they'll have to meet all the regulations of selling a product i.e. the full extend of the law and regulations of each nation this product is sold in. Good luck finding modders who're willing to study up on commercial law and standards asswhipe.

No, if a retard starts scraming on a buss it dosnt mean everybody on the bus is retarded too

Gabe was talking like a business man to hobbyists.
It was never going to work out.
But it is true that funding does create higher quality products. Free mods can only get better by larger passion, which is crap shoot as a resource, very rare and highly inconsistent.

/thread

What if the bus is full of retards screaming equally retarded but radically different things constantly? This is what Cred Forums feels like at this point.

This "process" must not be done at all.

It is pretty much taken for granted the developers are handling the law side of things.
The original developers buy the modder's content and then give him a slice. From that point on, it is theirs with credit given as a formality to the original creator.

After all, you took the original material, added and modified it and then wanted to get paid for it. You would have to be delusional to think you have good cards in that business transaction.

OP is a fag

>community driven effort.
Sounds awfully communist.

They're not a community driven effort since only a very small portion of the community participates.

Furthermore, if one were to assume profits incentivizes advancements and the existence of profit based competition will spur growth and quality of said products, then it's not crazy to assume paid mods are not a bad idea.

You have to admit though, his "money drives the community" comment was so out of touch with modding you'd think he had never even heard the word mod before.

Paid mods are a stupid fuckin idea.

>See a follower that I really want for $2.50
>Need to install SkyUI, SKSE, FNIS, UNP Body, XP32MaximumSkeleton, ApachiiSkyHair, Eyes of Beauty, Better Females, and ECE to get her to work
>At $5 a pop that one follower costs more than an entire paid DLC

>communists drivel: The posts

You'd have a point if there were alternatives to free market. But it doesn't seem that there are. A non-democratic corporation driven by pfoits is the best thing.

Ayep.

This debacle opened such a can of worms which should be just left alone. The second the whole "paid mods" idea came to light, you got all fucking jews crawling from the woodworks defending it and people monetizating their mods left and right or only offering fixed/updated mods for a price, IE that "Midas Spell" dude who put pop-up ads in free version of his mod advertising the paid version.

>Sounds awfully communist.
Are you getting triggered by basic concpets?

>They're not a community driven effort since only a very small portion of the community participates.
And it's still a community, you retard.

>the existence of profit based competition will spur growth and quality of said products, then it's not crazy to assume paid mods are not a bad idea
Yeah, because the overall quality of videogames has increased, right?

>It is pretty much taken for granted the developers are handling the law side of things.
Except they didn't. Valve and Bethesda didn't take care of shit while fuckers were stealing mods from anyone they could get their hands on. Even the retards who wanted to sell their own mods conveniently forgot all those other mods they relied on not having licenses that allowed commercial exploitation. Or just didn't ask permissions when licence wasn't specified.

Money does drive community in CS:GO and Dota 2 which is his reference point.
Skyrim modding community is old fashioned in this aspect.

>check reddit's most downvoted posts
>find this

Because most of you idiots are poisoned by Marxist mentality. Fuck off, don't expect things to be free.

Here's your (You), faggot.

I am not talking about this attempt.
I am talking about a new way to do it which would be much more plausible to work.

It would turn into 3rd party DLCs, with all the usual bullshit attached.

>Mod creators will make their mods higher quality because they risk being outperformed by a competitor.
no they wont, eat my cock, you know this is fucking wrong

Oh look, an idiot who's unable to argue.

Most of you retards in this thread are caught in this trap. The only way for you to argue against paid mods is to argue against capitalism. You'll know you'd have to argue against positions you hold to be true. I bet most of you are also hypocritical Trump fans.

So are you legitimately brain dead or do you just pretend to for the government handouts?

>They're not a community driven effort since only a very small portion of the community participates.
The mod making community is the fucking community you mongoloid.

>Furthermore, if one were to assume profits incentivizes advancements and the existence of profit based competition will spur growth and quality of said products, then it's not crazy to assume paid mods are not a bad idea.
It also incentives nickle and diming. For every person that works harder to make a better product so it will sell more there will be 10, 20, 100 people who just make a copy of the same think to get some easy bucks in return. Like the smartphone app stores.

CS:GO is one of the most poorly regarded cesspits of a community in all of vidya, and is now under fucking criminal investigation. If that was his reference point he deserves everything he got.

The whole thing was just so bad. I honestly can't fathom what went on in Gabe's head as he wrote all of that.

>paying money to give the illusion that a shitty game is good

No need to argue when it's already been peoven that your idea is fucking retarded and full of stolen shit. Get fucked.

Modder here. I make mods be cause I want to, and I don't feel the slightest need to get money out of it, because I do it for fun.

Unlike your useless furry autismbux ass, I have an actual job. Videogames and modding are for entertainment.

Paid mods would only work if Bethesda actually curates what is being sold and sells mods that are substantial enough to be elevated to DLC like Wheels of Lull, Enderal, Project Brazil, Autumn Leaves, Nehrim etc.

Paying for shitty trinkets like the broken, unpolished mods that were beings old on Steam Workshop is has shitty value and were even worse than the average DLC practices since paid mods because atleast DLC is guaranteed to work.

The fucking free market said no to paid mods by having the profits of paid mods being dwarfed by the costs of PR, HR and so forth dealing with the consumer base with paid mods. Paid mods is literally New Coke where the consumer spat it right back in the company's face.

my response to paid modding is:

it will ruin the steam workshop, with click-bait aimed at your wallet. Kinda like YouTube but worse.

>Are you getting triggered by basic concpets?
Getting triggered is something you idiots do.

>And it's still a community
Nope. It stops being a community when it's a minority. Especially one that asks for donations for what they do.

>Yeah, because the overall quality of videogames has increased,

Yes.

You "might" be right about its being a good idea, but you forgot that mods came free and you can't change that.

So unless you can change the history of mod, your idea is objectively

I'm a moralfag who buys all his games, but I promise if paid mods become a mainstream thing I'm pirating them all. Not because I don't think the mod makers deserve credit, but because so many of them are so prone to drama and childish outbursts that I don't want to pay $5 for something that the author could decide to randomly pull from the store one day over petty shit.

Developers and publishers can be held accountable for their actions. Indie mod devs not so much. It's why so many of them are accepting Patreon and other donations, because they want all the money for copying a few files with none of the responsibility that comes from being a true seller.

Kill yourself you fucking money-whore retard.
>Inb4 you call me a "communist"

>Americans think being nickeled and dimed like a gentile sucker equates to being a high society capitalist
>using buzzwords like commie and hippie against genuine criticism
>seem to think the map of the world consists of america with 'Here be Dragons' all around it

There are many reasons why paid mods are a retarded idea, I dread to think what would have happened to DooM modding if that had turned in to a kikefest.

Man I sure do love to suck corporate cock. Just last week I 'donated' 300 dollars to valve for some skins.

>Sounds awfully communist.
Welcome to the internet, the most communist part of everyone's daily lives.

>Furthermore, if one were to assume profits incentivizes advancements and the existence of profit based competition will spur growth and quality of said products, then it's not crazy to assume paid mods are not a bad idea.
Good thing we don't have to assume and we saw the results during the paid mods debacle, your assumption is false.

>Nope. It stops being a community when it's a minority. Especially one that asks for donations for what they do.
Good thing donations aren't the goal but an extra for modding.

So your plan relies on having dev studios hire massive legal departments who take care of every shitty mod someone wants to sell? Jesus you're more delusional than I thought.

CSGO and Dota 2 monetization systems are literal cancer which led to the cancerous communities around them.

People already accepted it, just check CS:GO skins or League of Legends skins.

Mods make the most money nowadays.

Or people will flood the already flooded Workshop with stolen mods to make money.

economics is a horrible social science as it is
don't try to lop that shit with something people do in their spare time

/thread

>Getting triggered is something you idiots do.
Implying you've ever seen an actual communist to begin with even.

>It stops being a community when it's a minority.
What?

>Especially one that asks for donations for what they do.
Some do, some don't. How does that affect it being a community driven effort exactly?

>Yes.
Jesus, you're retarded.

>Only 300

BAD GOY, DON'T YOU REMEMBER THE SIX THOUSAND GORILLION. YOU BETTER BUY ANOTHER $2000 WORTH OF KEYS TO ATTEMPT TO GET A PRISTINE DRAGONLORE

>do you just pretend to for the government handouts?
You're retarded. The one asking for free stuff here is you.

Everything should be up for profit.

>The mod making community is the fucking community
Circular fallacy.

>It also incentives nickle and diming. For every person that works harder to make a better product so it will sell more there will be 10, 20, 100 people who just make a copy of the same think to get some easy bucks in return.

You're not making a counter argument. I didn't claim capitalism is perfect. It's just the best system.

You have to show why socialism is better. Protip: You can't because you're either too retarded or the fact that socialism is bullshit.

>For every person that works harder to make a better product so it will sell more there will be 10, 20, 100 people who just make a copy of the same think to get some easy bucks in return.

And the product that's far better will stnad out more. Also the product that has better marketing will also stand out.

>Paid mods are not a bad idea.

No. There won't be anything better just because you have to pay, just look at all the shovelware and shitty sim games already there (which cost money as well). Mods will be no different, you'll still get shitty mlp futa gay space pirate garbage even if it's paid.

