Just watched this for the first time

it should of have been set primarily in the Knightmare sequence.

Maybe Batman comes in after the Zod attack and shit occurred which has Lois killed. then Flash travels back and intervenes.

Tarkovsky is a legitimate genius, but that quote comes out sounding like pretentious, elitist drivel, basically saying "when I employ symbolism, it's an "artistic image," intended to evoke an emotional response. When other people use it, it isn't."

fucking pleb
i bet you didn't see the Ultimate Cut

I'm from Cred Forums and I love this movie. If I started this moment listing all the reasons why, I'd still be doing so 6 hours from now.

>They pick up on the obvious symbolism and conclude that anybody who dislikes the movie must have been too stupid to understand it. They write essays, broadly interpreting the themes and projecting depth onto a script that Goyer probably shat out over a weekend.

>If I started this moment listing all the reasons why, I'd still be doing so 6 hours from now.

Kek, you don't even have to make this shit up

It's a bad movie.

>Kek, you don't even have to make this shit up

How's this?

Lex's character in the comics started out as nothing more than your stereotypical labcoat-wearing mad scientist type out to rule the world. He was depicted that way for decades until the Donner films came along and re-imagined him as more of a flamboyant conman with delusions of a grandeur and a real estate scheme. A decade later, the comics followed suit, repackaging him as more of a shady business mogul that was very much a reflection of the 80's quintessential corporate fat cat.

Here's Lex in a transparent labcoat, giving him a layered appearance that's reflective of all his incarnations from past to present. One image.

No one with brain here like it

Great post desu familia.

You just don't understand the complexity of it OP.

What an argument lmao.

Being truthful to the original material doesn't make a movie automatically good. Good acting, dialogue, character development, pacing, editing, framing and composition, blocking etc make a movie good.

And bvs is a mess in most of those filmmaking elements.

good parody

*BRRRRAP*

Batman: Who farted? XD

I watched it for the first time today as well and I enjoyed it, though I usually hate capeshit.

Eisenberg does more acting in fifteen minutes of screen time than Bruce Willis has done over the course of his whole career, and I like Bruce.

As to your other points, framing and composition? Really? Did you even watch this film? And the characters getting developed here are Lex and Bruce Wayne. Both have arcs, one back towards the light, the other deeper into darkness, both directly in reaction to the existence of Superman.

I'd delve into the allegorical components at play, but to be quite frank with you, I'm sufficiently unimpressed with you to deem you not worth the effort.

Great post user

Look at the retard who is unironically proving you right

Eisenberg did zero acting in bvs, he was eisenberg.

Framing and composition is unoriginal, flashy just for the sake of spectacle and does not serve the purpose of the story. Literally copying comic book shots does not mean it's good.

MARTHA is not a character arc, Lex being more edgy is definitely not a character arc.

Please dwelve into it more, I am curious.

Tell me all about the obvious allegorical message of the film. It's just so on-the-nose and transparent, it should take you no more than a sentence.

I'll make it easy for you, though - why is the Batman being depicted so far outside his no-killing comfort zone? It's barely justifiable from the source material, but if your only response is "because muh grit," you're a lost cause.

Because they don't give a fuck about the source material and it needed to be more bombastic than Nolan's Batman. That was my impression anyway.

Maybe Goyer is a secret genius and he's just been pretending to be a hack-for-hire all these years.

>However, a lot of posters on Cred Forums are that crucial combination of stupid, but with a superiority complex.

DING DING DING

>does not serve the purpose of the story

What's the story?

>Please dwelve into it more, I am curious.
One of Bruce's first lines:"What falls is fallen." Has anything fallen in America's recent memory that's had a lasting societal impact?

HOLY SHIT

THE TWIN TOWERS

Okay I'm being meme'd on, good job 6/10 for the effort

DC comics in the movie industry?

911 allegories are so overdone that it was being parodied in Community, 6 years before BvS came out and played it completely straight.

Accurate. Then if something subtle flies over their heads it's 'boring, stupid, shit, pretentious, etc.'.

It's not a meme. Batman's being presented in a very unheroic light for a reason. Because he's an allegorical representation of the post-911 West. He's not heroic when he tortures, turns a blind eye to the fates of the people he brands and "convicts" without trial(Guantanamo), and justifies a "preemptive strike" on Superman based solely off where he's from and what he *might* do.

Neither are we. You cross those lines, you lose all right to consider yourself the good guy any more. At best, you might be the *better* guy, but you're certainly no hero.

