What's the best character action game and why is it Bayonetta?

I didn't play it, how was it improved?

>character action

It's definitely the second best action game in existence. There's nothing that comes close to DMC3 and Bayo 1.

S Tier
DMC3SE
Bayo 1

There's no need for a A,B, C, D tier because nothing comes close to these two. They are the perfect action games.

>Some DMC4 faggot get triggers by this
Fuck off. Your game is unfinished/etc you know the story. Not to mention pandering to babies now with DMC4SE Musou Tier characters.

Ninja Gaiden Black>everything else

Not tis time you bald cheeky cunt

One day we'll get the perfect action game right anons?

>Bayo has too many cutscenes
>Bayo2 weapons are a bit boring
>DMC4 has shit campaign
>DMC3 doesn't have enough variety without style switcher
>DMC1 has great enemy design but limited combat

I love all of those games but it hurts to see nearly every game in the genre have some small to major flaw that holds it back.

I guess NG:B and God Hand come to mind for me as "perfect" just because they succeed at what they were trying to do while avoiding the usual traps of the other games I mentioned (the water levels sucked in NG:B though).

DMC fans like myself are so anxious for 5 mainly because the series has already done so many great things, just never in one game.

>Bayo2 weapons are a bit boring
Bayo 2 had Salamandra, all is forgiven.

Salamandra was a boring as fuck weapon

>>DMC3 doesn't have enough variety without style switcher
kill yourself. And I don't need to explain why.

I'd put Ninja Gaiden Black right underneath Bayonetta and then W101 right under that one.

Das it mane

Having style options locked away isn't very fun and having them all at once doesn't fit DMC3's balance very well. For the record, I like 3's weapons better than 4. Fuck, I like a lot of shit in 3 as opposed to 4. I just want a DMC game that isn't missing something awesome from another in the series. Guess I'll go kill myself now.

Salamandra is easy mode the weapon.

REEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEE

>character action game
When the hell did this term start being used? It's only something I've heard very recently

The way I see it, the term is used to try and deflect all the shitposting that comes from describing DMC/Bayo/etc. as "hack n' slash" or "beatemup" since those genres already exist and don't really describe the kind of gameplay you get from DMC/Bayo/etc.

That being said, the label "character action game" causes this same level of shitposting so it's actually counter intuitive to use it at this point.

>Played Bayonetta on Normal towards the end of last year.
>Then played Bayonetta 2 on Normal.
>Then played Wonderful 101 on Normal.
>Then played Metal Gear Rising on Normal.
>Then played Transformers Devastation on Normal.
Only now when I started a second playthrough in Bayonetta on Hard mode and made it to Chapter III has it truly started to click for me.
I'm starting to pull off all sort of stylish combos and I'm getting at least a Gold for Combos in every verse.
What an incredibly exhilarating subgenre.

Not mention "Character Action" doesn't tell you anything on it's own.
Fuck, Stylish Beat 'em Up works better.

Yep, I agree. "Stylish Beat 'em Up" pretty much sums up all of these games as best as possible without putting it on some elite pedestal like "character action game" or "spectacle fighter".

>Bayonetta
>Best

Best genre.

I'm going back to all of them now and finally going to beat them all on their hardest difficulties, starting with NGB, even though I'm a bigger fan of DMC and Platinum's games, honestly.

I really feel like the more experience I have with this genre, the better I get with them. Having played the first Bayonetta, along with a bunch of other games in the genre, really helped me out with Bayonetta 2 and MGR the first time I played them. I was able to start on the highest available difficulties right from the start and did pretty well, all things considered.

Character action was coined by some faggot journo who thought he was clever and normies and baiters are the only retards who use it. Hack 'n' slash has origins in tabletop RPGs, just like the term RPG itself, thus even though you could logically apply them to these kinds of games that's not what the term was made for. The same sort of applies to beat 'em ups, since they were a very specific thing for a long time and then basically stopped existing, so it's counter-intuitive to apply that here.