>When money enters the mod equation, the competition increases.
No

Just like IN EVERY SINGLE MARKET OF ALL HISTORY, marketing and luck will determine which mods sell well, so quality will decrease, while promotion and drama stories about mod developers will increase thousands of times.

it will in no way devolve into jewing and scamming, the invisible hand of mods will make everything better

>skyrim is shit
>internet tells me to mod it
>get too many mods to count
>game now looks good but is still a boring piece of shit

Yeah not paying for that experience especially if you need to buy a hundred fucking mods

>GENEROUS 25%
>which you will never see because your mod will never ever sell enough

Capitalism has been proven to work, dumbass. At the expense of some, sure.

Not every modder thinks like you. And no one is forcing you to monetize your shit. But you cannot stop others from doing so, that's tyrannical.

>Welcome to the internet, the most communist part of everyone's daily lives.
Actually the internet is monetized and many sites are private and not community run. There's a site admin that calls the shots.

>Good thing we don't have to assume and we saw the results during the paid mods debacle

It wasn't even allowed to exist for long. Things don't become magically better in the span of days or weeks.

>Good thing donations aren't the goal

That's an irrelevant distinction. A private company could say their profits aren't the goal, that doesn't make their company public. Unless it does certain things under regulations that will deem it so, then it is public or non-profit.

just put in a donate button for fucks sake

I feel like these posts are samefagging. They way they "assists" each other just seems like they're from the same person.

>he doesn't samefag long arguments on Cred Forums

>Circular fallacy.
What. I claimed that the mod making community is well, a community driven effort. Then you said the mod making community is in fact, a small part of the mod making community, which makes no god damn sense.

>You're not making a counter argument
Take a look at the app store. There is my damn argument. It clearly shows that money has nothing to do with quality, and that it even has the opposite effects.

>You have to show why socialism is better.
And you have yet to show why paid mods is better.
>And the product that's far better will stnad out more.
That is clearly not the case.
>Also the product that has better marketing will also stand out.
And that is a terrible thing.

>Capitalism has been proven to work
Capitalism does not work. It just lasts. If it worked, there would be no elites and 80% of the world's population wouldn't be poor. You're a fucking corporate drone.

Also, a good mod stems from the desire to create something you want, not the desire to create a product to sell. Modding is not a fucking market, now fuck off.

Free market means everyone can sell if they wish to. It doesn't mean a socialist uprising filled of your SJW-esque retards whining for tyranny to be put in place.


I'll spell it out for you:

Freedom = good

Tyranny of the majority (or in this case vocal minority)= bad.

Wealth is good. The only people against it are the incapable who base their worldview on resentment.

I have seen some and they make the same retarded arguments as you.

>What?
Learn to read.

>How does that affect it being a community driven effort exactly?
By that assumption, Valve and other private companies are a community as well. Thus your use of the word community is meaningless.

>you're retarded.
Says the dumfuck with no cognition that's unable to make a coherent argument. No logic in your posts whatsoever.

Could be Arthmoor given that he's still butthurt about people rejecting paid mods and he's an autistic NEET that lives off autismbux despite being hating people who live off welfare.

How paid mods should have worked:
>Hey man, here's Falksaar. If you like it a lot and want to see more, consider donating and I'll make a mod that's even better than this one.
>I made some dumb sword skin, here it is for free.

How paid mods actually were:
>Pay five dollars for these weapon skins
>Pay me for my mod even though I use shit from unpaid mods
>Hey, I want to give my mod away for free, but I can't because it requires mods that cost money for it to work.

If Valve kept this in the over for another year they could have brought modding to an even higher point, with everybody getting way better mods because these creators got one time donations/steady income from people, like a Patreon for modders. Instead we got OP's picture.

Paid mods are a terrible idea.

First of all, the workshop will get absolutely SWAMPED in shitty cashgrab mods. 1% of mod makers will make 99% of the revenue. Look at any app store for proof.
It's a clusterfuck of dependencies. Oh, you want to use mod X? Well, you're also gonna have to buy mod Y!
Hey, mod Z contains stuff from mod W, but the creator of mod W is not getting a share! Is the creator of mod Z stealing revenue?
It's a shitfest.

The three first posts are just an argument between two people, how is that samefagging?

Paid mods stop being mods when monetary incentives are offered.

Mods, by definition, is creative content created by fans for fans. It's created with autistic passion and love for a game, and that disappears when you introduce money into the equation.

>your mod starts to sell okay
>really excited
>Kign.com's modding division copies it and makes a shitty version of it and steals all your sales because they have the bigger market share and your mod is now buried between knockoffs and paid promoted content

Thanks Gaben.

>muh freedoms
>muh resentment

>Valve tries to sell paid mods
>Consumer base says no and doesn't buy paid mods
>Consumer base protests paid mods since first ammendment
>Profits are less than costs, Valve axes it due to a mix of low profits and high costs in maintenance and public image

Also you forgot the fact that the consumer base is a driving factor of the free market, nice job retard. I bet you also think consumers are communists for hating New Coke.

Officially supported paid mods are a terrible idea. If someone had a mod and wanted to charge for it on their own, that is fine. I'm not sure about the legality of it and it would be pirated to hell and back, but I wouldn't have a problem with it.

Poor bait, but the honest truth is that paid mods are a terrible idea because of numerous reasons. Quality isn't even a guarantee because they can become broken due to updates or conflicts with other mods and no real reason for a modder to keep updating vs making new mods. Not to mention that modders in general tend to be massive thin skinned babies who will take their stuff down if they feel slighted in the slightest, or purposely make their mods incompatible.

Secondly, free mods simply work better due to the reasons paid mods don't work. Modders can freely share content and work between one another. A lot of the modding community requires that for mods to even exist sometimes. With some modders giving their work over to someone else to finish/keep updated, or simply sharing tutorials on how to make certain content instead of hording it all to themselves. Not to mention the fact that mod packs wouldn't exist at all under a paid platform.

To touch upon something else, if people were to pay for every mod, even only a dollar a piece, mods would cost several times the value of a game. Especially in regards to stuff like Bethesda games.

>libertarians

youtube.com/watch?v=U2Nad1b_3yY

>Ignorant American: the post

I bet you think your democratic proceedings are real too.

A donation based system is best.
>pay what you think is fair for it if you want to
>no need to worry if you wasted money if the mod doesn't work
>allows for creators to share their designs and create intergrated mods
>don't have to pay Valve or Bethseda a dime
Free market =/ good
Market with regulations and oversight = good

It's circular fallacy because your conclusion of your argument is essentially exactly what your premise is.

en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Circular_reasoning

>Take a look at the app store.

This is a bad example. For one you're comparing apps for mobiles to video games. Games made on mobiles are restricted by how the hardware is (in this case no controller). You can't judge the quality of an inferior platform (the mobile phone) to a superior one (console or PC).

>And you have yet to show why paid mods is better.
I have. Go back and read the argument regarding things that are profit based. You cannot argue against it unless you argue against capitalism.

>That is clearly not the case.
It's the case in every market. In the case with Steam games. Best games (especially new ones) are the top sellers usually. Look at Dark Souls 3 when it came out and Witcher 3.

>And that is a terrible thing.
If they're all copies and one copy stands out, it saves the consumer time and money and they can just pick one of those copies.

Shut the fuck up, Gabe, and go fuck yourself.

>I have seen some and they make the same retarded arguments as you.
0/10

>No logic in your posts whatsoever.
Oh the ironing. You dumb nigger, go educate yourself.

It's only a good idea when it's heavily regulated. Otherwise there will be too many people posting stolen shit, or broken shit, or bullshit like golden forks. At that point, I doubt Steam would want to take part in it, considering they're hardly regulating the normal store.

>CSGO and Dota 2 monetization systems are literal cancer
Freeware (as in free beer) is now cancer?

If I had to pay for a mod I was expecting it to deliver on everything and be perfectly stable with no conflicts

Since it's free I don't give a shit, if it works it works but when I gotta pay, that mod better damn work right immediately and forever.

>don't have to pay Valve or Bethseda a dime
and that is EXACTLY why Gabe Newton is trying to hamfist paid mods into the scene.
Because they're not making ENOUGH money.

>f it worked, there would be no elites
Elites are not a bad thing. The fact that there are elites is a good thing.

>80% of the world's population wouldn't be poor.
They're poor because most of them don't live under free market system. In many African countries for example, the state controls much.

Also most of the world being poor isn't necessarily the fault of capitalism because culture, war and perhaps race issues are the cause for some of their misery. This isn't the fault of capitalism.

Also extreme world poverty has been reduced by 40% in the last 20 years thanks to more capitalism and free trade.

>Actually the internet is monetized and many sites are private and not community run. There's a site admin that calls the shots.
Ask the average person what webpages he visits and ask them then how much they pay for access to these pages. I think you'll find most people don't pay jackshit for any of the regular shite they do like e-mail, youtube, facebook, etc. They're commercial companies who run these sites but they don't get actual direct payments from their visitors. That's just the typical popular shite, forums and imageboards like exactly this one are massive communities that pay literally zero for discussions. Sure there are admins/moderators but that doesn't bring down the idea of these being community led entities. You can have a million websites you're the admin of but having no people visit them gives you zero community. This fallacy of community run only meaning anarchist non-hierarchical structure is so stupidly narrow it could only come from a shitposting cunt like yourself.

Of course all this stems from the already pedantic interpretation of the statement "the most communist". Truly only a fool would understand that as "it is communist in its entirety".

>It wasn't even allowed to exist for long. Things don't become magically better in the span of days or weeks.
Because it was so horrendously broken it could never go anywhere but downwards.

>That's an irrelevant distinction.
So mods being literally non-profit is irrelevant because you decide it is? Circular logic at its finest, which you accused someone else off earlier as well.

