B Teams in the league dead for another decade at least

>In englel they don't and play so shitty games among them

In hindsight there's too much at stake in the Championship and by extention the two lower leagues because of the huge amounts of money at stake as opposed to the Spanish Segunda.

I don't see why it should ruin other clubs, it's not like b teams have much following if any at all. Also, regulations should prevent first team players playing with b teams (not the other way around) or you'll have turds like depay scoring 3 every week

Just buy some lower tier club to use as a satellite team instead of reserves. We used to do that all the time. Now we have B teams and it sucks.

but there is no money to be gained here by the b teams, it doesnt change anything because they cant get promoted or win prize money. and if the championship is as good as the media say it is then the team of kids wont even get into it nevermind win

I like how Spain handle there B teams.

But as you see with what's going on now. If it was suggested we use the same system, lower league teams would
Be in an uproar

Same shit, tbqh. More money in the eplel but more expenses too. It really is a non factor imo

i agree. but the english football fan is too stupid to get this. they try to pretend that whitehawk fc is just as important as arsenal and we need them

bad solution since you can't share youth players between both teams (very important for player development) and those fake b teams can win the league and be promoted and then what happens

B teams regularly win competitions. Just because they can't get promoted directly to their parent club's division, doesn't mean they can't aim to win. That's their best chance to be called up to the regular team anyway.

First teamers need a place to mantain their match fitness if they aren't getting games, so you can't regulate who plays there.

The issue is their existence means a hurdle in the other teams' goal that's controlled by the big boys.

Both systems have their pros and cons and none is perfect, but the spanish system tends to help youth development more imo

The Football League has been around for 125+ years now, it's not some farm league to simply shit all over, on the off chance it makes a few big teams' kids play better. Supporters don't want to see their historic clubs play B teams, look at the boycotts of the already unpopular FL Trophy.

>League 1/2
>unskilled

No. These lads are still in the top percentile of people playing football in this country.

It isn't though, you thick muppet. How about genuine investment in grassroots football? Kids in Spain and the Netherlands play at these massive, modern 3G facilities whilst most kids here lump around a Mitre ball on a muddy pitch too big for them.

Not to mention how the academies here always pick the 12-year old pace/height mutants and bin off anybody "too small" at 16.

Yeah, I forgot about that. Nevermind. It's just boring to see the same teams over and over again, and at least it's a different team.

>will not include teams from non-English leagues

NO PLEASE SAVE US FROM SCOTLAND TAKE CELTIC PLEASE

But what does that mean for Swansea and Cardiff?

Nothing, they're already in the premiership and football league. It just means there won't be anymore Welsh teams (or any scottish, which is heartbreaking).

if i supported a literal who team id much rather see my team play say manchester united than morcambe or something

more fans there, get to see the exciting future GOATS instead of 30 year old cloggers, say you got to see a famous team or player etc

>The Football League has been around for 125+ years now, it's not some farm league to simply shit all over
Its not shitting over it, its just evolving it. It'd essentially be the same league with a few more teams in it who can't make it to the playoffs.

Ofcourse its just a part of the problem, the lack of investment in coaching, grassroots shit, exporting players, etc needs a lot of work before England is semi decent

Fuck me, have you ever even been to a football match or do you follow >your team on Sky?

Them and by extension the other welsh teams playing in England would be involved because they are already in the league and so would be affected by any changes

people are acting like these youth teams will come and win the championship. there will be less than 10 of them that are good enough for league 1/2

>id much rather see my team play say manchester united than morcambe or something
Except you'd be seeing them play Manchester United B. The away game would end up being in a training ground and barely anyone would turn up. Who honestly has ever seen a match involving a reserve/youth team here?

So what, if there are ten extra places up for grabs the give them to the ten best conference sides.

not really mate. playing devils advocate here because i support the idea of B teams in lower leagues, but City Utd and Chelsea would fuck it all up by fielding 50mil B teams who stomp everyone. they could do this today without many additional player purchases.....

This, and playing against 30 year old lower division shitters wont improve young players, they're more likely to get their twink legs snapped.