Am I the only one who really liked BvS but didn't think it was smart or deep in any way?

I liked the overall tone and characters. Obviously not a master work worth putting tons of thought into but hey it was decently shot, a little different pacing wise, some really good scenes, good music, it wasn't THAT bad.

I'll never understand the crazy hate boner here. There are redeeming features far worse movies exist and have come out recently

Well what's the message in BvS then?

go back to /lit/ op, if you want a story

watch it again if you wish to be a patrician

>a lot of posters on Cred Forums are that crucial combination of stupid, but with a superiority complex
>a lot of posters
it's just me samefagging you gullible retard lol

I liked it for those reasons too, but not only for those reasons.

>I really liked it
>it wasn't THAT BAD

... doubleplus good...

>Watchmen was so cool! let's make more movies like that
>Oh, and I guess we have to shove all this DCEU crap in there too

Again, just my take on the movie. If you honestly enjoyed it, then I'm happy for you. Try to ignore the shitposters that try to get your goat.

BRAVO SNYDER

TRULY ONLY A VISIONARY LIKE HIM COULD MAKE DEEP 9/11 ALLEGORIES.

Dont be a newfag.

Everyone knows that "BvS,MOS,SS are good movies meme" threads are bait.

man of steel was decent

Let me array it for you, so you can understand.

____________Its shit_______its good
Praise it____max (you)s_____no (you)s
Shit on it____few (you)s____literal (you)s

As you can see the formula for the most (you)s is to praise shit.

>t. 14 year old marvelfag
Of course you didn't get it you fucking retard

It was forgettable, just like most capeshit movies.

Still, it was definitely miles better than BvS and SS.

You realize everyones making fun of you, right?

see >muh brand wars

good job proving him right

> Forcing yourself to like an absolute pile of dogshit movie just for the fact your are a manchild DCuck

don't you have some evansposting to do marvelfags?

I've been trying to articulate something like that for a while, but I've become lazy as fuck over years of hanging out with a progressively younger demographic.

You shame me sir.

In light of what's pretty inarguable about Batman, what's that have to say about the other principals and what they represent?

Don't be afraid. It's hard to engage in reasoned discourse because honesty leaves you feeling vulnerable even behind a veil of anonymity, but step out from behind that cynicism you use to mask your insecurities and see if you can surprise yourself.

You realize how little I care, right?

You honestly have to go back.

Snyder uses generic fresh out of film school rookie symbolism in his movies.
"Yeah religion is deep right guys? Ill go with that."

And im well aware that the essays people write about MOS,BvS,and SS are bait and memes, but lets try to loo at it like if they are serious for a second...

Thats like those "Artists" that try to pass off random garbage as art.
Like some wacky artist that thinks his shit dont stink.
Lets say this artist has a white canvas. He mixes his shit with some soft pastel colors.
Then this artist uses his cat as a paint brush and smears the shit paint into its tail.
Throws the cat into the canvas and lets the cat runaround "paining" the canvas.
Then he throws a couple of eggs at the canvas, and lets it dry.
Then he invites other clueless jack ass "art" lovers, and they all applaud him and say what a work of art this is.

This is Snyder and DCucks in a nut shell.

>"Yeah religion is deep right guys? Ill go with that."

What if it's being used to indicate things that aren't typically thought of as a religion?

That's fucking sad. That's the best you have to offer? Empty phrases you just mechanically parrot like some masterwork of behavioral psychology? Can you even speak to people on the street?

As for reddit, let the kids have their fun. I'm speaking to you as one man to another. Why is that so terrifying to you? Do you not realize how pathetic that is, to not even be able to engage in an honest dialogue when there's quite literally nothing at all to lose?

I screencapped this so I don't have to say the same thing everytime someone tries to tell me BvS was kino

It sucks

...

>and I've seen a lot of movies
seems like you really haven't

>This is honestly the worst movie I have ever seen and I've seen a lot of movies.

Holy hyperbole Batman!

>What falls...is fallen.

this is some high iq poetry we're dealing with

2/10 troll attempt

Stale B8 friendo, Its not the best movie ever but its better than most people here give it credit for.

>Civil War will be nominated for (and win) Academy Awards
>BvS got beaten by Finding Dory

So not comic books or superheros?

>This is honestly the worst movie I have ever seen and I've seen a lot of movies
The first part of that sentence, pretty much proves the later false.