>Played that game for a bit when it first came out
>Stopped playing when I noticed that you had to pay to play more and never picked it back up because I'm not a fucking retard
If people weren't retards then the market would fix itself but unfortunately the video game industry seems to have a lot of retards in it.

surprised this thread is still up

>Free market =/ good
>Market with regulations and oversight = good
But donation is more free market than mods prices controlled by valve

yeah, no. Just look at the Xbone's fallout mod scene. its not even paid mods and it shows pretty well what the mod scene does. They just rip other peoples mods, call them their own, and some even have patron pages for mods they stole from PC.

Now imagine having to make a mod, but someone else doesn't want to do anything so they just blatantly copy and paste YOUR mod and charge a buck less. Some other guy is making the money you were "supposed to get".

Also the reason everyone was in an uproar over skyrim paid mods was because bethedsa and steam wanted to take like 75%+ of the money made off the mods.

stop falseflagging trollpicker

>retard bitches about freedom and then says that elites are good
>retard thinks free market is capitalist specific
>retard thinks full on capitalism is good or even would work, ever, just like regular capitalism
kek

your birth was a terrible idea

Reddit hates paid mods so True Cred Forums TM has to love paid mods.

>Elites are not a bad thing.

>They're poor because most of them don't live under free market system. In many African countries for example, the state controls much.
Explain the non-commie countries of South America, then.

>Also extreme world poverty has been reduced by 40% in the last 20 years thanks to more capitalism and free trade.
World poverty has been reduced thanks to international aid first and foremost, not trade.

I was talking more about how valve didn't have any oversight to their paid mods. A non-regulated market is one that will fail.

This man is clearly trolling

Spotted the statist socialist.

>first ammendment
Doesn't apply to private companies.

>the fact that the consumer base is a driving factor of the free market,

A vocal minority is not representative of most of the consumer base. People wouldn't have mind.

Also free market is based on the Non agression principle and the drive for profit. That's the things it needs to exist. For the government and socialist scum like you to fuck off and let people trade. Now if someone wants to buy a mod or go for the free one is their choice. But you cannot demand the platform (or in the case of a country the whole land) to not have people sell there.

You're essentially doing what anarchist communsits do, which is demand that no one should be able to sell based on PRIVATE property.

Not an argument.

>Stupidity: The post

Go pick up your free government handouts, you retard. Also, the nigger here is you, for you fail to understand what made white nations great (besides the race of course).

>Gabe "i care about money, not the consumer" Newell

yeah totally let's turn modding into a business instead of a hobby

...

>Boy I love freedom, free market, liberate everything!
>Elites are not a bad thing. The fact that there are elites is a good thing.
Yeah ok fuck off, you're either deeply retarded or just shitposting which is almost as deeply retarded.

>Nuh-uh: The post
I can do it too, fucko.

Don't you know? Everything gets better when it's primarily about profit instead of about passion.

It wasn't an argument. It was a correction/clarification since I don't think you understand what I was saying.
>This is a bad example.
No it isn't.
>For one you're comparing apps for mobiles to video games.
There are video games on mobiles you know.
>ames made on mobiles are restricted by how the hardware is (in this case no controller).
Cell phones have controller support, and pretty extensive hardware support in general.
>You can't judge the quality of an inferior platform (the mobile phone) to a superior one (console or PC).
Yes I can.
>I have. Go back and read the argument regarding things that are profit based.
So then where is the quality content overshadowed by a mountain of shit?
And right now two early access games, COD, a unreleased game, and two DLC's, and a few old games are the best sellers.

Clearly Steam is teaming with quality content.

>If they're all copies and one copy stands out, it saves the consumer time and money and they can just pick one of those copies.
I will remember that the next time the marketing is clearly lying and overshadow actual great content because they couldn't afford to shell out 200 million on TV ads and billboards.

>Go pick up your free government handouts, you retard.
Ok, this is just funny. You clearly don't know shit about economics. Go read about capitalist welfare, you dumb nigger.
>for you fail to understand what made white nations great
The fact that most of them are socialist first and only then capitalist? Kill yourself, clapburger.

Is that why most of the best countries in which to live in the world have some sort of social welfare programs?

Wrong. There's no one to hold them to account. You think early release is a good thing?

Oh boy, are we back on this? Enough time has passed and Steam is gonna try to push this shit again?

>Paid mods are not a bad idea.
Yes they are.

Mods are community endeavours; paid mods shit all over that idea.

>People wouldn't have mind.
But they minded so much Valve was forced to scrap the whole idea.

That is capitalism. The idea wasn't profitable, so they shafted it.

...

>redditspacing

amerimutts are pretty much subhuman

You are incredibly naive. You'll be getting $5 t-shirt mods instead. In entertainment.competition is irrelevant. The problem with modern gaming is the big budget. Modders like to mod games because that's they want to and because other people like stuff. Once you factor money into that modding is over.

please PLEASE stop responding

Forgot to reply, see the top of this post.Elites aren't bad. You have no argument there. Unless you argue with a slave morality in where you deem the strong to be evil because you resent their success since you are too pathetic to achieve it.

>free market is capitalist specific

It is.

>full on capitalism is good or even would work, ever, just like regular capitalism
History as shown that it's the best economic system.

Like a retard, you're unable to make any valid argument.

>Elites are not a bad thing.

Stop being so resentful over people who are better than you.

>Explain the non-commie countries of South America,
They were commies for fucking almost half of the 20th century.

>World poverty has been reduced thanks to international aid first and foremost, not trade.
That's a myth. International aid has been very small. It's due to the fact that many of the extreme poor salary has increased. Sure it's gone for 1$ an hour to 2$ an hour but that made a lot of difference.

Like a nigger you defend handouts. It's no surprise.

Get a job, Tyrone. And no, stealing is not valid work...

>The fact that most of them are socialist first and only then capitalist?

White nations were capitalists during the 19th century and the beginning of it. In fact, capitalism led to the industrialization age, which came not long after.
Today they are having problems because of they incoporate some socialism.

>It is.
Ok, I give up, you're just blatantly shitposting now, either that or you're so retarded that you're trying to talk about economics without even having any basic knowledge about them or their history.

>Paid mods are a terrible idea.
This it's just going to attract the vultures who are going to shove 1$ weapon skins down everyone's throat.

Are you seriously defending elites?

Do you have any idea how the world works? Very few people get rich with honest work alone. How fucking old are you?

The exact opposite would happen. You will get tons of people stealing each others work and flooding the market with identical mods. Giving the users a tougher time on finding who to give their money to.

>Furthermore, if one were to assume profits incentivizes advancements and the existence of profit based competition will spur growth and quality of said products, then it's not crazy to assume paid mods are not a bad idea.
In other words: "If we assume I'm right, then I'm right."

Not exactly a brilliant argument.

Different user here, can anyone explain in what context you can have a non-capitalist free market? I thought that a free market was a fundamental principle of capitalism, I can't see how it couldn't be. I'm here to learn and I'm not the smartest or most knowledgeable individual so I'm interested in expanding my understanding.

>People wouldn't have mind.

They minded enough that it was unprofitable even when marketed on a large open platform and costs enough money in its implementation to not be considered profitable.

And you still haven't addressed my point, do you think the American consumer base who rejected New Coke are "government and socialist scum" who should "fuck off and let people trade"?

that hasnt happened in any game that has paid mods.

You mean when people stole monster mounts and Garry's Real Mares and tried to sell them on Steam?

You're confusing cause and effect. The incorporated those welfare programs after capitalism, not before it.

If they had started with social welfare programs from the start, most of those countries would fail.

It's despite the social welfare program that they do well, not because of it. Most of their recent history hasn't been socialism but capitalism.

A vocal minority minded it.

Anyway an example of the consumer base not wanting it, would have been for Valve to have paid mods, but most people would simply not buy any and the profits would be very low.

Of course that assumes modders can't steal stuff from others, and that's the biggest issue with Valve paid mod policy. It wasn't the fact that it's paid, it's other problems.


Nah it was a fallacious argument. You didn't even define any terms either, so you can't claim you were doing a clarification.

You don't even know simple words, that's sad.

>No it isn't.
Yes it is. I've explained why, unless you can show otherwise, your example is bad.

>Cell phones have controller support, and pretty extensive hardware support in general.
The games on mobile aren't made with that in mind as a primary use. The primary use is for touch screen controls, which is inferior to what PC and console primarily offers.

Again, you made no valid argument.

>And right now
Cherrypicking.

>marketing is clearly lying
The consumer should be informed

>As explained above, for classical economists such as Adam Smith the term "free market" does not necessarily refer to a market free from government interference, but rather free from all forms of economic privilege, monopolies, and artificial scarcities.
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Free_market

>Money does drive community in CS:GO and Dota 2 which is his reference point.
And all the mods for those games are cosmetic shit. For all of Skyrim's faults, the mods for them are actually substantial. People add new gameplay and enemies, overhaul the perks, and even add entirely new quests and locations. It's not just hats and shit.

>Oh look, an idiot who's unable to argue.
Says the guy who responds to any arguments against his position with "That's communist and therefore bad."

Why cant they get it through their thick heads.

People buy skyrim becuase of the mods.
They're getting sales becuase of this.

Here's an alternative way for how paid mods could work:

>Hey [modder] it's [dev team]. We saw your mod and want to make it an official part of the game as purchaseable DLC so we're going to work with you to bring it up to professional standards and iron out any possible bugs, crashes or conflict issues that plague regular mods to make it something that's actually worth money.

modding and video game development are literally the same fucking thing. you aren't going to get better games by not having people work full time on it.

There is no fucking free market economics that isn't capitalist you retard. I don't have to explain your stupidity anyway, you should be able to show how the fuck something non-free and non-private can suddenly be seen as free market. That's an untenable position anyway.
There aren't, he's a retard who's trying to make whatever he's argue for seem capitalist so it doesn't seem ad.