I also couldn't give a fuck about international football and Engerland

this will make the fans of the 10 teams, which is say 100,000 happy

or you could use B teams, win the world cup and make 50m happy

not a hard choice

Aha, you're genuinely delinquent aren't you?

The place to mantain fitness is training. 90 more minutes of activity won't make a difference for a pro. Plenty of 'easy' games during the season or cup to get gameplay minutes. They can also be loaned out.

Also, there's regulations limiting the movement between a and b teams. For example, if barcelona b team has a difficult game, the a team can't simply send their players, it's not allowed once they have an a team contract. Nor can older 23+ players from b teams go to the a team. It all depends if the player is inscribed as part of the a or the b team, and these regulations help lower division and smaller teams not get bullied by succesful a teams with lots of players and money

The big teams are still businesses, they get nothing from just fielding a winning youth team, the goal is to actually develop your kids. Sure, they'd buy a lot of kids to play, but they already do that. It just means they'd have to invest TIME instead of money

How the fuck would this possibly help England?

id support b teams as a bolton. but only if they were only allowed to field english players. to end the 9001 years of hurt would be worth my team going down. and the whole 'real footy fan' thing is over rated

If you want them to be good or relevant in any way, you wont put them so low. B teams are useless if they are not in the division directly bellow the main team. The transition would just to big. We know, we tried both systems.

And believe me, B teams usually are good enough to play in their main club's respective division.

it would help with managers massively also... Giggs and GNev for example could ave done a few seasons in lower leagues in charge of UTD B, which could have kick started them onto something good

>win the world cup
You seem to be under the impression that these acadmeies are full of english players rather than just a collection of players bought in from around the world

Yea it's a good system for youth, I think the best is how baseball is done in the U.S. Where the lower teams are owned by the big ones.

You can slot a youth prospect into his current level and let him rise thought the ranks in games that people go to watch and cheer for.

It would be like if Prem teams all owned one of the current teams in all the lower leagues and there players.

>stick them straight in the championship
That would cause all kinds of hell to break to loose

well i imagine theyd put a premier league style foriegn player limit on it

surely that would be a cluster fuck, unless there is no promotion at all for the (7*20) lower league clubs owned by the prem big daddies

yeah this is another reason our managers suck. they righty dont wanna go down and manage kiddiminster harriers for 1k a week when theyre millionaires. a youth team would be a good test and theyd be interested to try

...

Ahh yes, the answer to our problems, sticking a load of pacy 17 year old niggers in the championship so they can win us a world cup. Someone get the daily mail.

>The place to mantain fitness is training
You need to play intense, competetive games to get to your best level, something teams don't do in training anymore.

>there's regulations limiting the movement between a and b teams.
Well ofcourse, but think from the perspective of the big club; you gain nothing from actually WINNING with your b team. You wanna improve your kids, playing older shitters does nothing for that.

We did it some years ago. 6 B teams directly into our 2nd division. We went from 16 teams to 22. Now we're used to it, and our youth national teams are doing great internationally.

Of course other clubs have B teams, but in much lower divisions.

lol, why the fuck would premier league sides ever play any of the youth they developed in their B teams when they could still just buy whatever the best players were from across the whole world?

This. Teams want ready made rather than investing in their own

hey fellas ITT,

you know 6+5 was abolished in 2010 right?

are there even any home grown type quotas anywhere in europe at the moment

they wouldnt be in the championship unless they were very good. its not like the championship is the salt of the earth anyway they have 10m players nowadays, surely enough to beat a 17 year old

No offensive intended but our 2nd division is a lot bigger than yours

the older shitters are 9001 times better than the kids they currently play against though

iron sharpens iron

No offense taken m8

if theyre good enough they will. the reason say west ham arent playing their youth is that its shit. if there was a 18 year old who was beasting vs some championship side of course theyd be inclined to play him because hed save them millions, and may become worth a lot of money

if they did this, a lot of the players the big teams developed would be signed by the lower league teams improving them too

theyd be foreign though

One more time; They, are, BUSINESSES. Its a lot fucking cheaper for them to buy 10 15 year old wingers for 300k each than spunk 30 million on Andros Townsend. Arsenal bought Bellerin for how much? Iwobi? Pennies. Even the ones they ship out like Gnabry end up costing nothing because you sell them for a lot more than you bought em for.

