Help me understand the story of Bloodborne

Help me understand the story of Bloodborne.

Here's what I know (correct me if i'm wrong or misunderstood).

So a village (the one in the DLC) came in contact with the great ones and started praying to them. Everything was fine until hunters found out about this and massacred everyone in the village. The great ones were angered and placed a curse on the hunters. This is the reason monsters and paranormal beings started showing up. The curse put everyone in a never ending nightmare.

There are two sides when it came to hunters and scholars. The hunters fought for the old blood and were hell bent on eradicating monsters. A disease rose between humans, turning them into beasts. Hunters started liberating humans they suspected of being diseased. Scholars were more for gaining insight rather than blood, in order to achieve human greatness. The first hunter, Gehrman. Was a guide for you to go about the nightmare and kill great ones.

This is just a summarization, not every little detail is included. I do have some questions though.

Why didn't Gehrman just offer to kill you in the beginning and free you from the nightmare? Was he just using you in order to kill all the bosses before?

Why wasn't Ebrietas or Rom hostile towards you until you attacked them?

How did Kos give birth to a humanoid?

First paragraph, half-right. The villagers found Kos' corpse, her parasites caused them to mutate, then Byrgenwerth and the first hunters came along and cracked everyone's skulls open to see what the fuck was going on in there. Villagers prayed to Kos, and the Orphan of Kos created the Hunter's Nightmare. The reason for monsters and paranormal beings showing up is only semi-related to this.

Scholars and hunters are two sides of the same coin and mostly worked together; at first they explored the chalice dungeons and did the dirty work for Byrgenwerth's scholars (ie killing the mutants of the Fishing Hamlet so they could study their brains), and then later they worked side-by-side with the Church to help keep their experiments hidden (ultimately culminating in them burning down Old Yharnam).

Gehrman does not call the shots. Gehrman is not in charge. When you have a certain amount of insight you can find Gehrman sleeping in the Hunter's Dream, calling out for Laurence and Willem to come save him, lamenting his position. Gehrman only does what his master allows. You will have seen that creature if you refused to be killed.

Ebrietas and Rom have ties to the Choir (part of the Healing Church) and Byrgenwerth respectively. They've met other humans who have been chill with them, so have no real reason to kill on sight.

Unknown. Perhaps the Orphan's father was human. Perhaps the Great Ones are the origins of humans and the Orphan is part of that line. Perhaps it's mere coincidence. Kos herself has very human features beneath her tentacles either way.

So would Gehrman morally be a good guy if he didn't listen to the Moon Presence?

Also which ending is the true good ending? I do think that the ending where you replace Gehrman is bad because you'd still be stuck in the dream and hate it just as Gehrman did. But out of the two endings of being killed and waking up into a normal world vresus becoming a great one, which is better of the two? Does it just come down to preference?

Morals are an abstract concept. He did a lot of bad things and a lot of good things. You'll have to make up your own mind on that.

Some say it's just preference, but I personally disagree. The majority of the hunters you meet have been through the dream before. To be precise, every NPC you can summon as well as Djura and Eilleen have definitely gone through the dream. And not a single one gets a happy ending, is able to just carry on living with the blood in them but without the hunt, not one is able to break free of Yharnam's curse. We cannot be sure of what exactly ascension entails, but we can be sure of one thing; the nightmare swirls and churns unending.

No Gherman is not a good guy. It is heavily implied that he took personal part in the murder and slaughter of the fishing village and the eventual desecration of Kos and her Orphan. When you kill the Orphan of Kos, and "end" the curse of the hunters nightmare, the Doll thanks you and says that Gherman seems to be sleeping easier and she doesn't know why. There's also the whole bit about his creepy obsession with Maria and the Doll being created in her image.

The best ending is the third one, where you consume the three 1/3 cords, defeat the moon presence and become a Great One yourself.

byrgenwerth... byrgenwerth

mercy for the poor wizened child

The doll and Maria part actually does seem pretty creepy. Perhaps Gehrman made that doll for "personal" reasons.

>Help me understand the story of Bloodborne.
ayyliums

There's no actual aliens in bloodborne though.

The cosmos of course

He didn't just take part in it, he was the leader of the hunters at the time. This is why killing the Orphan and slaying the nightmare helps him sleep easier; all of his followers are no longer stuck in the loop of torment he led them into.

The Sky and Cosmos are one

He was the leader of the hunters yes but he wasn't necessarily the progenitor of the plan. During the time of the fishing village slaughter, the hunters and Byrgenwerth were one and the same and Master Willem was their undisputed leader at the time before the Great Schism.