There's been lots of works on free markets after Adam Smith. Free market is understood better.

>The fucking free market said no to paid mods by having the profits of paid mods being dwarfed by the costs of PR, HR and so forth dealing with the consumer base with paid mods. Paid mods is literally New Coke where the consumer spat it right back in the company's face.
When people say "I support the free market", what they really mean is "I support corporations fucking everyone in the ass." They never like it when "The market has spoken!" means "Consumers fought back and won."

>Paid mods are not a bad idea.
yes, yes they are.

Skimmed the whole page, still not sure on how any theoretical free market can be described as 'non-capitalist,' but thank you for helping, I appreciate it. I'm probably just dumb, I apologise.

>capitalism led to the industrialization age
It's funny because it was the government trying to crack down hard to reduce cheap foreign imports that led to a lot of the early technological development that allowed the revolution to happen.

>Being this fucking retarded
You should shoot yourself.

you get a lifetime ban for infringing IP on steam. which is way better than most marketplaces.

Paid mods are stupid, modders do it for recognition and to maybe get noticed by the industry.(Valve has hired modders before)
That should be enough

Not entirely incorrect, but the people who otherwise provide high quality content for free, will now no longer offer that content for free. this means things like unofficial patches will no longer be free. This means stuff like BOSS and SKSE will no longer be free. It means copyright law enters the equation and you see people fucking suing each other over bits of code that are based largely in a product that neither of them own because they decided to make their livelihood shitting out slutwear and higher resolution raindrops their livelihood.

It will happen, it started to happen in the week or two we had in that test period.

It's not worth it for the companies, no matter how much it may seem like it is.

But user, if I don't help companies continue to fuck people, the system won't be in place for me to fuck people when I inevitably become a billionaire CEO any day now!

better start paying for all these doom wads i play

that's too sad, I'd love to post my arguments here, but it's probably a copypasta and all the thread is only made of trolls throwing things at each other

>Very few people get rich with honest work alone.
That's bullshit. This claim requires great evidence which you can't even produce.

>Are you seriously defending elites?
There's nothing wrong with being an elite you feeble minded resentful pleb.

Sure some don't have much honor, and so do a lot of the poor. For one the poor are very prone to violent crime, and their poverty shouldn't be an excuse.

A vocal minority minded and throw a sissy fit about it. That's not the whole consumer base.

I'll take it that you ignoring the argument that free market is based on non-agresion and letting others sell if they wish to is you conceding to the argument.

Also the New Coke example is a false equivalency.

i hope you don't support the concept of minimum wage.

OP is a libertarian faggot who doesn't understand human nature.

>You have to show why socialism is better.
It's better because when people's basic needs are taken care of and they don't have to worry about it, it frees up their minds to do other things, like be creative. It's not a coincidence that most of the great advancements in human history were made by people who had time to sit around and invent stuff because they didn't have to spend all their time just working to survive.

someone sold something that means no one in the history of the universe can ever give it away for free

i understand human nature quite well. retards will accept paid mods as long as you never use the words "paid mods" but get triggered like a SJW if you do.

It destroys mod communities and opens a can of worms regarding legal ownership of shit. For example, lets say Modder A decides to make a new paid mod. Modder B buys the mod, then implements stuff of his own and releases his own enhanced and better version of the mod free of charge. Modder A can either make a dispute about it which is going to divide the modderbase, or shrug it off and accept the fact he's losing money because of another modder.

That was a correlation but not a causation. Capitalism is the cause of industrialization, also the wealth as a result of some of the European powers colonialism as well but mostly thanks to capitalism.

It's a short article.
The basic idea is that within the current monopoly trying to have anything that's not within the comfort zone of those who control the majority of the market isn't possible.
Look at the proposition by Jaroslav Vanek.

>A vocal minority minded it.
Vocal enough to make Steam lose money and good will leading to smaller profits.

You can't be pro-capitalism and then start crying because capitalism showed that it wasn't a profitable venture.
> but most people would simply not buy any and the profits would be very low.
It was. Gabe said it himself, they made around 10.000 bucks in revenue, but wasted around 1 million.

I guess living in a place where there's consumer protection laws must be an alien enough concept to be considered living in a communist shithole by some people.

>1% of mod makers will make 99% of the revenue.
"Free market" types consider this a feature, not a bug.

that same argument applies regardless of whether money is involved or not. most *mod communities* don't have any respect for IP or rule of law which is why no one pushes the issue.

>If someone had a mod and wanted to charge for it on their own, that is fine. I'm not sure about the legality of it
It would be entirely illegal. They're free to accept donations, but they can't actually sell the mod directly.

>When money enters the mod equation, the competition increases. Mod creators will make their mods higher quality because they risk being outperformed by a competitor

we're not talking about multi-million dollar corporations and expensive products, you retard. there's no guarantee that paying for mods will result in better quality because modding is not something that requires investment to begin with, it's not engineering, it's modeling, coding, art and design. it relies a lot more on the talent of the modder and money won't magically improve their skills. if anything it'll make them rush it and make sloppy shit so they can cash in

That wasn't the argument. I said that the reponses that OP is getting are unfounded especially when many of you supposedly hold capitalism to be good.

Of course if you don't believe in capitalism to begin with, then this argument doesn't affect you.

Yes they were vocal like how many SJWs and feminists have been vocal and gotten Western governments to do many things they wanted. But you sure wouldn't say that was the will of the majority.

It's unfortunate that the majority is silent.

>because capitalism showed that it wasn't a profitable venture.
False. The experiement wasn't even allowed to run for long for it to even show the results.

>Gabe said it himself, they made around 10.000 bucks in revenue, but wasted around 1 million.
If that claim is true, this could be due to the fact about how it was run not proof that there's something inherently wrong about paid mods.

Anyway, one big problem of your argument that you're shying away from is that you fail to admit that there are problems with Valve paid mod policy that aren't about the mods being paid. For example, the fact that people were stealing mods and claiming them to be their own.

If the paid mod policy was better implement, then there wouldn't be as big of a loss in revenue or perhaps no loss at all in the long run.

But thats the thing, because nobody really owns anything, its an unwritten rule that you can just take someone's mod and make it better if you want. When money gets involved in the mix, suddenly modders start thinking they have ownerships on their own mods and that other modders cant use their mods anymore. That is what is going to cause the divide.

Everything gets complex the instant money gets introduced to the mix.

You already did with Final Doom.

/thread

That armor looks sweet
Better than what Bethesda could do

>/r/latestagecapitalism awaits your return
Oh look a redditor. No wonder your opinions are shit.

you can't accept donations either. its often an approach when people try to get around government laws or get around a civil contract, doesn't hold up if you are actually brought to court over it.

>it frees up their minds to do other things
Like stay on their asses and not work. Gotcha.

>be creative.
Oh please. Only a very small portion of the population will be creative. The cfreators in society have always been a very small minority.

If anything welfare would be a result of assessment based the potential of creativity of individuals. But of course that's too much thought process for socialists to handle with their myth of equality.

>It's not a coincidence that most of the great advancements in human history were made by people who had time to sit around and invent stuff because they didn't have to spend all their time just working to survive.


True and a lot of them had slaves.

I would pay for endreal. It's worth at least 3 times as much as skyrim to me.

>yeah, no. Just look at the Xbone's fallout mod scene. its not even paid mods and it shows pretty well what the mod scene does. They just rip other peoples mods, call them their own, and some even have patron pages for mods they stole from PC.
Not to mention the people who steal mods that are literally impossible to use on consoles, and then step back and let the actual creator take the backlash when they don't work.

yes you do actually own stuff. any original content you make you own. you are confusing modders with asset kiddies who just rip shit from one game and port it to another.

Too bad it was clipping as fuck

Anyway got to go, I've argue for long enough.

Capitalism will always win in the end! Even if it socialism were to replace it for the next 2 centuries, it will come stronger.

The mighty will always win.

>This claim requires great evidence which you can't even produce.
And your claim that elites are not a bad thing also require a great evidence. Where is it?

>For one the poor are very prone to violent crime, and their poverty shouldn't be an excuse.
Because their poverty is a result of lack of good paying jobs to go around. If capitalism worked, it would've fixed this a long time ago, but it didn't.

tfw i bought master levels when it came out

I think that's the joke. That, or OP is genuinely retarded

Literally looks like Reaper from OW before he even existed.

FUCK YOU ENTITLED FAGS FOR KILLING PAID MODS, I WAS GOING TO MAKE THOUSANDS OF DOLLARS WITH MY COOL MOD IDEA

NOW YOU WILL NEVER GET MY MODS

HAHAHAHA

FUCK YOU SOCIALIST SCUMBAG SJW KEKS

Cool non-argument.

Except the modder communities work their best when the modding scene is as freeform as possible. If modders cannot enhance each others mods anymore, that scene is going to die out.

And when that paid mod comes out, absolutely nothing will prevent another modder from just stealing that mod, adding some of his own, then to call it his own mod. And he can distribute that same mod for free or even charge money for it himself. Because as modders ownership rights go, they're pretty fucking flimsy to begin with since they dont own the game itself.

Like for example if Brutal Doom's animations get ripped off to another free Doom mod, and the creator of Brutal Doom would throw a bitch fit, he cant really take it into the court since he's working in the grey area of legality as well in the first place.

>deem the strong to be evil because you resent their success since you are too pathetic to achieve it
Or, you know, because you think it's wrong for the powerful to exploit the powerless, because you're, you know, a decent human being.

