How come so many oppose the Nordic model? Seems to have worked fantastically for us

when where you the center and how did socialism lead to the downfall?

From about 1400 to 1580 when we were ahead of everyone else in the discoveries and had most mathematicians and naval scientists coming to our country to teach/learn, and then after that when we had the trade monopoly. German canon/archibuses makers all came to down here for a while, for example. Most naval technology was developed and put to use in the Sagres school of navigation.

But socialism wasn't the problem at the time, really, but arrogance of a young king that tried to defeat an army using the wrong strategy because he thought we were unbeatable.

Fucked up the dynasty and let the Spaniards get their hands on our plans and our armada, fucking it up, and letting the dutch steal data and learn how to get to India. The English had been our allies but with a Spanish crown we became enemies, etc etc.

Lisbon Seville was basically the centre of activity in Europe for a while. I'm not saying we were the top dogs, but we were one of them for sure, just like Sweden is now.

Socialism only fucked us up much later after we were already rebounding in the 70's.

>Fantastic
Tell that to your Wife's son after Achmed pulled him into that Alleyway.

>fantastically

With many natural resources and a small population I also created a superpower. But in Spain it is a total failure.

>Seems to have worked fantastically for us.

I make 18 000 a month (slightly below average) after taxes.

>taxes on me: 8 000
>Taxes on my employer (directly based on wage): 8 300
>Taxes on everything I buy: 25 %
>Point taxes on everything from petrol to beer

So yeah, I as an below average wage earner pay over half my income in taxes. HALF and I am hardly rich.

Oh and I get barely anything back as I don't have children, nor any housing subsidies etc.

This system is a broken mess, I should just leech off it like the smart people do.

They want to keep the rich getting insanely mega rich

how can i work in sweeden as a food engineer and integrate sweeden

Apply for jobs. It's easy.

Not everyone lives in a homogenous country of

9>

>food engineer
Is this some way of saying kebab salesman?

there are only a handful countries in the world where a society like ours would work

most important thing you need is trust, if you can't trust the government to spend well the "harsh" taxation that you have to pay, it will never work

and yeah you also kinda need a small-ish population that is well educated and has no major internal issues like divided religion, culture etc.

A good society is built around incentives to make the population do what they ought to i.e. own a house and have a family, not be a neet with a shit job. The system is not meant to be fair or give you lots of disposable income to blow on toys and cigs. Or atleast it shouldn't.
Our country is indeed in deep shit though as you say and the people governing us range from incompetent to malicious and they're showing no signs of stopping our rapid swirl down the globalist toilet. Here's hoping for a revolution that sweeps the scum (meaning all of them) out of parliament.

>A popular rebuttal is to invoke the socialist leanings of several European countries with high living standards, especially in Scandinavia. Why can’t America be more like happy Denmark, with its high taxes and giant public sector, or at least more like France? Even the more pro-free-market United Kingdom has national health care, after all. First off, comparing relatively small, homogeneous populations to the churning, ocean-spanning American giant is rarely useful. And even the most socialist of the European countries only became wealthy enough to embrace redistribution after free-market success made them rich. Still, why cannot America follow this path if that is what the people want? What is the problem if American voters are willing to accept higher taxes in exchange for greater security in the embrace of the government?
>The answer takes us back to all those inventions America has produced decade after decade. As long as Europe had America taking risks, investing ambitiously, attracting the world’s dreamers and entrepreneurs, and yes, being unequal, it could benefit from the results without making the same sacrifices. Add to that the incalculable windfall of not having to spend on national defense thanks to America’s massive investment in a global security umbrella. America doesn’t have the same luxury of coasting on the ambition and sacrifice of another country.
thedailybeast.com/articles/2016/03/10/garry-kasparov-hey-bernie-don-t-lecture-me-about-socialism-i-lived-through-it.html

well, i wish but it is not.I would like to work brewery company or smth like that

What is the "Nordic Model"?

Fact is that I think every Nordic country is extremely tiny ~10 million, if that? Do any of the Nordic countries manage to make up even 1% of the world population? PUT TOGETHER do they make 1% of the world population? They are also extremely irrelevant. Keeping a teeny tiny country in a state of comfortable irrelevance is easy.

Keeping a major nation as a world power is difficult.

I guess so. I don't blame him tho', there's some of his countrymen engineering some damn good pizza right next to where I live.

Yeah except the little detail that me and my GF (who earns about as much I do) can't afford a house, nor a child (the subsidies doesn't cover those things 100 %, just like 50 %). Now if we got to keep all our income it would be quite a different matter wouldn't it?

This is quite true desu. Being a global power devours a huge amount of resources. Being a midget state, we only have to care for our territorial defence.

If America invested 50% of it's annual military budget in homeland the country would be quite different I guess.

T: samefag

all nordic countries together would have a population of around 26,7M, and an economy slightly larger than that of spain, which has a population of 46,4M

Lolno

So not even 1% of the world population, which is what I thought. Whatever the "nordic model" is, it's obviously never been done on any major nation. I mean, why don't all countries switch to the "Vatican City model"? Seems to work fantastically for them.