Regardless, Gherman undoubtedly cracked the skulls of innocents and split a mothers belly in two in order to harvest the unborn fetus for grotesque experimentation. So yeah, not a good guy.

Too circumstantial to debate. Willem and friends could have been lying to them the whole time and they had no idea what was truly happening. Could be that the fishmen's entire, "We gud bois dindu nuffin," thing is bullshit too. Maria clearly isn't alright with everything that happened, and she was Gehrman's favourite.

But then there's not a single soul in the game you can call a good guy anyway, aside from the Chapel Dweller.

Gherman and the Moon Presence aren't badguys, the moon presence is trying to look out for mankind that it sees as a surrogate child and Gherman asks as his host, dreaming the hunters dream as a safe haven for hunters. The beast curse comes from the tainted blood the healing church gives out, the current crisis is because the cult of Mensis called the moon too close to conduct their ritual to commune with Mergo, an infant great one that died in the womb (same as Orphan)

Does anyone has the lyrics for the ost?

Kos's child was a perfect great one, she managing to give birth was a fucking miracle even for great ones
Some human with the golden dick beated all the odds and bam, the wizend child was born

There is a lot wrong with your post. Firstly, we know very little of the Moon Presence and what it wants and we certainly can not say the MP is "looking out for humanity". The only thing we can say for sure is that the MP desires a host, the hunters dream to persist, and the destruction of Mergo. If anything, theres more evidence that the MP wishes the continued suffering of humanity as he uses the "dreaming" hunter, through Gherman, to collect blood echoes and slay his enemies as an immortal killing machine during the night of the Hunt. Not to mention his proximity to the waking world literally hastens the plague of beasts and turns human into monsters.

ERRYDAY

Ok lads
the vermin is the source of the plague

doll is cute
doll is very lovely and deserves headpats and kisses and flowers.
doll is comfy

buckethead pls go

No. The healiing blood is the source of the plague of beasts. The Vermin are an entirely unrelated, but similar, curse that is localized almost entirely to the woods. It's the source of the snakes and why that entire area is quite unlike the rest of the beasts you encounter elsewhere.

>The great ones were angered and placed a curse on the hunters. This is the reason monsters and paranormal beings started showing up. The curse put everyone in a never ending nightmare.
No, the scourge of the beast is related to blood usage and happened before in the city of Isz, long before Yharnam existed or made contact with Kos.
Kos cursed hunters who become blood addled to be trapped in the Hunters Nightmare after the massacre at the Fishing Hamlet.

Original Iosefka was good too.

i was reading the dlc guide
they straight up said the one reborn is kos

No. Valtr believes that the vermin is what exists within the old blood that causes it to mutate and deform those who imbibe; this is why it's found everywhere in bosses, not just the forest. He believes that the vermin and the curse of the blood are the exact same thing.

He's wrong of course, since vermin don't actually exist.

Bullshit.

I have both guides and they do not say this.
Also, the guides are not made by From and have no insight on the story outside of what we have also.

I've never read the guide but that's fucking ridiculous. To be "reborn" you have to be dead and the Great Ones do not die as we understand it. Even if their physical bodies are "dead", like Kos' is, they still exist in some unfathomable extra-dimesnional sense which is why when you "kill" the Orphan, despite the fact that his body was butchered years and years prior, he still returns to his mother, Kos, in the "sea'.

Valt got a rune by straight up eating the beast
Vermin is real

I don't buy the fact that Valtr is crazy. I think their are literal Vermin for the sole reason that the PC sees and crushes them. There is no real evidence that Valtr some how infects us or deludes us into some magic fantasy with a few words.

Just read The Paleblood Hunt

> kill things
> drink blood
> become C'thu'lu

THE END

speaking of the guide
why ENB didn't make lore videos or play old hunters?
fucking vaati fanfics got 2huge

>humanity makes contact with great ones
>initially they just try to commune with them
>eventually they figure out the blood has healing properties and an entire religion is set up around blood healing
>the blood starts mutating the people who take it and turning them into beasts
>the church hires the Hunters to get rid of the problem
>eventually the Hunters realize that the only way to win is to stop the blood at its source and kill the great ones
>this fucks everything up even more
>great ones are no longer helpful, the blood mutates faster, everyone will eventually become a beast
>moon presence uses Gehrman to continue the hunt and punish humans for what they have done

This. It's why you can't see Mergo's physical body and Odeon.