PL clubs currently have the entire world as a pool to draw players from. You think one extra club is goinng to make a difference?

Also I note you're going away from the England argument and talking about how this plan will save West Ham money now. Well fucking great, it's always pained me that West cunting Ham didn't get enough help. They should get a free stadium paid for by the tax payer too.

the FA would just make a rule that the b teams can only be comprised of england eligable players. they keep foreigners in the league because it makes them money, but foreign youth in the b teams doesnt do this

Where are you getting this from.

Also, you know there are already loads of teams in League One and Two comprised of England eligible players. They're shit.

Right so the B teams will be a way for PL sides to make more money, cool, that's helpful.

The premier league and championship should agree to just split from the football league. have the championship become the premier league B and add B teams from the premier league clubs

anything below the championship is pretty much irrelevant anyway

Thats why a player being brought up to fitness will normally play some kiddy games then slowly play against the big boys. Its important to have that option of less intense than proper competition but more intense than a training match.

>Its a lot fucking cheaper for them to buy 10 15 year old wingers for 300k each than spunk 30 million on Andros Townsend
They are a business. A business that needs immediate results. No fan thinks "oh, we're not challenging for the title/staying up, but it's ok because in 10 years time we might have someone decent"

Adding B teams is clearly the best way to make England competitive and for the talents to prove themselves.

Of course we wont do this for the risk of upsetting the 2k people who support some broke club in the 4th division.

And remember that they already have the option to start their own B teams at the lowest level and get them promoted, but they don't because it would take too long.

Care to explain how this would work? Don't forget to cite sources other than your own imagination.

the 16 year olds arent for now, they go in the b teams and develop. of course you still buy big names but the idea is that in 5 years those kids are good enough that you dont have to

>you need to play intense, competetive games
all teams (specially the top ones) have plenty of cup and other games every season to give minutes to their players (look at the cup games yesterday and the players used by most top teams). Loaning out is another option. 90 minutes against clearly inferior players won't give you much

> you gain nothing from actually WINNING with your b team
?! you got this backwards, it helps tremendously with youth development. And it also helps plenty with in house manager development and proper manager-player-club bonding. Poop, enrique both were b team managers at barcelona. Poop got them promoted from c to b and then brought pedro and busquets (and a few others) with him to the a team. Enrique got them their best result in b division (think he ended up second) and also had rafinha and sergi roberto with him iirc

Also, it's like playing football manager for club fans, having a good youth players coming through the ranks is very rewarding (and very cheap for the club)

uefa forces clubs to have a minimum of youth players

it helps with the development of national talent for the national team

also, without local youth players clubs end up being nothing but a collection of mercenaries for their customers

I'd rather never win the World Cup than have b teams, not that b teams would help us win it anyway

just fucking relegate the shittest 10 teams from league 2 and add the best 10 u23 teams from the premiership

I think the problems rather lie in slightly outdated facilities, and flopping players' careers by not giving them enough playtime (is solved through loaning them)

I'm also not sure what the difference would be between the B teams playing eachother (also note, B teams aren't always youth teams) and B teams playing normal teams, maybe players might get just a little bit stronger but I can't see much happening

How would this help England?

as a lower league fan i disagree. id much rather see my country win the world cup than my team win league 1

Who do you support?

Another half-baked idea on how to make England great, the tenth one this year.

If a PL club has a promising 17 year old he gets loaned to lower leagues anyway if he's not given a chance at his parent club.

England's problem is thinking the likes of Wilfried Zaha and Rashford are actually good and prioritising them

Very few teams actually operate on an immidiate success basis. You look Man Utd/City, Chelsea, Arsenal and maybe, for some reason Liverpool, no other team realistically goes into a season trying to win the league. There's how many teams in the EFL? There's a few strong teams in each division who expect success and would need to worry about the immidiate results, the rest think long term and mantaining the status quo

our youth players would be playing against decent opposition every week rather than an under23 of a championship side

>i'm a paki in london who bandwagons a multimillion prem club and never been to a match

This, if your club isn't good enough to kick a bunch of cocky academy players why the fuck should anyone protect their status? And if the argument is that smaller clubs would go under, then they never had enough fans to reasonable support themselves sustainably. This is football, where only the clinically ruthless survive, not a fucking charity league.