The greatest tragedy in Portuguese history was the Great Lisbon Earthquake. Portugal still has not recovered its influence.

It worked until the Social Democrats started fucking shit up in the late 60's and the first wave of "refugees" in the 80's.

Imagine if we'd kept at it like things were in the late 50's. It would've been hella good.

Very interesting concepts you both have. I agree heavily that the government should promote and help with population growth among their INDIGENOUS population. A few years ago, the South Korean government wanted companies to let workers go home earlier so they could spend more time with their loved ones in the hope of procreation. Unfortunately, without government subsidies to help offset the great expense that children are in first world countries, Koreans were and are like whites and Japanese, reluctant to have families of more than one child. If at all.

>The system is not meant to be fair or give you lots of disposable income to blow on toys and cigs. Or atleast it shouldn't.

Why do you hate freedom? The free market allocates resources more efficiently than government planned benefits. Government subsidies/regulations are the main reason the US is fat and that college costs so much. Sweden is becoming an unlivable hellscape for white students thanks to your government.

We weren't an educated country when we started this system. It was started by the Swedish speaking elite who owned all the country's wealth. You need an elite that gives a fuck about the country and wants to see it develop. American elites don't give a fuck about their fellow citizens.

>nordic model
It died in 1991. The impressive success that Sweden saw in the early 20th century to about 80-85' was not due to the Nordic model.

The Swedish economy had been building up for nearly a hundred years prior to it and laid the foundations for it. The immense economic growth was due to stability and market liberalization. THAT is what caused us to adopt the Nordic model, not the other way around.

Though as always with socialism, it only works until you run out of other people's money. Which it ran out of in 1991 and thankfully we buried most of it then. The Nordics and Sweden are comparably speaking very free markets nowadays. Freer than the US in many regards.

scandinavia ranks higher in economic freedom than the us.

...

>le Neoliberalism meme

I am painfully aware. However, their government burden is much higher.

>implying you weigh less than me (68kg and 1.88m tall)
>implying you know more about economics than me

>68kg and 1.88m tall
shoo shoo hungry skeleton

this is the one I meant to use, since the US runs a huge debt that has little effect thanks to our geopolitical situation

hahahaha fatass

In Sweden it has already collapsed once, and then one charlatan after the other have tried to fix it to no avail.

The (very rough) steps to Portuguese downfall:

>1578:
Alcácer Quibir - Lost most of the nobility and the army, because of a shitty arrogant king -> Iberian Union
Joint Iberian Armada against the Brits - Lost the ships to defend the empire and trade routes with.
Dutch cunt wrote about the trip on a journal and we got niggered out of our monopoly
Some recovery after the restitution of independence -> kings became shitty and arrogant again, wasted all the money on ostentatious buildings instead of developing the country.

>1755:
Earthquake - Half the GDP is spent on rebuilding Lisbon, lots of treasure lost, Army stops getting paid:
7 Year War against Spain and France (7 years after, too), peasants fought
French Invasions, little army there was was disbanded, peasants fought
Brazil independence - had to shift the economy to Africa and India, but couldn't establish monopoly or fund the industrial revolution.
Shitty kings again, pink map pisses people off

>1910:
Shitty kings dethroned for shitty republic instead
Salazar comes into power, builds up some money at the cost of the people starving and suffering
Finally gets rich enough to invest in the people, as opposed to the country - dies from a faulty chair.
Meanwhile we've been spending 20% of the budget on the army to keep the colonies, fighting the Soviet and American backed niggers

>1974:
Army/Commie coup ends the war, millions of able-bodied men (civilians and military) come back from the colonies and crash the economy/job market
Shitty presidents sucking money out of the EU to make better infrastructure, but the money ran out among their corrupt friends.

The Earthquake was just another stroke. All empires fall, was my point. There's just no way around it.

Still, it was a LOT of bad luck, and at least a bit more varied than Spain: Civil War -> French influence -> Civil War -> French influence ad eternum.

I'm thinking the way we redistribute probably ultimately favors the middle class and below but what do I know, I'm no economist.
I don't wanna be one of those spergs lecturing you on your own household's economy. But I will. At 35k SEK net income monthly you should be able to put aside 20k if you share apartments, that's 240k in a year. You can also deduct a lot if not all of the interest on your mortgage and the state gives you 1k per kid you have each month. I do agree though that the proof is in the numbers - we need more incentives for (actually swedish) familybuilding.

Nordic reich when? Make it happen.

Yeah it's not a one size fits all. It doesn't even fit us anymore since we became Dindustan. In the US, as it will increasingly become everywhere else, public spending is ultimately a race issue since noone wants to contribute to the commons when you're not a homogenous population.

You'd probably be called an authoritarian collectivist freedomhating KKK nazi commie for saying that in the US.