So in order to halt MP, they somehow got kos to turn rom into kin status and somehow use the lakeside (water is a bulwark against great ones) to give us a fighting chance?
Odeon never had a body to begin with, he does have some kind of mental power in his church and the vicinity around it.

The confederates go around killing shit, because they want to kill shit. In-game this translates as your standard beckoning incentive, but really vermin are worth nothing beyond the initial five. You carry on because you want to. You want to fight the bosses again. You want to kill more. And more. And hunt. And hunt. And hunt.

The reason you see the vermin isn't because of some infection or Valtr's influence, it's because you yourself want to see them. You want a reason to crush them. You want a reason to kill. This is the entire point of the game, the blood makes you bloodthirsty, you want more, until you yourself become the beast. Let's also not forget that the truth to it all relies on insight, and the symbol of the confederates is a bucket which limits your vision.

To quote the man himself,
>Just think, now you're all set to hunt and kill to your heart's content!

The Paleblood Hunt is shit and relies far too much on speculation even in sections that claim to be fact.

It's the best interpretation of the story there is and outright states when he speculates.

because muh miscarriage

I'm sorry but that's pure conjecture. Quite literally, a major point of the entire game is the PC hunter finally overcoming the plague of beasts and transcending (ending) the Hunt. For you to suggest that the PC is becoming a delusional blood crazed hunter is against the entire narrative of the game. There is no other thing in the game that you "will" yourself to see. Everything you see in the game is real, you may not understand any of it, and it maybe completely unbelievable, but it does exist and is simply beyond your comprehension. The vermin are no different.

>So in order to halt MP, they somehow got kos to turn rom into kin status and somehow use the lakeside (water is a bulwark against great ones) to give us a fighting chance?
No, Willem turned Rom into a Great One in a manner similar to the way the Good Hunter becomes a Great One; by using the umbilical chord.

Rom was hiding the truth though, but the exact reason for that isn't entirely clear.

This is so very wrong. The Healing Church were the ones spreading the blood. If they wanted to stop the spread of the blood all they had to do was stop spreading it themselves.

The reason the School of Mensis wanted to hunt the great ones was because they figured out the true key to ascension (Hunt the Great Ones, hunt the Great Ones - The nameless moon presence beckoned by Laurence and his associates. Paleblood. - Three third cords), and it's safe to assume this is why Moon Presence wanted them stopped.

Kos was a corpse before Byrgenwerth found her. Rom was either created using knowledge harvested from the corpse/mutants, or she wasn't created by Byrgenwerth at all but found in the chalice dungeons. The latter is more likely since Ebrietas and Amygdala, both found in the Chalice Dungeons, are the only other Great Ones you kill out of them that are also found inside them.

>Perhaps the Great Ones are the origins of humans and the Orphan is part of that line
Supported by the Dark Souls 3 Aldrich tie-in theory

Incorrect. For a start he states Rom is objectively Willem's creation despite there being contrary evidence. He states Amygdala is factually a race despite there being clear differences between the Amygdala boss and all the others. His eyes have yet to fully open.

post doll
say nice things about her

>eventually the Hunters realize that the only way to win is to stop the blood at its source and kill the great ones
>this fucks everything up even more
>great ones are no longer helpful, the blood mutates faster, everyone will eventually become a beast
This part is wrong.

The Hunters never killed Great Ones to end blood ministration, if that were their end goal it'd have been much easier to kill the Healing Church.
In fact it's arguable that the Hunters ever killed a Great One at all, outside of the PC Hunter. The reason for Kos' death is not entirely clear and the responsibility could be either Byrgenwerth (and the Hunters) or the Fishing Hamlet themselves. It's hard to say.

He's called eldrich in the jp ver right?

I believe so.

Theres no evidence that Kos had anything to do with Rom at all. She was already "dead" before any human laid eyes eye on her. The only thing connecting the two in any way are Micolashs' insane ramblings. More likely, Byrgenwerth used the knowledge they attained from the slaughter and experimentation on the Orphan in order to ascend Rom in some unknown fashion which would technically would mean Kos was indirectly involved, which would explain his ramblings. It was then Master Willem himself who used Rom, and the Lake, as a bulwark against the descending Pale Blood (moon), and its hastening of the plague of beasts. The Pale Blood Moon was always there, but it is only after you slay Rom, and her influence is shattered, that the moon becomes completely unbridled and the most terrible of the beasts finally appear.