>BvS is full of on-the-nose symbolism.
such as?
>Most viewers get tired of Snyder bashing us over the head with it,
you overestimate the percentage of people who dislike it
>sloppy editing
Your only valid point
> They pick up on the obvious symbolism and conclude that anybody who dislikes the movie must have been too stupid to understand it.
Because its true.
>projecting depth onto a script that Goyer probably shat out over a weekend.
And this is projection

Its pretty rare for movies about action figures ineffectually slap-fighting for seven minutes to have so high pretense of being able to go so far up their own asses they come out their mouths, only to explode before their head even touches their anus.

To say, a few movies have turned people's expectations of their genre inside out. But BvS managed to do the exact opposite while literally drenching itself in more pretense than should've been possible.

Have you ever actually listened to Goyer talk about screenwriting?
youtube.com/watch?v=fVbFgN5p4KY

For the most part, he really doesn't give a fuck about characterization and dialogue. Its kind of hilarious the way you people put him on a pedastle.

>They write essays, broadly interpreting the themes and projecting depth onto a script that Goyer probably shat out over a weekend.

Case in point, this was an easter egg about the place where one of Superman's creators was born (confirmed by Clay Enos, Snyder's photographer).
Kinoposters wrote walls of text about how it was a whale representing Superman as Batman's Moby Dick.

Not quite. It's about the dichotomy of perception and reality, at least on one level.

looks more like a drumstick

...

nice made up story faggot.

... which is bog standard in comic books and stories about superheros...

>>that crucial combination of stupid, but with a superiority complex
>tfw someone describes you so perfectly it's almost like he knows you

Sheeeeeit.

If that blew your mind, go goggle "dunning krueger effect."

Please shut the fuck up

People who attempt to intellectualize this movie (and capeshit in general) are just the fucking worst. It's the same species of person who is super into steampunk or Dr. Who. Something about it just sucks the dignity out of life.

Pretty much this

So what you're saying is everything's been done. Bravo. Your inevitable smug reply has has also been done, so I imagine you'll be sparing us the agony of repetition.

>There's something about capeshut that in my opinion sucks the dignity out of life. I wish I could audibilize it better, but there it is. I feel about capeshit the same way I feel about fast food. I just think it's disgusting, and if we're really going to be pigs with no standards then why don't we all just kill ourselves.

>The rain doesn't stand for anything
>It only expresses

Never go full retard

Honestly, the problem with most Cred Forums posters is that they don't actually think about what they're seeing. Things are taken at face value and assessed against empirical evidence (Snyder's interviews, thoughts), instead of being analysed as pieces of art. This has lead to tons of total misinterpretations of Snyder's flicks. Like Prometheus, BvS will be remembered as a true kino masterpiece in hindsight.

>kino

you have to go back to R*ddit

In that image he looks like a mad scientist

How does he look like a shady business mogul?

The gaudy shirt underneath, showing through the lab coat. This Lex is the faux quirky tech millennial brand of mogul.

>Martha is not a character arc

This is why people who criticize the movie look like fucking retards. Were you even paying attention?

Batmans mother dying is literally the first thing that happens in the movie, and is reference throughout. Batmans haunted by the memory of it and the feeling of powerlessnes s that it accompanies.

Martha is what drives Batman throughout the whole goddamn move. Like they bash you over the head with it constantly, so you're choosing the dumbest argument you can think of when you say it's not an arc.

Lex's motivation was muddled so I'll give you that one.

oh, of course

I should have known by the polkadots

He's right though retard, sorry the movie has movie has more than your beloved baby-tier captain ameretard omygodquips!!1!

You have no argument faggot

>Lex's motivation was muddled
As a point of fact, I don't think it was muddled. I think it was outright obscured. The audience gets all the clues they need to piece it together, though.

Agreed, but even it weren't it shouldn't matter, not everything has to be perfectly explained. That's what's frustrating, people are choosing the most petty things to complain about. This movie has legitimate issues for sure but they aren't nearly bad enough to bring down the movie.

It was the same shit with Man of Steel. That came out the same year as Iron Man 3, and despite IM3 getting tons of hate for the rediculous bastardization of the villian, people forgave it and it was critically accepted. People won't even give MoS an inch to this day

That's the joke.

The problem is that those who say BvS at the same time praise Marvel movies.
Neither DC nor Marvel are "kino", but BvS is still miles ahead of any turd marvel came up with. It's all about relative evaluation of quality

>b-but MAHVEL
Typical DCuck.

>All these plebs in this thread

BvS is a modern masterpiece. There's a reason people say it went over your head, because it did.