>Free mods can only get better by larger passion, which is crap shoot as a resource

Passion is the only reason modders make mods instead of games, and the only reason people share resources and work together. Niggers like you ruin everything

>he cant really take it into the court since he's working in the grey area of legality as well in the first place.
True, but he will have the support of the Doom community, thus limiting the reach of that other free mod with stolen assets.

>But you sure wouldn't say that was the will of the majority.
That is irrelevant. This isn't a democracy, it's capitalism. If it's not a profitable venture it's not a profitable venture.

>It's unfortunate that the majority is silent.
That's capitalism for you.

>The experiement wasn't even allowed to run for long for it to even show the results.
It's almost like customer relations and marketing is a vital part to running a businesses.

>If that claim is true, this could be due to the fact about how it was run not proof that there's something inherently wrong about paid mods.
And not even Valve, who are printing money thought it was worth the investment in trying to fix and instead canned it.
>If the paid mod policy was better implement
And policing that content isn't cheap, and the whole area is ripe with legal fees.

A large number of mobile games do this now, and MMOs do it for specific activities. It's a way to keep you drip fed and coming back for more every day instead of doing everything at once, getting burned out, and leaving before they can sell you a new expansion or whatever.

yeah paid mods is will just cause much, much, much more problems than it could possibly fix, nearly all modding communities have enough drama and shit going on in them at the moment and if you bring in money most modding communities will just collapse completely
Though on one hand paid mods could theoretically be good in cases like that enderal Total conversion mod for skyrim where the modders put a metric fuckton of effort into the mod, however in order for paid mods to work they would need some hugely strict standards for them.
Paid mods should be something that should have to be earn't on a case by case basis not something that anyone can shit out in 5 minutes and charge like $2 or more for

if you are making original content you have absolutely nothing to worry about. i don't know why you are having such a hard time comprehending that. modding is no different than regular video game development you are just starting with a base/ some dependencies. (which aside from a few projects practically every single game does)

>A vocal minority minded it.
Why are you okay with a rich minority pushing everyone else around, but not a vocal minority having an effect on something? Maybe that "vocal minority" are the "elites" you love so much, because they had the power to stop something against the will of the majority who supported it. You should be praising the people who brought down paid mods.

Gamers need to stop being so entitled, modders need payment for what they do in order to encourage better mods.

Similarly all mods should be brought to PS4 I'm so fucking furious that Bethesda wouldn't do it, I'm literally shaking and would pay $100+ just for a new PS4 that would have mod support for my favourite games like Bloodborne, Uncharted and Fallout 4 - PC retards need to stop being so damn entitled and share their content.

>Passion is the only reason modders make mods instead of games, and the only reason people share resources and work together. Niggers like you ruin everything

no you fucking retard. you are just shilling for free shit.

>they need to stop being entitled and give me what I want

I would add:
>And we only ask for a 20% cut of the profits. The rest of it is yours. And that's without any conditions or preset thresholds you have to meet before you get anything.

>if you are making original content you have absolutely nothing to worry about.

Yes you do. Just look at what happened to few fan projects when Nintendo decided to put a banhammer on them. Your content only works within a copyrighted content, so the actual owner of your mod is the game developer. He can choose to take down your mod if he so pleases. So far modding communities have been largely acting in good faith only. Its beneficial for the developer so most developers tolerate a modding scene.

But when those same modders start charging money for their mods without the game developers consent? Or when that good faith among modders is gone because they all start seeing dollar signs on their hobby? Thats when shit gets ugly and ultimately it is the game developer who has the final say. He can destroy the mod community instantly if he wants to.

the problems with how they did it are

>game with free mods already, paid mods mean people would lose access to their mods
>mod creators receive next to nothing, Valve sits on their asses doing literally nothing and take the largest cut
>Skyrim is a garbage game that requires mods to be fun, you're looking at $60+DLC+mods to fix the game

backlash probably wouldn't have been as big if they attempted to roll it out with new games. it doesn't help most mod creators are whiny nu-males who thought they were going to be able to live off of their shitty edgelord armor packs and called people being rightfully upset "entitled"

>PC retards need to stop being so damn entitled and share their content.

Are you this retarded that you blame PC users for something that Bethesda confirmed was Sony's fault?

This.

Valve taking their cut for distribution, fine.
Bethesda taking their cut by not doing anything else, not even properly fixing their games (remasturr), just getting infinite money and closing Nexusmods by the way because illegal competition.
Lazy and greedy. Same kind of modders who'll abuse the system.

>Yes you do. Just look at what happened to few fan projects when Nintendo decided to put a banhammer on them.

because they are retards that are infringing IP. it is really not that complicated.

Dumbass, mods are infringing it as well if the developer so chooses. Usually they dont do shit because mods are free and thus harmless. When you start charging money for it, you're infringing the IP and the original developer can take your shit down immediatly if they want to.

no. I am made tons of mods that are mine and not infringing. I have made my own scripts, new textures, new sounds, etc. my work is my own and the developer has no say in it.

Paid mods are a terrible idea.
A tip jar, however, would have been a better idea to try.

But can Valve and Bethesda make money from a tip jar?

Modding isn't a 'free market' you arseholes. It's basically the equivalent of volunteering for charity or any kind of community volunteering that goes on in the real world economy.

Paid mods are the equivalent of some idiot coming along and saying 'hey all volunteers should be paid for charity work'. It sounds noble and sensible but is a dumb idea that would cause shitloads of complications and totally fucks around with the fundamental basis of why people choose to engage in that voluntary activity in the first place

>A tip jar, however, would have been a better idea to try.

says the guy who wants free shit and/or wants someone else to pay for it

>The cfreators in society have always been a very small minority.
And they also happened to be part of the minority that didn't have to work just to survive. Again, not a coincidence.

>True and a lot of them had slaves.
Meaning they didn't have to work. Seems that you're making my point for me. The good thing is that our technology means we could now accomplish the same effect without enslaving people. Unless you were trying to make some kind of appeal to morality here, but that would be inconsistent with your "might/wealth makes right" philosophy.

Oh yeah, that will fly in court for sure.

>free content made by some random fans who love the game so much that they want to add something to it
>makes other people play the game even longer
>not free

you contrarians are so fucking dumb. can't wait until you'll claim that fanart should be paid too. holy shit.

>Modding isn't a 'free market' you arseholes. It's basically the equivalent of volunteering for charity or any kind of community volunteering that goes on in the real world economy.

no its not you fucking retard. you write your own code. you make your own model. you draw your own texture. you compose your own song. that shit is yours. has fuck all to do with volunteering, you have the same rights and privileges as any other person making creative works, regardless if they do it for a salary or as a hobby on the weekends.

why are you even arguing with me when you have no idea how video games or assets are even made ?

>Shilling for paid mods.

Tomorrow you'll pay to walk and breath, you are just fine with it.

I should pay to see your original post that I pass the time by reading. It's only fair.

Go start your own shitty indie studio then. That's been the pathway for decades for modders who think their crap is actually worth money.

Being a whining baby who doesn't have the balls to go the whole way, but just wants to get paid for piggy backing off actual developers is not an excuse

>capitalism will work!
Yeah by making sure a bunch of idiots buy shit mods instead of giving good ones attention like always, exerting no real demand for mods but allowing people to charge for their mediocre work

I agree that paid mods are not inherently a bad idea, but I do think that they need to go through some approval system from the game's publisher and/or the venue's owner (with Skyrim on Steam Workshop, this would be Bethesda and Valve, respectively).

I also think that there's room for both paid and free mods, with free mods giving you stuff you couldn't get approval to sell, with consumer reviews weeding out the bad free mods (e.g. mods made from stolen assets or which function badly) and praising the good free mods (and potentially encouraging free modders to try their hand at paid mods in the future).

>Teenagers who want to leech others hard work

>Mod creators will make their mods higher quality because they risk being outperformed by a competitor.

BECAUSE THAT HAPPENED WITH GAMES RIGHT?
THATS WHY WE HAVE ONLY SUPER-HIGH QUALITY GAMES NOW

REJOICE

>Paid mods are not a bad idea.
Yes, they are.
>Mod creators will make their mods higher quality
No, they won't. Let's analyse the mod in your screenshot, Shadow Scale Armour Set.
>Heavy armour is bad for sneaking, even though Shadowscales are assassins in the lore
>No inventory icon, so entire set appears in T-pose in your menu
>Cannot be worn by beast races or the mask will clip massively with their face
>Cannot remove mask because entire set is one piece, not modular so cannot mix and match
>Has no recipe at the forge, and does not appear in the game world, must be added with console commands
And this was the poster child for paid mods on Steam. Other paid mods included a new version of SkyUI, which made no improvements over the free version found on the Nexus, and a fishing mod which was just
>Click
>Cast power
>Fish added

this.

Except all the assets and shit you do rides by the name of the original IP you dumb fuck. Its rights are the equivalent to the rights of fanfiction. Generally tolerated as harmless community activity but ultimately the developers get the final say whether some mod is appropriate or not. Just like what happened with Nintendo and how they made sure the modders and developers doing the fan projects of Metroid and Pokemon could not distribute their projects further or Nintendo would sue their ass.

thats the thing you don't understand. it is going all the way because it is literally the same work. most projects even in a professional setting you come in, do your assigned work and leave the project essentially piggybacking as you call it.

Thats a good angry skeleton, I wanted to post with this

why are you arguing with me when you have no idea what you are talking about ?

Holy shit that's a terrible mod, I'm surprised they actually made that an example of paid mods.

I recently told my friend's kid that hiding inside his body is a skeleton, and when he goes to sleep the skeleton comes out of his mouth and goes exploring around the house and the neighbourhood.