>For a start he states Rom is objectively Willem's creation despite there being contrary evidence
This is correct though, Willem's chord suggests he used it to ascend Rom.

As for the Amygdala that's pure speculation and he admits as such.

...

kos already had died when the hamlet found her
Byrgenwerth fucked with her kid

>major point of the entire game is the PC hunter finally overcoming the plague of beasts and transcending (ending) the Hunt
You are factually incorrect. The game has multiple optional areas and endings; one playthrough of the game can be someone just running straight to MWN and murdering everything he sees and then awakening, never knowing the truth behind everything or even scratching the surface of transcendence. There is no core narrative for the PC; you can become a beast or kin by mere whim. You can literally become a beast and wield beast claws and run around killing for simple sport if you wish. Stop applying canon to a PC who has free choice.

>any blood minister
>good
They may have good intentions, but you know what they say about that.

JOIN THE LEAGUE TODAY

It is not correct, it is speculation.

In fact Willem's cord suggests the exact opposite.
>Provost Willem sought the Cord in order to elevate his being and thoughts to those of a Great One, by lining his brain with eyes.
Nothing there says he wanted to use it to elevate another person or humanity in general, but himself. If he achieved that he'd be the Great One, not Rom.

Shut up, loony.

Willem is guarding Rom, and his body has begun some form of transformation looking strikingly similar to Rom.

It's probable that Willem tried to ascend, failed or didn't complete his ascension, and tried the same thing with Rom who succeeded.

It's probably for the best anyway. His recent videos have been pretty shit.
His DaS1 playthrough was so badly paced

Its all about streams now sadly
guess i'll have to content with redgrave and his band

>guarding Rom
Nigger sells her out the second you show up.

What a great big load of speculation you have going on there.

This is further supported by the fact we only know of one sure fire way to ascend, using the umbilical chords. The same way we did.

It stands to reason that Rom, an ascended one, did so the same way. And with Willem watching over her, it'd be understandably to assume he was responsible for her ascension.

It's understandable to assume that, but it's still an assumption is the very point I'm making here, not infallible fact as TPBH claims.

Yes the fact that From Software would never embrace any of the endings as "canon' means that any of them could be of course. But that also means I can not be factually incorrect as all endings are equally plausible. What is more likely "factually" incorrect is your assertion about the vermin. Literally, nothing in the game is imaginary or hallucinatory in any capacity. Your conjecture about the metaphorical meaning of the bucket or, indeed, your "canon" application of the PC's motivation, blood-lust or otherwise, is just that, conjecture. Assertions that serve to interpret and support your hypothesis that the Vermin are somehow not real. It would be more consistent with the entirety of the game, that the Vermin are indeed, real, as quite literally everything else in the game is. There is simply no reason to believe Vermin are the one exception for any particular reason.

His stream is pretty poor quality too sadly.
It just feels like he's going through the motions but not actually caring.
Seeing him fall to stream whore tier is kinda sad.

Even if there was a sequel non of the endings is mutually exclusive or preventing a sequel. Just becouse the hunter transcended it dosen't mean any human will be able to contact/reach him or that he will be interested in such contact after what he saw.

Another good content creator lost to the cancer

>There is simply no reason
Aside from all the evidence for it I've already posted. Let's post some more.

Now as stated the whole point of the game is the struggle of humanity to either ascend or fall to beasthood. We see many who are in the latter category, all of whom find excuses to try and kill you; you'll be a beast sooner or later (might as well kill you now) is a big one. Ludwig's entire story is about becoming bloodthirsty, and using hunting beasts as an excuse to kill. It's the core of what defines beasts in the game. Blood-crazed monsters who want only to kill. And more relevant to here, to make excuses for it. There's an entire branch of the church who martyr themselves because they know it's what they will become if they don't.

Valtr ate a beast. He didn't just kill it and imbibe the blood, he ate that shit. And his entire organisation revolves around killing more things. Henryk, Madaras, Antal, all confederates who turn blood-crazed and try to kill you, because that is what awaits the bloodthirsty in the end; we can avoid it because we're the player, we're special, but there is not a single example of someone who imbibes the blood or hunts who doesn't fall to the same fate in the end.

>as quite literally everything else in the game is
Bullshit argument when you're dealing with Nightmare realms and dreamscapes; someone could just as easily say that nothing at all is real in the game as well. You'll also notice the Master's Iron Helm has very low Frenzy resistance, Frenzy being the mechanic that represents insanity.