I'm not saying socialize everything. I dislike "muh freedumbs" because freedom has no intelligent guiding force behind it that molds society in a constructive way. With no direction (it doesn't have to be the state, it can be other institutions) your society is left to random whim and you end up with atomized people who aspire to nothing but their moment to moment impulses. Kinda like today. If we're to take birthrates as an example - in the past when you had to shit out kids to support you, you didn't have contraceptives, your wife was at home all day anyway etc you wound up with enough kids to replace yourself. Most developed countries are below replacement birthrates today. I believe modernity is incompatible with human nature and as such we need a guiding authority to provide context, incentives/disincentives and restraints.

The US has always been an unlivable hellscape for students thanks to your tuition fees.

EU has kind of made any kind of nordic union obsolete, and most likely swedish will sadly be dropped from official language status in 2020-2030

Why do you whine when you have everything so comfy?

>At 35k SEK net income monthly you should be able to put aside 20k if you share apartments

You don't happen to live in a second hand apartment in Stockholm do you? Our 2 roomer is 16 000 a month.

>centre
HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA

D. SEBASTIÃO
.
S
E
B
A
S
T
I
Ã
O

>because freedom has no intelligent guiding force behind it that molds society in a constructive way. With no direction (it doesn't have to be the state, it can be other institutions) your society is left to random whim and you end up with atomized people who aspire to nothing but their moment to moment impulses
You can say that about birthrates but I think the market really knows what's best as far as technology and productivity go. If it weren't for our welfare state and public education it is likely whites would even have a birth rate above replacement, and that hispanic immigration would never have become an issue.

>The US has always been an unlivable hellscape for students thanks to your tuition fees.
hahaahahahahaa no I don't think so. Our white college students have less debt than your average.
>qz.com/85017/college-in-sweden-is-free-but-students-still-have-a-ton-of-debt-how-can-that-be/
>pic related from brookings.edu/opinions/the-bigger-than-we-realized-role-race-plays-in-college-debt/

This, plus we don't have to deal with the whole SWEDEN YES thing

Complete Idiot. Let the moors use the same strategy on us that we used to use against everyone else.

The Spaniard nobles were talking shit to him, and he fell for it, the cunt.

I want D. João II back :(

Because we could be soooo much better off than we are, if not for the rising tide of commies and minorities running our government. Also, get the additional flags for Cred Forums addon. Maybe then you'll understand...

>nazi
To be fair you'd probably be called that in Sweden too if you espoused the idea of trying to get Swedes to procreate instead of importing africans

Not keen on the Nordic Model firstly because our trade unions aren't mature or sensible enough, secondly the very high level of public spending makes me uneasy. I don't think it's an efficient allocation of resources to go too far above 40% GDP. Only in emergencies.

But incentives aren't all we need to reach a sustainable birthrate. We probably need propaganda, putting women back in the home, perhaps even hurdles or restrictions to abortion and expanded adoption programs. Maybe even breeding programs. Whatever it takes.

I try not to envision the future on current trends. It's too disheartening. The EU is looking kinda shaky right now it seems. And I also think/hope people will eventually go apeshit at the state of things and elect some National Socialists or something. Couldn't get worse anyway. Maybe a racewar or a Peak Oil type event would be required to trigger that. Or maybe just reaching Peak Shitskin would suffice if people also realized our politicians have no interest in stopping let alone reversing the tide.

Oh you live in Stockholm? My condolences. Stay safe.
I live an hour down south. My 2roomer is 5200 :^)

>SWEDEN YES
Yeah you're just the source of cultural marxism and the historically white nation that's farthest along in white displacement. Have you prayed to your black chieftain today? Had your weekly nigger riot yet? Just joshing m8y. I feel for you.
I wonder how white swedes compare to white americans on debt. Students who live on loans and buy overpriced lattes and alcohol need to be gassed though. Welfare definitely needs big restrictions, perhaps a maximum time or money limit each X years or whatever - that would put a fire under the asses of our entitled layabouts. Unproductive "education" taken for funsies needs to be purged and replaced with STEM, trades, production.
>If it weren't for our welfare state and public education it is likely whites would even have a birth rate above replacement
Interesting. Maybe.

I pay 60% income tax and then a bunch of other luxury taxes for having a nice house and whatever.

>more than half of your income robbed form you

nah

the swiss model is the best

>meme

Then move somewhere else

>Using Jewish magic and banks to jew other countries out of their money so that you can live in luxury is the best model.

t. Forgot 2008

>Leaving one of the best countries in the world.
Where should he go? The only countries that can compete with Sweden would be Norway or Iceland (both are more expensive to live in than Sweden).

>It died in 1991.

Socialism != non-free market

>>implying you know more about economics than me

I am a professor of macroeconomics so...

socialism = non-free market 2bh

>Nordic model
Is that a Swedish man wearing a baby carrier holding his wife's son?

.....

Birthrates are correlated with family social spending.

Socialism with Chinese characteristics.

t. assblasted commie

Honestly, the reason may be envy.
I've read quite much about the Nordic model, it seems to work just fine, however the problem is: it would never work in a bigger and more populated country.
We will never see such model being applied in the US because it would cause economic collapse, not to mention third world countries like mine, that also have a cultural barrier.

If it works for you, good, enjoy it, consider yourself privileged (in a good sense).

Niggers

We are too ignorant oh wise ones