>Very few teams actually operate on an immidiate success basis
They are the clubs who are big enough and have the facilities to have a B team in the league though

Would they? I haven't seen any proposals of this nature, where are you getting this from?

but the loan system is just a poor mans version of this. its like having every one of the talented players on loan rather than 5 from each team

bradford. yes im white

>t. Poorfag football club fan

youre a fucking leeds bandwagoner from romania who goes to even less games are you serious

wish i could filter romania desu

Well every team isn't going to have a B team in the league, unless you want to double the whole size of it

Those clubs are all surviving.

Why should PL clubs be gifted an extra slot in the league?

Season ticket holder?

tempted to switch sides because hes agreeing with me. worst cunt in the lower league generals. you know youre a cunt when youre user and still everyone hates you

because it means england improve. its not for the good of the premier league teams its for the good of the national team

>it means england improve
Might

yeah we all happen to be one person, I'm not that bloke

l'm just comparing how this situation with how it would be if they brought B teams in our second league, a lot of teams with tradition would be thrashed around by Steaua B's for instance, everyone would be pissed, and lower league english teams anyway have a higher following than our lower league teams

The simplest. cheapest and easiest way to fix englands youth players being shit. nobody can come up with a better idea than 'muh grassroots' which they have no idea about or how to fix rather than pour 100bn into it

Right, well this is all in your head.

And even if it wasn't why would the PL sides ever do anything to help England?

Also, you're not a season ticket holder then?

im not that guy

...

Why are Premier League clubs going to fund development of English players with no benefit to themselves?

it does benefit them. but it benefits england as a by product because the players play for both the team and the national team

My dad is, but i use it 1/2 the time. .

why did they bother renaming the reserves to under-23s?

>because it means england improve

Explain why and how. "dey play gainst betta players" isn't an argument. Many, many PL youth players get loaned out and play against them anyway. It just leads to players getting passed from loan to loan and suddenly they're 27 and being released.

There is no evidence B teams actually work. The only notable example is Barca B but they're different

I don't see how it benefits them if they're forced to fund a team of English players that they're never going to play.

you guys need to think about this selfishly. england being good benefits you. league 2 teams getting fucked over doesnt harm you. win/win

why are they different? the loan fucks them because they go to 10 different teams with different styles and different tactics, methods everything and have to move every year. if they could play under the same manager, same team etc but play vs real teams that would be great for development. also only a few per team go on loan, this would be every player facing real competition

they get to play if theyre good enough. this is about improving them faster and them proving theyre good enough vs real players. the reason they never make it is they get to u21 level and stagnate cos the system is shit and doesnt work

shameful lack of patriotism ITT

God you are a fucking retard.

Is that you betamite you shitstain?

Only one of those was me, and im a spurs fan.

Dunno why you think only one user shares the same view

>no argument
>oh fuck im wrong on the internet better use a strawman

LEL im out. have fun

If the premiership teams want their young players to get experience why don't they just play them?

You may as well have left 20 mins ago because you've only been repeating the same uninformed shit arguments

Maybe if the premiership clubs hadn't blackmailed the lower league sides over the EPPP younger players might actually play on a regular basis rather than rotting in reserves

This.

EPPP is a fucking shambles.

Because too much is at stake every single game. The lack of a class-gap between the better clubs and mid-table/relegation teams prevents big clubs playing yuff.

>The lack of a class-gap
ayyyyy lmao when will this meme end

What do you mean? The competition is way too tight for the league's own good. Top teams need to get better and teams finishing lower in the league needs to get payed less.

Dammit I fell for the payed meme. paid*

You don't see the 7-0 drubbings of paella fc that you get every week in Spain anywhere near as often over here

sky babbies,everyone

How about these players don't sign for chelsea when they're 16. Did they think they were going to get first team action?