All of the above (minus RPGs of course) are used to refer to these kinds of games by different people, which is why it's such a clusterfuck of debate and why /cgg/ came into existence. At the core of it DMC, God Hand, Bayonetta, NG, W101, they're action games, pure and simple, the only difference between them and stuff like God of War and Enslaved is they're very good action games. As such categorising them as Stylish Action works best.

These games always seemed like a 3D evolution of the Beat-'em-Up genre.
That's what I like about them.

I agree with your ranking, and this nigger is also on the money.

But if you don't like Trish it's time to put on an exit bag.

>character action game

It's cuhrayzee game.

>It's cuhrayzee game.
That term has already been claimed by pic related nearly 20 years ago. The announcer even says it in-game.

Does anyone know whatever happened to that indie game user would occasionally post on /cgg/? It was a blend of Tony Hawk and DMC-ish gameplay.

Honestly, it's hard to choose the best game in this genre because they all play so differently. And personally, people should choose what to call this genre before they start arguing about which is best.

>As such categorising them as Stylish Action works best.
That's actually what I used to always use but then it never caught on.

Honestly, noting the link between beat 'em ups and cuhrayzee, I really like the term, "Style 'em up."

It was called We Shall Wake if you want to look it up. I believe it's on hold whilst they throw together some low budget thing to sell so they can get more funds for it.

That's it! Thanks dude. A DMCxTHPS blend is like my dream game. Hopefully it'll see the light of day.

Actually, now that I looked it up. I remember We Shall Wake but I'm thinking of something different. The game had a cellshaded look like XIII, green robot-ish character and ramps and shit.

Quick question about Bayonetta. The crows carrying the Umbran Tears of Blood don't respawn on separate playthroughs, do they?
I'm replaying it and I'm just hoping I'm not wasting time picking up crows I've already grabbed. I'm using the same save file, I'm just playing again on a higher difficulty.

They don't respawn but there are different ones to find in each of the three highest difficulties, so all the ones you're grabbing are new ones.

Okay that's good.

I just ordered the Devil May Cry HD Collection for the Xbox 360. I've never played any DMC game, what am I in for?

Some Devil May Cry games.

Well fuck, that's not what I wanted. I wanted Need for Speed.
I'm going to try and get a refund.

People will tell you to skip DMC 2, you might even be tempted to, don't do it. Playing DMC 2 gives you an extra appreciation for DMC 3

I wanna find out if Bayonetta is that good. Someone post the Wii U US dump.

Two great games, and a pretty bad one. DMC1 and DMC3 are a bit tough for first time players, but it gets a bit easier once you realize that jumping also functions as a dodge.
DMC2 is much easier than both games, and has a plethora of different problems, you can play it if you want to.

Oh, and all three games have great soundtracks.

DMC3's soundtrack is 'eh' outside of a handful of songs, honestly.

Fair enough. Personally I like all the battle themes in the game. I can give or take the ambience that plays when just running around though.

no
>DMC4
If it's SE I can agree

>why is it Bayonetta
in comparison, DMC4 is unfinished, Ninja Gaiden 2 is un playtested. Whereas the only fault Bayo has is performance and shitty mini-game sections. Ignoring "depth" it is better than its contemporaries

>Your game is unfinished/etc you know the story.
it has the most complex gameplay which makes it automatically better than anything else.

I feel you bro. In my heart.

>Ninja Gaiden Black
You can fuck off with your shit opinion
>W101
>S tier
you're even worse

I remember you from one thread where everyone shat on "Style 'em up."
Rightfully so, that name sounds fucking retarded.

Don't do any cheat codes. I wanted to just unlock the costumes for 3 because I didn't have enough time to re-unlock each and every one, but the game doesn't let you save while you're using the costume cheat.

Bayo's performance issues are insulting considering how great the game is. The Wii U can't handle particle effects for shit. Maybe I should shell out for a 360/Xbone.

What's wrong with NGB?

I think he's referring to the fact that the other post didn't feature NGB as one of the best action games.

>acting like the term "character action game" is new

Is everyone on Cred Forums underage or am I getting old?

slash thread

God Hand

One day user, one day...