His parents told me off a few days later for scaring the shit out of him and giving him nightmares.

Skeletons are great.

This is the crux of it. If people are paying money they expect something of quality. Mods are usually a bit rough around the edges at the best of times and often break with updates to the game or when used alongside other mods.

skeletons are reliable, I've been with one for 28 years and he never made the wrong move or anything

>When money enters the mod equation, the competition increases.
So true, I mean, look at the games industry in the past 10 years.

Skeletons are fucking great.

How good of an idea would it be to make it where games on steam that had a rating of mostly negative or higher were reviewed and possibly removed from the store?

All I know for 100% certain is I am not buying any game where mods cost money, I will pirate it, and I will pirate whatever mods I need, and I am saying this as someone with a physical copy of every bethesda game from daggerfall to fo4.
The only thing this accomplishes is push bethesda to make unfinished games so they can make more money off mods.
Modders need money too? I've modded tons of games and never got or wanted anything out of it.

If you want modders to have money then pay them yourself you fucking jews, you're the multibillion dollar company not me.

I dunno what I'd do without my skeleton tbqh, he's so great

The next thing I'm going to tell him is that his teeth are baby skeletons that will fall out of his mouth and grow into new skeletons.

Thats just plain quality control and honestly it should be done - retail stores stop stocking shit that nobody wants too.

But alas - Steam gets a cut from everything, so they'll keep on trying to sell that - everything. The wonders of having them listed not costing anything.

>stop buying things i dont like

I didn't think people were still racist to skeletons

>"paid mods aren't a bad idea"

>entire modding community flips out, people ripping eachother's mods left and right to make a quick buck, 99% of people who use mods are pissed because they're now paying for something free to fix a fundamentally broken game

>bethesda and valve revert the paid mods
>"but paid mods still aren't a bad idea"
CLEARLY THEY WERE A BAD IDEA OR EVERYBODY WOULDN'T HAVE BEEN PISSED

Paid mods will flop solely because you cannot introduce 3rd party DRM into a game and everyone will just fucking pirate it.

Skeletons are such subs. They do absolutely everything you want them to without question. You don't even need to tell them what you want. It's like they can read your mind.

Paid mods are a bad idea. Modders will keep creating new content if the like the game, money has no reason for them to do so.

Paid mods would succeed if there was a strict quality screening and if they worked like DLCs and were tested to ensure it didn't fuck with the game or steal shit without asking.

Thing is, Valve is the most jewish limpdick motherfuckers who can't even be bothered to pay volunteer translators for their free work. Valve doesn't want to spend a cent to actually encourage mod makers to create quality content, how do you think half the shit in CS/Dota even exists. All they want to do is take their 'cut' from user-made content and then make one patch for their games every 6 months and call it free content because they're your buds.

No first post not best post y'all completely overlooking the competition part that would be the bring so many new ideas to the market

All thinking is done inside skeletons

Really makes you think

>It's like they can read your mind.
Your mind is inside your skull. You are literally a prisoner of a skeleton. You can never escape, you are trapped forever.

Didn't Gaben try to justify paid mods by saying that money is the only reason any community that produces a product survives?

I don't know but I really hope you're not correct.

That wouldn't be a good idea. I have several games a lot of people think are bad, but I enjoy them nonetheless.

>Thats just plain quality control and honestly it should be done - retail stores stop stocking shit that nobody wants too.
But those games are still available via used copies or unsold new copies that are just sitting around, so if someone somewhere wants a copy even though lots of other people don't, they can still get it. Once a digitally-distributed game is removed, it becomes completely impossible to buy it in any form.

>someone actually gave Gabe a rebbit gold for his retardation

Yep, and he didn't expect to get shut the fuck down since it was on reddit which is the biggest fucking valvedrone headquarters, but he did.
But they went back to sucking valve's dick 2 days later and "scolding" all the people who "talked shit" to somebody as "important" as gabe.

also I googled a screenshot that has shitty font installed and from a cuck who censors curse words, shame on me

If you are charging money for them then you should no longer be calling them mods. Get a new term going for 'third party developed content' where the dev of that specific content is pocketing their own portion of the revenue.

>paid modding exists for console fo4
>2/3rds of the mods are stolen
>takes a month to prove you own a mod and to get it pulled
Yeah clearly paid modding isn't fucking stupid and has accomplished a lot for gaming.

>Once a digitally-distributed game is removed, it becomes completely impossible to buy it in any form.

Nobody forces them to sell through Steam, they can make it available wherever.

But really I'd only do that to the really, absolutely abysmally scoring shit, I mean stuff that seems more of a scam than a game really.

If Steam ever did this they'd be heavily attacked for "on what basis do they get to judge vidya" when they are just a store.

In truth if they cared for vidya they'd do it, but I'd say 10 years from now there'll be Steam users who never played a video game.

>-2365

>paid modding exists for console fo4

No it doesn't

Paid mods will never work for Bethesda games, which are inherently collaborative and almost all build upon each other.

>I'd say 10 years from now there'll be Steam users who never played a video game.
Then why will they be on Steam?

To stream anime

I think these kind of avenues will never be really explored, or atleast not yet, simply because it would push into light what we all already know - that $25 DLC pieces are being created in 4 hours of work, that doing 5 hue filters on a texture is not actually 5 new models worth $5 each but a 10 minute job for someone etc.

I think the big fucks would rather not expose this any more than it already is - if you start offering opportunities for anyone to start creating this pretty soon nobody accept that making that single new pose for your character is worth $20+

But you have to have your steam game tied to your account to upload stuff on Bethesda
And that's not paid modding either, and the only people who ended up getting mods stolen were literally who or cunts like ddproductions83

>Paid mods are not a bad idea.
Shitpost disregarded.
Don't bother softening the blow with this shit bethesda, paid modding will never fly, no matter how hard you try, go ahead and sell your HD skyrim and see how well it sells on pc.

Thats the point, for all the other crap they'll be housing by then.

Valve got everything they have from modding, all their succesful games were mods, bought mods, stolen mods, and from this success they built their empire.

When you sell out on the very thing that made you, its clear you don't actually give a shit about anything but money anymore. And the fact that they are stockpiling utter shit day by day, and are clearly going for all other media too is clearly showing a direction.

If they go public with the company at some point, I wouldn't be surprised if you'd be ordering physical shit from them down the line and them competing with amazon, lol.

You know what else is not a bad idea, OP?
You being a faggot.

Valve will turn into Netflix. At that point it all depends on the zeitgeist as to whether they prioritise vidya or TV/film.

I hope you're not serious. That was how this whole mess began.

I kind of think competing with netflix will be just a stepping stone.

It all depends how long they plan on keeping up the "skeleton team"-like system where their entire support team is like 2 guys running a few scripts to reject 4 month old tickets every few days.

Stop being such a fucking kike OP

I hope that everyone who wants paid mods is just baiting and shitposting.
If not I want off this wild ride.

>Kike

There's literally nothing wrong with being a jew

>People who do hard work shouldn't recieve payment
>I want everything for free
Bruh

no shit Sherlock

you think people don't know that? people don't want paid mods simply because they don't want to pay for them

Even the actual modders were against paid modding

Paid mods are tantamount to DLC. Developers would put less effort into a game or cut shit out completely to sell later through a mod.

I only buy Bethesda games because of the modding community. If they started charging for mods I would not buy them at all.

>be todd howard
>make shitty unfinished bethesda game
>community preorders it because its made by bethesda
>wait for modders to fix the game
>literally get paid for someone else to fix your game

>And no one is forcing you to monetize your shit

Except if people start charging for mods he will have to charge money as well. If he doesn't someone will download his free mod and steal it to sell for themselves.

nothing fucking works in this world

>capitalism
>consumer is a fucking retard and just buys shit that has shit quality, making the whole point of voting with money pointless
>commieland
>government has no competition
>No point in making good things
>people eat it up cause there's no alternative

THERE IS NO WINNING WHEN WILL YOU PEOPLE UNDERSTAND

it's crazy that gaben thought it would be a good idea to expose his inner jew for a second there

Please

But that's incorrect. In capitalism it makes sense to produce lower quality goods that will break, so that you can constantly push out new goods that are slightly better or need to be replaced because the old ones are broken, to keep constant production ongoing.

Its marketing.
People realized the easiest product the sell is one that doesn't really exist, hype.
And now they've turned it into a self-feeding system, turning consumers into retards who need validation, and teaching them that validation comes only through shallow means that always include constantly buying shit.

>Steam announced paid mods a year ago
>Massive backlash and they immediately cancelled it
>Try again this year
>EVeryone likes it now

wtf

I think he is externally all Jew at this point, user

that's not how it works
if people bought smart capitalism would work wonders

if the product breaks fast then don't go buy the same shit again like a retard, buy something else that preferably won't break. that's how capitalism should work but consumers are absolute retards, power to the people my ass, the people are a bunch of idiots

>The year our our lord 2025
>Paid mods have basically resulted in modmakers becoming the same greedy cunts that feel entitled to shit they aren't that your average patreon artis/comic maker (See Andrew Dobson and others)

>Lazy as fuck and make shitty mods, claim that mod making is hard and that you should feel grateful for their hard work.

>Still somehow rake in enough to go by and continue making shitty mods due to fat loners and ADHD diagnosed kids stealing their parents wallets and throwing money at the shitty mods.

>Bethesda releases The Fallout scrolls 14: Dragonfag

>No mods to remove the giant dragondildo your multigenderd demisexual Hero has sewn to his forehead

>BethsoftJewlaugh.mp3

>Todd wins again.

I'd rather just fucking die desu senpai.