Sorry about your bad taste, bro.

>I don't have anything to say, but hey, if I post an ebin meme I will definitely prove to every stranger on the internet that I am not retarded
typical underage redditor

My only complaint was Doomsday and the reason behind it. Why not a super suited Lex? WHY DIG UP ZODS CORPSE AND WHY BRING BACK THE STUPID ALIEN SHIP WHICH CLARK SHOULDA TOOK THE FUCK AWAY ANYWAYS?!?! THEY BLEW IT!!!!!!!!

>This is honestly the worst movie I have ever seen and I've seen a lot of movies.
>the worst movie
>I've seen a lot of movies.

Yea, no. To say it's the worst you've ever seen means you either haven't seen a lot of films or you're just being disingenuous.

The worst aspect of BvS is that it was underwhelming. That's all it is.

BvS, was a trash movie. What exactly was Lexus plan after doomsday killed Superman? What was his plan for also trying to call more superpowered people to Earth?
They also spend like two thirds of the movie trying to flesh out Let's hate towards Superman. But nothing ever makes sense. He just comes off as a spoiled brat spewing religious Bible lines that make no sense and there's no real motivation why he doesn't like Superman.
Trash movie all around.

I love seeing faux intellectual pieces of shit try their hardest to tear down BvS and constantly regurgitate the "muh symbolism" crap.

Says a lot about their intelligence if all they got from the film was the symbolism.

I present you all to the trilogy of Shitkino

Are you talking about DCfags or the anti-DCfags?

>all these low IQ BvS apologists

If anything this is just evidence that people on Cred Forums need to watch more film because they're very, very easily impressed.

People who shit on BvS aren't even able to get what the movie is really about. The constant sperging about symbolism says it all.

He doesn't just hate him. He envies him. He's after what Superman has, and I'm not talking about his physical power, though I don't rule out the possibility that Lex might have eventually come up with a way for Kryptonian tech to give him that, too.

What he coveted was Superman's place in the new paradigm, something his self-serving philanthropy couldn't bring him. He wanted to save the world,, even if it was from a threat of his own manufacture, using metahuman proxies as his catspaws.

I guess these movies that are based on Kids characters in kids cartoons are viewed as deep by some fucking DC retards Kek.
Did you guys flunk out of 3rd grade?

>DUDE GOD LOL

What is the movie is really about?

Is this picture a parody of people overanalyzing BvS?

I honestly can't tell at this point.

>DUDE WHAT IF BATMAN AND SUPERMAN'S MOMS HAD THE SAME NAME LAMO
>There are people that defend this
Loving
Every
Laugh

Men in costumes fighting. The rest is filler

Glad to know there were others who understood it correctly as well

On one level, it's about how deconstructionism and realism are the death of myth. This is the story of how a hero chose his world and forced it to make sense, elevating a mundane, gritty, cynical world into a more hopeful, magical place that again has room for myths, monsters, and larger-than-life heroes.

On another level, it's a story about how the ultra-rich of the world will continue to exploit the absence of meaningful dialogue between the East and the West for their own selfish ends.

On yet another level, it's about how true heroism has to be born not from what others expect of you, but what you want and expect from yourself. It's about choosing your world and facing the consequences of your actions, even if that means taking up the spear and killing the monster born of your past actions(or lack thereof).

WHAT

FALLS

it's both dummy

The text is possible proof that at least someone on their team is aware of the meme. The image itself is Lex's private files. It appears he was already looking forward to a time he could commercially "brand" the brave heroes who were going to stop the alien threat.

Lex fumbled. Amanda Waller picked up the ball and ran it back.

>The text is possible proof that at least someone on their team is aware of the meme.
no

it isn't

WW = 4Us is an /x/-tier stretch, you don't realize how ridiculous you sound

I AGREE

Two double-ues being four u's is a stretch? Jesus. Just for the record, you just said it wasn't even possible that it's suggestive if anything. Not even possible.

I'm the unreasonable person in this conversation?

Best answer ever.

>Two double-ues being four u's is a stretch?
yes
it fucking is

especially when "4U" isn't even the original line. It's "for you".

You're so deep into this that you don't realize how retarded you sound. Seriously, put yourself in the shoes of the director or the cinematographer or the prop designer or whoever
>How do I make a reference to Baneposting...
>I know! I'll put 2 W's next to eachother! Those super sleuths on Cred Forums will realize that I actually intended for them to be 4 Us, which kind of sounds like "for you"

>yeah, but MARVEL
It's 2016, we all have access to the internet. Nobody will take your word for something when we have access to literally millions of other opinions in an instant. Opinions that disagree with yours.