>Ninja Gaiden 2 is un playtested.
Such a disappointment. I really feel like if NG2 were ever actually finished, balanced, and playtested, it might've been better than Black. I prefer the combat system and the quick menu in that game.

This series is deader than Metal Gear. Let it go

What this guy said

Devil May Cry 3 followed by Ninja Gaiden Black.

devil may cry is for action and bayonetta is for karoake singalong fun fest non-lewd sexual prude pure adventure fun times

>"MOOOON RIVERRRRRRRRRRR!"

>"WHIIIIIIIIIIIIIIITER THAN A MILE!"

>you're even worse
Fuck you.

What's wrong with "Style 'em up"?

It sounds pretty gay to be honest fampai

What an argument.

Sounds cool to me.

Wasn't an argument, just my thought on it

Ninja Gaiden doesn't feel very stylish though. It feels more like you're trying to do whatever works with hair-trigger reflexes.

If you're good enough, you can style on enemies and even some bosses. Generally though, it's more about survival, efficiency, and trying to get as much karma as possible. But when there's only one or two enemies left, you can do something stylish.

It has much better movement though

Tony Hawk-like game was Mayhem League

We Shall Wake was another game with weird ass camera angles and MC sliding all over the place

YESSSSS! Thanks dude. Hopefully this gets finished one day.

What a thought on it.

>character action game

Name me one action game where the player doesn't control a character and i'll let you keep using this fucking retarded name

Eh. Not him and while I love NG, the movement can be a little frustrating. You have to absolutely master Ryu's movement to not fuck up. It's way too easy to accidentally do something you didn't want Ryu to do, like wall jump, costing you a precious couple of seconds if you're trying to do karma.

I like DMC's movement much better, honestly. It's more 'rigid', but you're in far more control and if you master it, you're capable of doing a bunch of crazy shit if you're good enough.

Fuck it, may as well ask here, since this is a pseudo-/cgg/ thread as it is.

How the FUCK are people able to do karma runs in NGB on VH or MN? I'm playing VH for the first time now and holy fuck, this is such a big jump in difficulty from Hard mode it's not even funny. Going for karma wasn't even THAT hard in that mode. But in VH, I feel like I should just focus on surviving every encounter and farming for yellow essence.

You have to be really good. I'm playing very hard for the first time as well and it is crazy.

Check this guy out m.youtube.com/watch?v=OKAbHxJexDk

I just got to the boss of Ch. 3 and he's kinda kicking my ass. It's not even THAT hard, I just don't have dick for healing items except for a Talisman that I want to save.

Thinking about going back and redoing some of the earlier parts for karma though. That bit with the guys on horses before the Ch. 2 boss I thought was REALLY hard to get under the time limit.

What about you, user?

Ninja Gaiden is pretty stylish. It's approach to style is closer to God Hand

I'm halfway through Chapter Six. The bosses so far haven't been too bad, tentacle fiend in 5 is hard, the doppelgänger is hard and the red ninjas are crazy. Actually Murai and the first level in general has been the hardest for me so far.

I don't stress too hard over karma though and stock up on heals as frequently as possible so I can make mistakes in boss fights and not be fucked. I also don't worry about beating bosses in the time limit, I just make sure I don't get fucked in the ass.

>I don't stress too hard over karma though and stock up on heals as frequently as possible so I can make mistakes in boss fights and not be fucked. I also don't worry about beating bosses in the time limit, I just make sure I don't get fucked in the ass.
I don't even know why I keep on going for karma considering it's my first time through these difficulty modes. I did decently going for karma on Hard but here, I REALLY should just focus on not dying and stocking up on heals instead of constantly reloading my saves so I can get more karma. Kek. I'm basically being a tryhard when I really shouldn't be. Maybe tomorrow, I'll just say, "Fuck it."

Why are these games so fucking corny with annoying ass music and characters?