I'm not even a game dev, pr, corporate shill but 20% is fuck all. If anything it should be 40-60%.
Considering modder can just make it then fuck off, or maybe release few updates, but it'll be official game dev team that'd have to iron out all the bugs, and make sure that it works on all hardware properly.

>mods should be paid

why does Cred Forums always want to be so fucking contrarian holy fuck you people piss me right off

Wrong. Paid mods are a good idea but the game publisher and developers should pick them out and be the ones who pay the mod creators FOR FIXING THEIR SHITTY GAME.

how much is the average mod going to cost?

>if the product breaks fast
Think about it yourself. You're a car manufacturer in the capitalist state.
You make a car that will break sooner or later. It's in your interests that it breaks relatively sooner, so that you can sell a newer model. Not only that, but people will have to visit auto repair centers in order to maintain their car on the go, as well as buy needed parts. The manufacturer can produce new parts as well and sell those as well.
But yes, smart buying also would affect the market, the problem here is also that most people can't afford to buy goods of high end quality, so they try and save some money by buying cheaper goods.
In actual commieland, you'd take any car you want, drive it to where you need to and leave it there.
In USSR they had private cars, but each car came with additional parts and manuals on how to repair them. Not only that, they were usually built as simple as possible, so that you could repair it anywhere with as little stuff needed as possible. Kinda like the AK.

Look, capitalism is good but if you think you need to sell everything that can be obtain, go fuck yourself

Different user here.

There's no point judging capitalism based on uneducated consumers, because that would condemn literally every system humanity could implement.

I'm not a massive fan of capitalism but the fact is it fails with disappointing regularity and yet continues to be effective.

Ideal, no. Fair, honest, effective, no. But it continues despite the flaws. It's reborn continually despite its failings. In that respect it's highly effective.

>It's an Americuck believes the free market works episode

You don't want to sell a product that breaks consistently. You want to sell a product that can be 'upgraded' consistently.

>No mods to remove the giant dragondildo your multigenderd demisexual Hero has sewn to his forehead
Holy shit

whats wrong with the creator just accepting donations if they want a little compensation?

a required payment with a cut going straight to a bunch of jew devs sat on their ass profiting from free labor is fucking stupid
they are literately trying to get more talented people than their own staff to make DLC for them for free.

So should we sell breathable air, or rain water.

USSR cars were absolute trash. literally everything made in the USSR was absolute low quality, they had no fucking reason to make good products

>team makes awesome DC mod
>bought up by EA
>quickly dismantled

Maybe they would have been able to stick together if they were paid for DC

Rainwater is sold in bottles.

I'm not saying it's good or bad, but it exists.

>USSR cars were absolute trash.
You base this on what exactly?
>they had no fucking reason to make good products
And why would they have reason to make products that are shit?
You do realize that despite being under the influence of the government, there were different car manufacturers that competed amongst one another?

Welp, I really don't care at all. Nexus mod will not cease to exists because of that. And I know the mod community isnt greedy so we will probably see a split of those who wants to sell their shit and the ones who doesn't. If the mods come to pass through some voting and if there are rules like no NSFW mods etc then there is nothing to worry about.

Like all those indie games you pay for and they're all amazing AMIRITE?

then it was a capitalist system, just a slightly controlled one. not even commie land had actual communism lol, that's how shitty communism is

no one is forcing you to buy them
and there are GOOD ones

Not the user you're replying to, but here in Europe USSR cars are notorious for being pieces of shit.

Also the USSR was communist in name only, in reality it was more like a pseudo-capitalist oligarchy. Whatever it was, it was the antithesis of communism.

>the point
your head

Except many of the paid mods, even the ones that valve greenlit specifically to raise awareness of the program, were complete dumpster tier

You are talking out of your ass. I'm still using a coffee grinder bought in Soviet Poland, it works like a fucking charm and is over 40 years old at this point. The cord is so well made that it puts $100 models to shame. Not to mention the washing machines, (primitive) food processors and the like. You'd be hard-pressed to find stuff half as sturdy nowadays.

Or how about mods existing in the first place because it was a labor of love without the promise of monetary reward.

>pseudo-capitalist
Meant crypto-capitalist.

And the program was in place for all of 2 hours before the baby fit took it down. Not nearly enough time for capitalism to do it's job.

>you will never experience actual quality control in 'rich' countries
Why even live.

>I have no fucking idea what I'm talking about but here's something that might happen and it makes sense to me so it's a fact.

The ones that valve approved and put up specifically to showcase the quality of paid mods were bad. These were the mod makers they approached weeks, or even months before the paid mod system was publically revealed and they were unfinished cash grabs.

Are you 12?
US was never full on capitalist, USSR was never full on communist.

>here in Europe
Well guess where I'm from?
>USSR cars are notorious for being pieces of shit
Again, I'm very interested as to what you base this on. I can buy a Kopeyka for like 100 euros, buy some parts and change the ones that are dead with a screwdriver and ride without any problems.
Not only that, but I am more than sure that the good old UAZ can outdo most other cars.
youtube.com/watch?v=OYhWiNsIR6A
youtube.com/watch?v=QLDYlSLgWoQ

>Also the USSR was communist in name only
It was mostly socialist, but with some fundamental capitalist ideas and an oligarchy ruling on the top, yes.

>guess where I'm from?
Last year's sperm bank deposits.

Then why 90% of all servers around the world work on free software?

Is it at least filtered?

Depends on what you mean by 'filtered.' Some bottled water marketing claims 'this water has run down some rocks on some mountain' is the same as being 'filtered.'

lol who cares about paid mods

if a mod i want costs money i'll just pirate it

As someone who grew up in the remnants of a lot os ussr shit, everything they made looked stupid and was big, but fuck me if those things don't last forever.
I still use a space heater, probably 30 years old, simply because it still works unlike all the new heaters I bought.

I mean it eats about 4x the electricity but it works.

This is a valve approved paid mod. Pay us two bucks, goy.

Capitalism is good in some cases and in a limited scale.
When private companies start growing too big, in some specific scale, they start to create a monopoly in the market. First to control the income for their own benefit, but secondly there's a point when huge companies can't sustain themselves anymore, because they invest more and get less. So they either need to consume other business' or they need to start to cut down on themselves.
Like EA with them constantly buying and killing off studios.

EA only does that shit exactly because consumers are retards

if people bought strategy games instead of battlefield and cod, westwood wouldn't have been killed

I was specifically talking about cars. It's fair enough that you pointed out some other products from the USSR aren't shit. But I stand by my comment. I'm not a car enthusiast but I'm more like a hobbyist and amateur student thanks to my work, and I've never heard or seen or used any USSR car that wasn't a piece of shit.

>There are people on Cred Forums who are for Denuvo
>There are people on Cred Forums who hate any game without knowning anything about it because it's independently created
>There are people on Cred Forums who are for paid mods

What the fuck happened to this place?

But that's the fundamental of capitalism. Investments go where consumer demand is most needed and since they grew out so much that they need to keep maximum income, they'll cut off any branches that aren't deemed profitable.
Like another user pointed out, any system can be narrowed down to how the people are at fault.
A lot of systems are very good in theory. Problem is that you need to realistically adjust the system to how things are in reality, not just in theory.

You're completely wrong on point one and three. But your general point is accurate, Cred Forums has been overrun by casuals and morons.

...

Most of it is retards being against the grain solely for being against the grain and/or ebic troles trying to get a rise out of people, mixed in with the rare genuinely weird person. It's been like that for a while now.

Give the man a medal.

Most people are uneducated consumers and being bred to be that way every day. Intelligence is dropping, quality is dropping.

I'm genuinely frightened about the idea of paid mods coming back, mostly because the developer/publisher is going to be making money off of shit they didn't do. Mod support pays for itself in the PC space, so they don't have a 'justification' to get money out of the practice itself too

paid mods ruined decades of good will and hard work over night.

Money does not produce talent.
Why do you think movies suck today?

I agree with your post except for 'intelligence is dropping' (Intelligence is a very nebulous concept and the only metrics we have indicate intelligence is improving, but that doesn't really mean anything since the people measuring human intelligence are humans so it's a fundamentally flawed concept. Point is, we have no reliable metrics on the change in intelligence of the populace). However, I struggle to see how your post functions as a judgement of capitalism or indeed any human system of commerce or more generally resource distribution and production.

For the sake of argument, let's say humans are dumb and getting dumber. How is that an argument against capitalism, or a problem inherent to capitalism?

Weeeeeell. Movies suck today because they're catered to people with IQ's less than 80. They can't understand a complicated plot.
Mostly kidding but not really.

>Hey guys lets make organ donations be paid!
>those donators should really get money for helping out, amiright?
>If we put more money in we'll get better organs and more of them too!

Paid mods are a terrible idea because of copywrite laws.
No company is going to be happy when someone else is making money of their IPs

A good example of this the Fallout 4 mods on Xbone.
Many mods were added, but a lot of them ending up getting remove because they were copyrighted items, like Batman's Armor.

Paid mods will cause small time modders to not being to compete with more professional modders and they will also be less reluctant to make mods since they know the quality of there mods won't be as good.

Yea, you'll have more quality mods that add lots of stuff and gives better experiences, but there will be less mods overall.

THEY ARE A BAD IDEA I DON'T HAVE TO READ TO YOUR STUPID FUCKING BULLSHIT, IF THEY WANT TO CHARGE FOR SOMETHING THEY HAVE TO MAKE IT OFFICIAL DLC AND MAKE SURE IT'S ON PAR ON QUALITY STANDARDS FROM THE MAIN DEVELOPER

NOT AN IMBECILE STUPID SKIN WITH THE PRICE TAG OF A BETTER WHOLE GAME

FUCK YOU

Nobody is more dedicated than someone modding because they WANT to.
Making mods a 'job' will decrease the quality.