Are you trying to say that autist lex is comic accurate? You are an imbecile

Do you even algebra? Regardless, it was just something funny that someone noticed. It's not like I made the image myself, and it's not even the reason I posted it.

And one more time, you're saying it's not even possible. All I'm saying is that it is. The level of obstinance you're exhibiting is pretty much exactly what I expect from anyone who hand-wave dismisses everything the fans point out as just more coincidence.

No, I'm saying that he's perfectly in keeping with the tradition of re-invention that originated with Donner, but thanks for making your utter lack of reading comprehension so apparent to everyone.

Why do people think BvS was pretentious? Compared to Civil War (which was basically the same movie thematically) its morality is way more black and white.

BvS seems artsy on the surface but after the first 20 minutes it never even plays with the idea that maybe the superheroes need to be under government control. Superman is framed for the murders in the desert and everything bad that happens is a plot by Lex, who is never portrayed as being anything but evil. The whole movie is really about Batman realizing Lex set him up and teaming up with Batman to fuck him up.

Meanwhile Civil War, which has half its heroes castrated and bowing to the UN, plays at having some sort of political depth (discuss the Sokovia Accords for 2 minutes before choosing sides), which is both poorly done and totally unwarranted in a fucking superhero movie. They are also manipulated by the main villain but the main disagreement and rift between the heroes is never resolved.

BvS is a complete popcorn flick and I fear the only reason people realize it is because it is literally darker (color grading wise, Civil War had Bucky punch an old man to death and choke his wife) than Marvel films.

people dont* realize it

>The problem is that those who say BvS at the same time praise Marvel movies.

No, we don't.

>BvS is still miles ahead of any turd marvel came up with

No, it's not. They're all shit. Adding foul language, bloody violence, half-assed visual symbolism, and a dark filter to a Marvel movie will not make it good. It misses the point of why Marvel movies are trash, yet that's exactly what Snyder did.

People will run through insane mental gymnastics to convince others this movie is good, but it's just not. Everything from the cinematography and shot framing to the pacing, the direction of actors, the grave importance given to the spectacle of men in clown suits slapping each other - all of it conveys the work of a director who knows little about any of these things pandering to an audience who consumes media like they consume fast food. The type of person who finds the stilted "Her name is Martha!" scene poignant, or the beginning montage artful ("What falls is fallen"? Really?), or any part of Eisenberg's embarrassing performance satisfactory is not the kind of person who has any authority to talk about art.

Cred Forums shit posters, same reason we have 3 Star Wars Prequel apologist threads.

Visually a lot of it was pretty cool, except the PS2 monster. But the story is a mess. If you had no idea who these characters were before the movie, no one would defend it. Its just that a lot of fags here are diehard DC fans and can't look at it objectively. Also they have this retarded rivalry with Marvel so they'll convince themselves its better.

>And one more time, you're saying it's not even possible.
Why are you projecting like this? I just said it was a massive stretch. Which it is, I don't think you actually disagree me here.

I also don't think you disagree that there are people who make these massive stretches and then treat them like established fact, using it to springboard into absurd interpretations of Snyder's "pastiche of meme culture".

Humans are pattern-seeking creatures. Its coded into our DNA. When you looks for connections, you're probably going to find them. What's annoying are the people who spam these "connections" and refuse to consider any other interpretation of the scene, no matter how retarded theirs is.

WW is also stand for the initials of William Wilson. CIA's name.

And yet said reinvention here is utterly terrible and embarrassing to watch.

Civil War is a bad movie. But it gets a pass because it's the 10th movie in the MCU.
If it was say, the 2nd movie. It would have bombed because nobody was invested in the characters.

A lot less had to be set up, because the movie is part of a larger story that started about a decade ago.

Also yes, DC was darker, but not only in color. It was trying to be this dark movie with retarded philosophy.

> Superman is framed for the murders

Nigga, Superman straight up kills that warlord

If you'd been alive to see Hackman's performance without 4 decades of acclimation, you'd say exactly the same thing.

>if you look for patterns, you'll find them

You don't have to look for patterns very hard when they are self evident. Pic related, bush publicly declaring he did 911

EXACTLY

The black lady accuses Superman of torching her whole town and killing her family. No one gave a shit about the warlord.