And you can't say "because it's japanese" because I play lots of Japanese games. Gran Turismo isn't this way, Outrun isn't this way, Final Fantasy isn't this way. It's something about the "creators" of these games that let their corny personalities and fantasy likenesses seep into the productions of these games. The only one that manages to appeal to me is Ninja Gaiden. Everything else is so forcibly sarcastic, wacky, and incoherent for sake of it. Maybe that's why Cred Forums seems to likes these games so much. Because Cred Forums as a whole is sophomoric and sarcastic. It shows no more than in their taste in humor or entertainment.

Character action is not a genre reeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeee

>Final Fantasy isn't this way
Haha, wow.

Pro-tip: FF characters are significantly more annoying and cringey than any stylish action game protagonist.

Ryu Hayabusa is pretty cool and subdued, I'll give you that, but then NG in general isn't really as interesting thematically or in the narrative as pretty much any stylish action game, one way or the other.

>he hates fun
get ballbusted, fagget
youtube.com/watch?v=8M4hen_sorA

>isn't really as interesting thematically or in the narrative as pretty much any stylish action game

Gran turismo and Outrun are racing games, not relevant in any way to action games. And I'm pretty sure Final Fantasy has some of the same problems you mentioned like "Annoying music and characters. Nice bait. You got me.

Final Fantasy has soul and is classical in a storybook sense. It's epic and grandiose in a mature storybook sense.

Bayonetta and Devil May Cry and all the shit platinum touches is all "LOOK AT ME, LOOK AT ME!! AREN'T I SO FUCKING COOL AND QUIRKY!!?? XDD"

At least with Ryu there's a character and a motivation not fucking quirks piled together to masquerade as character. And the music isn't garbled off-the-wall noise like in Bayonetta or DMC.

>Outrun isn't corny

Are you fucking kidding me? The first game is 80's Central and the sequel is cheese beyond belief.

Prove me wrong.

I like NG and all, and I like a lot of aspects of its universe, like the focus on traditional Japanese ninja, Fiends, and some of the side characters, like Momiji. I like how they have you fight a bunch of military dudes as well. I kinda liked NGB's plot, since it was like a hyperviolent 80's anime, mixed with a martial arts movie, and with a revenge plot thrown in for good mix.

But honestly. It's boring compared to any of the others.

Devil May Cry has a much more interesting protagonist, and unlike NG girls, DMC girls can be cool and interesting all on their own, like Lady. On top of that, at least DMC has the third game, which easily has the best story and some of the best writing in its own little subgenre. Great characters too. NG really doesn't have an antagonist as cool or as memorable as Vergil.

Bayonetta 1 and 2 may have awful stories, but at least the universe they're set in are actually fairly interesting. It's a neat little urban fantasy setting they created for that game, with tons of cool "rules" set for the usage of magic and the bond between witches and demons, among other things.

W101 has a great SUPERHEROIC setting, some of the best writing in the genre, and great characters, with a narrative that actually has a message and themes, that makes you feel, not unlike DMC3, actually.

MGR has great writing and a great universe as well, but then that's somewhat cheating since it's a part of the MGS franchise. Still, that game on its own did have great writing. Much better than anything NG has, where Team Ninja has almost never put much effort into the plot.

Final Fantasy characters are just that. Fantastical. But they are melodically so. They aren't wacky shit like this. I don't want to play a game where the character looks smugly at the camera. I want to turn it off and throw it away. That is corny and for teenagers.

Name a single cutscene where Dante looks directly at the camera with a smug face.

You're thinking quirks and smug looks at the camera is "good style." It's not. It's corny.

Outrun is smooth. It's not corny. It has soul. Devil May Cry and Bayonetta are kitschy.

>Final Fantasy has soul and is classical in a storybook sense. It's epic and grandiose in a mature storybook sense.
No. FF is immature as hell. Sometimes I guess the games do touch upon themes that may make you think a little bit, but come on. This is a franchise where every other character looks like Gackt. Half the characters look like they shop at Hot Topic ffs. This is a franchise where half the games have tons of magical supertechnology alongside magical spells. Nothing really makes sense. Most of the plots are fucking jokes.