>Yea, you'll have more quality mods that add lots of stuff and gives better experiences, but there will be less mods overall.
I honestly wouldn't bet on that.

Surprised /tg/ is here. Sup brudda.

I don't think there is anything wrong with people who put weeks or months worth of work into a project getting compensated for doing so.

But maybe it should be on a voluntary basis, some kind of "donate if you enjoyed this"

I don't think I'd even donate, But I'm biased at the moment as I'm out of work. Maybe i should get a job making mods for simpletons.

The idea itself is not bad. But Valve can't moderate anything so poorly made shit, like the armor in that picture which required a console command to even obtain, managed to get through and people wouldn't even know until they bought it.

It's already happening with green light, all kinds of shit is sold on Steam because Valve just doesn't bother to moderate anything.

What really gets me is all the people talking in absolutes about how great paid modding is.

Then doubling back immediately after the blow out.

Obviously not everyone would donate. But some rich guy might donate 50 or 100 bucks just because.

Too late, mods are already intertwined with each other that suddenly you have a few big wigs selling their APIs so if you want to mod at all and not screw with the compatibility with a 100 other mods, you have to pay up to them, giving them a monopoly over full games.

This is SOME modders ratting out the whole community for their own benefit, while all the other modders, especially the free ones, suffer in the process. And don't pretend that it's anything else, you greedy son of a bitch.

>When money enters the mod equation, the competition increases. Mod creators will make their mods higher quality because they risk being outperformed by a competitor.

If people want to be faggots and stop making things they can already just start using patreon as a paywall.

Welcome to the mentality of pretty much everyone on the planet. Buckle up, It's gunna be a bumpy ride.

>When money enters the mod equation, the competition increases. Mod creators will make their mods higher quality because they risk being outperformed by a competitor.

This is complete bullshit. All you have to do is look at Patreon to see what really happens - modders end up stagnating, not improving because they don't need to fucking bother. There is no competition as modding isn't a business like what Valve/Bethesda want to turn it into and is something people constantly fail to understand. Modders aren't making mods to outdo another modder they're doing it because it's something they are interested in. Also as we already saw when this was attempted all that happens is massive amounts of stealing, drama and a giant wedge being driven right down the community.

And thats not even touching the copyright shit. No, it's a very bad idea and corporations need to fuck off, they're already fucking people over with season passes and overpriced DLC as it is.

Indeed. I probably would've when I was working if anything was good enough to catch my eye.

>Yea, you'll have more quality mods that add lots of stuff and gives better experiences, but there will be less mods overall.
Even this is wrong. Many mods build on other mods, and if some of them suddenly become paid, the shit creek of legal issues and modder drama will ruin everything very, very quickly. It almost happened with Valve's experiment already, it was just short-lived enough to avoid the real shitstorm.

I don't think paid mods are an inherently bad idea but the way valve tried to implement them was fucking retarded

It'd be a logistical mess to actually do right and I don't trust them to ever get it right.

>I don't think paid mods are an inherently bad idea
You think wrong. Hulk smash you post.

fpbp

Who makes a mod with the intention of charging for it?

..Is this a gameshow where you ask a question that the answer is to?

Fair enough I don't know shit about their cars, just when you make childrens toys that will most definitely survive longer than the children themselves I thought it was a somewhat safe assumption their cars can't be much worse.

400 posts
Search for total conversion
only find
wtf.
Are Cred Forums this delussional?
Paid mods are total conversion, or bust.
There is no inbetween.

That's pretty much all that would be 'acceptable' to me. Even then I'd be skeptical as shit and probably pirate it first.

Quality is not the only variable in a marketplace. In fact it often becomes nearly insignificant.

Sure, at the outset modders may find more incentive to create higher quality content, but it only takes one person to say, "Hey, why am I wasting my time trying to make my models better than the next guy's when I could just make them LOOK nicer in the screenshots and make the same money for half the effort!"

Profitability becomes the new standard. As classic modders fight over the lowest prices for the highest quality, the market will get flooded with newcomers hawking the worst mods that people will still buy.

The higher quality mods will still exist, but they simply can't hope to compete with the $.99 knock-offs. The best they can hope for is to incorporate their competitor's aggressive and manipulative sales tactics into their own mods.

Say you've got an idea for a quest mod that is absolutely incredible, but the huge amount of time you'll have to invest means you can't sell it for anything less than $10, in a market where the value of a mod is $1. No matter how good your mod is, people will see the 10x and balk. At this point, most consumers have become so accustomed to cheap-ass mods that they hardly recognize the time and effort of your mod anyways.

So you cheat, just a little. If the work is worth $10, then just finish the first 1/10th and sell it for $1. Early access, you call it! Get a sneak peak at my new incredible quest mod, Part 2 coming soon! Maybe it does, maybe it doesn't. Maybe you realize half-way through that it wasn't such a great idea at all and you scrap the project. Maybe you decide that selling a whole bunch of Part 1s for $1 is just fine enough. And then THAT idea starts to catch on too.

Sure, there will still be an old guard. The semi-pro modders working their asses off making the highest quality work they can. But they won't really be relevant anymore. See also: FUCKING VIDEO GAMES.

I appreciate your position but you must see the gap in your logic there. Let me illustrate by way of analogy:

>My cobbler makes fantastic shoes, so he must be good at knitting scarves

i like how the modding community instantly became worse shit when this shit came around. charging for esp files and for old mods and for other peoples mods but with different textures.

it was such a shitshow of terrible terrible greedy and dumb people that it got shut down.

it wasnt removed because people didnt like it. it was removed because it doesnt work.

worst part is that modders only got a fraction of the cost. so they got paid something like every hundred dollars made. but after steam and the devs got their cut, modders got like 10 or 4 bucks out of that hundred. thats why as much as a failure it is, companies still want to do it. because it makes them even more money and lets them be even lazier with the game since modders can just make it better

Its should be mod patreons or mod donations which Steam making somewhere between 10-15% of the donations to the modder. You'd still get the benefits of them being free, and people who really want to support certain modders because they love their content could get some compensation for their work by fans of their work. They could even do crowdfunding (if this mod makes "x" then I will get to work on mod "y").

>At the end of the day, this will result in fewer but much better mods instead of the hundreds of shitty free mods taking up space
This is the opposite of what happened.

also since its all independent, theres zero guarantee that mods will work together. so all those mods you paid for crash your game and all you can do is swallow the LOSS and deal with it

>Mod creators will make their mods higher quality because they risk being outperformed by a competitor.

No, it will be indie games all over again. There will be tons of half assed mods because 12 year olds will hope somebody will buy them, good luck digging through all this shit to find anything actually good.

Yeah you can see the logic failure there.

>Offer money for a product
>People decide to make less of the product

The bad thing about paid mods is that it would reward companies for letting the users fix their game.

The analogy is not needed, also mind that pretty much everything around me was ussr made shit, when everything seems to have the same quality it is a natural assumption that even if I didn't use one of those things, its the same.

But I said fair enough for a reason, the point was made.

>mfw when particular modder use patreon as an excuse to enter 'paid mod'
fuck

>Yeah you can see the logic failure there
its not even that. everyone seems to have forgotten that they already tried paid mods and it crashed and burned because people dont work like op thinks they will.

it was terrible

>patreon donator only mods

Theres so much fucking evil out there we haven1t seen yet...

It should be obvious by looking at anything that requires a transaction VIDEO GAMES that potential to earn money =/= more effort being put into releasing a good product.

If people are making a mod or anything VIDEO GAME with money as the incentive, it's not going to be good.

>>When money enters the mod equation, the competition increases. Mod creators will make their mods higher quality because they risk being outperformed by a competitor.
>
>At the end of the day, this will result in fewer but much better mods instead of the hundreds of shitty free mods taking up space- no one will buy badly-reviewed mods and the creators will either make their mod better or abandon the market entirely.

The reality of what happened disagrees with you.

I thought your point was 'their toys were good so I assumed their cars were good too.'

Well I was a kid user so yes, obviously I had more interactions with toys and house appliances than cars. Those didn't really fit into "my everything".

How did you know the toys would last longer than you when you were a kid?

Well some of them looked like they already killed others.
Thinking about it now, some of them did actually survive longer than 2 neighbour kids I had.

...

>When money enters the mod equation, the competition increases

So is that why consoles are so incredibly shitty and the games dull, rehashed trash downgraded into obscurity to work on ancient hardware?

Mainstream games are the best games because they are competing with other games.

AAA games are the best of the best because they have the most money involved.

best at appealing to the lowest common denominator, being incredibly safe and not creative, and blowing money on looking good on a surface level while being incredibly shallow.

>mods
>competition

All good mods were a labor of love and released for free

All paid mods have been bad

prove me wrong

That's why they're the best; because they appeal to the most people and have the most money involved and have to compete with similar games. Holy shit just imagine a world without competition, there'd be no room for AAA titles.

>they appeal to the most people
Yes, Candy Crush has a massive download base as do many apps. They are also primarily geared towards making money (microtransactions) and not towards being good.

appealing to people =/= quality

doesn't matter what you say. every point for and against was made over a year ago. the system that was implemented was deemed shit and removed. but don't worry because greed will bring it back eventually and we can all look forward to pirating mods again.

Appealing to the most people is what makes games homogeneous, dull, stupid shit.
When you try to please everyone you really please no one, but the masses will take shit entertainment over no entertainment.

And because it sells, it becomes the norm.
Shit is the norm because of people like you.