I've seen hackman's performance and it is incredibly hamfisted, yet charming in a way. No way THE lex Luthor. My definitive Lex is the DCAU version, voiced by Clancy brown who is the businessman type, yet manages to have such a powerful presence. Far superior to Lex's autistic speeches and HMMMMMMMS

>his mommy has the same name!
terrible execution by Snyder

Cred Forums, and Cred Forums in general survives on channelling levels of contrarianism most people aren't even aware exists. The widespread panning of BvS by both critics and audiences, paired with the runaway success of the MCU has forced Cred Forums to make Dawn of Justice into the second coming of Christ in response. I highly doubt that there are anywhere near as many genuine Snyderfags as there are ironic memesters pretending to be one, but the net result is that Cred Forums retains its position as holding the diametric opposite opinions of the normies, even when those opinions are the most fucking retarded imaginable.

TL;DR: autists pretend to love Batfleck vs. Martha cause Chad is a Marvelfag.

>9gag
>Anyone that disagrees with me is continarian
You have to go back

>the US government just leaves the ship sitting there for 18 months
>only THE GENIUS lex luthor can figure out maybe they need to impersonate a kyrptonian to get access

So everyone in the snyderversre is completely retarded. Great. Thanks zack.

>Also yes, DC was darker, but not only in color. It was trying to be this dark movie with retarded philosophy.

That's precisely what I'm disagreeing with. BvS was plain and simple black and white good guys vs bad. You know who to root for. It didn't have as many quips as Civil War but the "deep philosophical themes" are the same in both movies. Batman doesn't think someone as powerful as Superman should be allowed to do as he sees fit (Team Stark), Superman feels that he has a duty to put his powers to use and do whats right (Team Cap). The difference is that all this is basically dropped after the Martha scene and the good guys team up to beat the bad guy in a huge CGI fight. Complete popcorn flick tier slugfest and what you expect from a AAA Superhero movie. Meanwhile Civil War commits to these themes till the end (not a good thing), so we get a bunch of lackluster fights where we know no one is going to die because its still a Marvel flick and they have to shit 3 more out by the end of the year.

BvS doesn't have any scenes that are as dark as Tony watching his parents death tape or the main villain (cant even remember his name) trying to off himself with a bullet to the brain stem.

My issue isn't "everything's been done," my issue is "everything snyder has done has been done better with less resources."

I actually wouldn't mind seeing more batfleck, if only for a bunch of fight scenes and for more gravelly sarcasm from jeremy irons

Nice catch!

I'll update the image

What base nihilistic decadent drivel.

>le 9gag boogerman
>can't even spell "contrarian"

Burgerclap its passed your bedtime.

>what is PTSD

>what are trigger words

Marvelfags sure are a smart bunch

so in the decades batfleck has been batman, no one ever said "martha" and triggered him.

seems kinda contrived, don't you think?

>seems kinda contrived, don't you think?
yes, very.

No one is arguing that Marvel is good. What is being argued is that if you swapped the characters and setting in BvS with completely original characters and original setting but changed little else, absolutely no one would defend it because behind the childhood comic book nostalgia and cultural baggage that goes along with established characters, it's just a shit film. Which is something completely evident to the people who saw it that are not fans of comic books or superheroes.

Add onto that Cred Forums's inherent tendency toward contrarianism, and the fact that Cred Forums just generally has bad taste because they exclusively consume bilge, and you have the perfect storm of absurdity.

Not proven

>Raiden tackles a dude as fast as a moving car through multiple concrete walls.
>not dead

not to mention it gets longwinded (you)s. Like yours.

It's not just the word idiot, it was the situation. Batfleck was about to kill superman, who he thought was just some alien. He was in a vulnerable and emotional state, so when he said Martha it threw him off guard.

Jesus it's like explaining Finding Nemo to a 6 year old.

Superman could have used his arm to bust a hole in the wall.

Later in the movie he said he didn't kill those men so it's not a huge leap in logic to assume he didnt.

>BvS doesn't have any scenes that are as dark as Tony watching his parents death tape or the main villain (cant even remember his name) trying to off himself with a bullet to the brain stem.

Yea not like one of the main heroes died or anything. Or a building full of civilians and government officials exploded. Or one of our main heroes actually witnessed the death of his parents.

Don't get me wrong I'm not saying CW's had less impact, I'm just saying you cant pretend like BvS didn't.

This

He still close lined the dude like a truck hit him. He's for sure fucking dead

>ready to kill
>vulnerable and emotional

... yea that's not the mindset a person enters when they're about to come to the conclusion of a premeditated murder.