>Bayonetta and Devil May Cry and all the shit platinum touches is all "LOOK AT ME, LOOK AT ME!! AREN'T I SO FUCKING COOL AND QUIRKY!!?? XDD"
But Bayonetta, Dante, Nero, and several of Platinum's other characters have had character arcs more substantial than anything Ryu has ever had. You're dumbing down the characters way too much to prove a point that's not even really there.

>At least with Ryu there's a character and a motivation not fucking quirks piled together to masquerade as character.
Ryu in NGB doesn't have a motivation beyond wanting to save the world from the Dark Dragon Blade and wanting revenge on the dudes who attacked his village and killed him. That's pretty much it.

Pretty much every DMC and every Platinum character is more complex.

>And the music isn't garbled off-the-wall noise like in Bayonetta or DMC.
I like NG's music but no. DMC and especially Platinum's music tends to be much better, much more hype, and much more memorable.

>You're thinking quirks and smug looks at the camera is "good style." It's not. It's corny.
That's not even remotely a rebuttal to anything I said in that post. I wasn't even talking to you specifically, I was talking to that other user.

No. Outrun 2 is really fucking corny. It even has vocal songs.

>boring
It's not boring. See I see a unique trend on Cred Forums. The people that like Devil May Cry and Bayonetta also tend to like new millennium Nintendo products, Metal Gear, and cartoons. They're the kind that prefers Metal Gear over Splinter Cell merely because of Metal Gear's kitschy ostentation tonally inconsistent "style". They can't associate with anything that has a single ilk of realism or sincerity. They can only appreciate things that are in-your-face or trying very hard to be wacky for the sake of it with lots of colors and one-note acting and personalities. These are the types that eschew classy material as generic dribble but would rather partake in buffoonery with sophomoric jokes about potty humor and teenage-level sarcasm. These are the types that I consider to be genuinely "autistic."

>much more hype, and much more memorable
These are also the types that can't appreciate subtlety. The louder the music is apparently that makes it better.

But W101 has Luka. That was fucking horrible.

Anyway I'm being facetious. I kind of agree with you I think, in the sense that Ryu Hayabusa is barely a character. The only game that tried to do anything there was Ninja Gaiden 3, and beyond just having him still be hero guy, nobody liked that story.

The NES games might've had more characterization.

>muh realism makes everything better
If I wanted realism I'd go outside, or at least play a different game. Sometimes I just want to play a dumb action game to relax. If it's not your style, that's cool. But you don't need to shit up a thread for replies.
Consider me baited. Again.

>Vocal songs equal corny
Sure, there are exaggerated characteristics, but if you can't tell the difference between what makes the aesthetics of Devil May Cry and Bayonetta more immature than Outrun then you are certifiably autistic my friend.

Yu Suzuki took inspiration from reality in the production of his games. This right here is soul, boy.

youtube.com/watch?v=aEz1BVeGO2o

This is bullshit.
youtube.com/watch?v=GZUN89RaP60

There's absolutely nothing wrong with it being goofy, even if it's unintentional. Would you deny House of the Dead 4 and Virtua Fighter 5 aren't corny in the slightest?

Man even switching weapons in NGB is faster than NG3RE. Why the fuck is NG3 such a disaster on a technical level?

>It's not boring. See I see a unique trend on Cred Forums. The people that like Devil May Cry and Bayonetta also tend to like new millennium Nintendo products, Metal Gear, and cartoons.
[citation needed]

I myself don't actually like Metal Gear aside from MGR.

>They can't associate with anything that has a single ilk of realism or sincerity.
Again,
[citation needed]

>These are the types that eschew classy material as generic dribble
I seriously hope you're not equating "classy material" with autistic bullshit like Final Fantasy.

youtube.com/watch?v=0WY8a9_TTUE
youtube.com/watch?v=yL34Nb5OpVY

Good entertainment should have a modicum of realism and solid coherence at its core. This extends from aesthetics to mechanical engineering. When you're too fantastical, you enter he realm of escapist schlock.

>youtube.com/watch?v=0WY8a9_TTUE
>youtube.com/watch?v=yL34Nb5OpVY
Are you agreeing with him? Because these are shit

>autistic bullshit like Final Fantasy.
No one could be any more wrong.

Final Fantasy as a franchise is one of the greatest artistic achievements in games next to Shenmue.

So you're saying that Final fucking Fantasy is more realistic than DMC, or Bayonetta? And that it isn't escapist shlock?

>Video games
>Not escapist, ever

You sound like a permavirgin who takes his hobby way too seriously. Go outside and get some sun.

So you're saying that random turn based battles, grinding, and stories about collecting the four elemental items and fighting some big boss at the end is some kind of great artistic achievement?

>Good entertainment should have a modicum of realism and solid coherence at its core. This extends from aesthetics to mechanical engineering. When you're too fantastical, you enter he realm of escapist schlock.
Even if this WERE true, you do realize that FF isn't really more realistic than Bayonetta, DMC, or Platinum's other games, right? I mean, at least those are set in "our" world, resembling our world for the most part, except for, in Bayo and DMC's case, the secret existence of angels and demons.

FF is set across various fantasy worlds which aren't necessarily beholden to the confines of our reality. Otherwise, people would be casting magic and shit.

>Final Fantasy as a franchise is one of the greatest artistic achievements
Not really. It's pretty overrated, honestly.

Yes it is. Final Fantasy IS fantastical. But that is not inherently bad. There is a clear reason WHY Final Fantasy resonates so well with millions of people. Not only is it enrapturing in its fantasy but there is a clear logic in its worlds. They do not defy their own world logic consistently for the sake of flair. At the core, Final Fantasy has VERY human characters that evolve and overcome overwhelming odds and the stories cover a wide emotional gamut that Bayonetta and DMC certainly do not.

You think summarizing a series down to core elements will belittle it in any way? You're a buffoon, guy.

>Not only is it enrapturing in its fantasy but there is a clear logic in its worlds.
But there's logic and consistency in the abilities of the greater protagonists in DMC and Platinum's games as well, in addition to universal rules that aren't really broken.

>At the core, Final Fantasy has VERY human characters that evolve
So does DMC characters as well as most of Platinum's characters.

Christ, this is why I can't stand FFfags or the FF fanbase. You're all so full of shit.

So you're saying you haven't played DMC, or Bayonetta, and that you're just trying to get as many (you)s as you can before people get tired?
Because if you're implying the characters don't grow, or overcome overwhelming odds, then you clearly weren't paying attention. And I'm still waiting for the cutscene where Dante looks at the camera smugly.

So why is the series such a masterpiece then? If its core elements are that stale and outdone what makes it so compelling to use in internet arguments? It surely doesn't have anything to do with action games. Or is this just an elaborate shitpost aimed at fans of this genre, since FFXV looks like shit?

Smugness and sarcasm isn't character.

There is no character or coherence in Devil May Cry or Bayonetta but there is in Ninja Gaiden. Both DMC and Bayonetta are style over substance. And it's not even good style. I recognize good traits in mechanics and somewhat higher than average skill ceiling for mastery of mechanics, but there are fatal fundamental flaws in both games series. Ninja Gaiden as a whole works far better narratively and mechanically. Like I said, I like Ninja Gaiden. I'll definitely play Ninja Gaiden. I'm not a fan of Ninja Gaiden but I cetainly like it. Bayonetta and DMC though? They belong in the garbage. They're for pasty-faced escapist nerds that want to glorify immaurity and degeneracy. Essentally Cred Forums which is why I prefaced earlier that I understand why Cred Forums as a whole loves Bayonetta and DMC. They're not good but you can certainly like them as a guilty pleasure. There's no room for censorship in this world.

>the pseudo-intellectualism and mental gymnastics ITT
How the fuck did it get to this

But there is coherence in DMC. In DMC1, Dante is trying to find and kill Mundus, and in DMC3, Dante is trying to stop Vergil from fucking shit up.
How the hell is it hard to pay attention to either of those games' stories? Bayonetta's story is a fucking mess, and I'm not even going to try and defend that one. So what are these games' fundemental flaws that stop them from being good if I may ask?