>REEEEEEEEEEEEEE

>he still thinks superman died

... did you just walk out during the funeral scene cause you thought it was the credits?

>Yea not like one of the main heroes died or anything

implying he won't be back in the next installment like the cheap DBZ cliffhanger franchise this is, did you forget we're talking about capeshit? did you forget the final scene of the movie?

I am utterly convinced that the people defending these movies are of a lower intelligence level and there is no point in arguing with them; you will not convince them that capeshit is anything other than the equivalent to comically dressing up a child in adult clothes that are too baggy for him and masquerading him around the house

Well yeah he technically didn't but I was referring more to the emotional weight of the scene.

WTF are you saying?? The Martha scene is the worst movie scene ever... it was terrible, stupid and ridiculous

>Yea not like one of the main heroes died or anything.
Literally wut?

see

The only way that scene could have emotional depth is if you had just forgotten how hard snyder had hammered the "superjesus" bullshit for two full movies.

How the fuck could you not know supes wasn't going to really die?

its just inconsistent storytelling

Snyder didnt intend for Superman to kill those men, but he also wanted a BROODLE action scene of Supes smashing him through the wall

So what does Snyder do? He just keeps the scene and has Superman exposit about it later. Visionary filmmaker.

>Or a building full of civilians and government officials exploded.
It becomes a little tonedeaf when you had this shit going on constantly for like 45 minutes in MOS.

Baseless claims. Superman can catch people at high speeds without harming them. You are simply assuming he killed him because reasons

>Yea not like one of the main heroes died or anything
how stupid are you

But I am one of those people and I liked it.

Was impressed with some of the fight choreography as I haven't seen a mainstream action flick in a long time.

>Superman can catch people at high speeds without harming them.
how?

>Visionary filmmaker.

They're just trolling. At least that's what I tell myself.

OK Mr psychologist, look at the way batman was acting after the fight. Did he seem perfectly calm and collected to you.?Did he not just finish fighting a near god who he had been having nightmares about, nightmares involving superman KILLING HIM?

Jesus you are literally retarded.

Good job, you correctly sleuthed the problem.

You have no argument except memes.

Typical Marvel autist.

> Tackling someone at super speed while also having super strength and smashing the person with his back exposed through 3 solid concrete walls = that person being fine and alive.

wtf am i reading.

Son, the problem you're having here is you're attempting to impress human emotions on a fictional character written by a guy who openly admits to not giving a single fuck about organic development or consistent characterization.

Unless you're meme'ing on me and trying to paint the "we besties now" bullshit as intentional on the part of snyder.

>cacheing the file (with no survivors)

Feel free to post all the instances of people presenting a story whose metanarrative is about how the first Golden Age superhero died for the sins of 90s fanboys' obsession with deconstructionism. grit, "realism," and morally ambiguous "heroes," and by his sacrifice, elevates a deconstructionist Nolanverse-type world into a truly comic book world, thereby becoming not actual Jesus, not "space Jesus," but very much "comic book Jesus," ushering in a Heroic Age and a resurgence of magic, while simultaneously presenting a fairly on-point allegory for the current state of affairs between the East, the West, and the people who profit off the lack of meaningful narrative between the two.

Take all the time you need.

>get laughed at
>y-you have n-no arguments!!

> Yea not like one of the main heroes died or anything

They literally start backtracking within 10 minutes of his death by making it ambiguous, and they drain all the emotion from the scene by making it as hackneyed and cliched as possible.

SLOW MOTION
PEOPLE WE DON'T KNOW CRYING
BEN AFFLECK LOOKING LIKE HE NEEDS TO TAKE A SHIT IN THE BACKGROUND

> Or a building full of civilians and government officials exploded

Did you not catch how they took time to tell us how no one was in the area whenever there was a fight scene?

When Wonder Woman is on the plane, the news anchor literally says "It sure is a good thing everyone went home for the day, and there's no one in those buildings!"

When Doomsday landed on that island, they even specified that the island had been uninhabited for decades.

> Or one of our main heroes actually witnessed the death of his parents.

Which is the biggest joke in comic books. And, again, it's done in slow motion during the opening credits, which robs it of any emotional weight.

BvS is Dragonball Z for retards. And Dragonball Z is already Dragonball Z for retards.

Don't forget MoS.

No one has made a movie like that. And certainly not zack snyder.

...

says you. First you say it makes no sense, then when it's explained to you you claim it's stupid.

You have no argument except

>HUR it sucks!

Adults usually have good reasons for calling something stupid just saying kid

That's strange. I own a copy of it. Maybe I'm from the Berenstein-verse.

...

It's not inconsistant, it's a movie about superhumans fighting and you have a problem with a superhuman pushing a guy through a wall and talking about it later and it suddenly breaks the whole movie for you.

You must be fun at parties

I think it has something to do with him being SUPERMAN

Idk just a guess

You bought a copy of your own headcanon? How'd you manage that?

>Or a building full of civilians and government officials exploded.

I can't believe no one has pointed out that this is exactly what happened in Civil War.

well I mean, falling isn't what kills you

its the rapid deceleration when you hit the ground

Simple, he's Zach himself

>oh shit, I don't have any arguments
>I know, I'll act like hes being unreasonable for allowing that one scene (whos importance I'll minimize to the fullest extent) is the only reason he hates the movie!

you sure dodged a bullet there.

>his mommy has the same name!
you can try rationalize that scene all you want but the execution was fucking garbage

Count how many references are made to "the world" over the course of the film. If you want to pretend that every last one of them never has a double meaning, that's perfectly fine. It just means you're a little unimaginative.

>Why are you fucks memeing this movie so hard

That's the whole point though.
BvS is still way better than CW though.

At last I truly see.

The character is written as a human. Humans have emotions. You can follow his emotional arc throughout the movie up to that point and it makes perfect sense. Suddenly because he's batman he doesn't have emotions?

You're just taking something Snyder said outside the movie and extrapolating it over anything you didn't like in the movie. You know Snyder isn't the only one involved in the writing of the movie right?

This is borderline autistic but here we go:

>They literally start backtracking within 10 minutes of his death by making it ambiguous, and they drain all the emotion from the scene by making it as hackneyed and cliched as possible.

maybe, but the scene itself is pretty powerful in my opinion

>SLOW MOTION
>PEOPLE WE DON'T KNOW CRYING
>BEN AFFLECK LOOKING LIKE HE NEEDS TO TAKE A SHIT IN THE BACKGROUND

So since the characters aren't behaving like you want them to and some are not main characters, all emotion is nulled. ok.

>Did you not catch how they took time to tell us how no one was in the area whenever there was a fight scene?

>When Wonder Woman is on the plane, the news anchor literally says "It sure is a good thing everyone went home for the day, and there's no one in those buildings!"

>When Doomsday landed on that island, they even specified that the island had been uninhabited for decades.

What does any of that have to do with the building that exploded mid movie?

>Which is the biggest joke in comic books. And, again, it's done in slow motion during the opening credits, which robs it of any emotional weight.

all opening scenes in movies are there for no reason and even less for emotional impact... got it.

Son, what you are doing is not interpreting the movie. What you're doing is generating nonsense to make sense of the nonsensical.

Please dont compare Dragonball to BvS is offensive to Toriyama sensei, DBZ was never pretensious about itself

Oh so simply by laughing at someone you are automatically correct and have no obligation to refute my arguments?

High school must be a bliss

...

>because nobody was invested in the characters
But I'm STILL not invested in Marvel's characters. The only one I cared remotely about was Norton's Hulk, and they recasted him.

BvS wasn't even truthful to original material, lol. It was mix of non-canon shitty universes.

Include my posted reply number in the posterity cap

how the fuck cant Snyder understand characters made for children?

Meme away user, I see that you have no logical response

Thanks for throwing the argument

>marvel babbies still whining

People fear what they do not understand

>the scene itself is pretty powerful in my opinion
is not since we dont like or care for Superman it actually seems like the world would be better without a invulnerable raging asshole

>When this newspaper was founded, it stood for something.
>So could you if it was 1938.

>This symbol means something.
>It did on my world. My world doesn't exist anymore.

>This creature comes from another world. My world.

And pic related. If you're too blind or willfully obtuse to see it, that's on you.

So you're expecting scientific accuracy in a movie about Superman and Batman fighting?

Ok

I'm actually excited for Justice League because I'm curious what a Snyder quipfest would actually look like. I don't think he's ever done humor.

Son, the reason you're having trouble convincing others of your headcanon is because its only compatible with your mind. It requires the whole of who you are, all your experiences and memories to take hold.

You generated it for you. No one else will ever share it.

SO DEEP

BRAVO

hes tried humor in every movie. Its been embarrassing.

The fact that we're arguing about this and not anything else makes it pretty evident this that's it's fairly important to you.

Anymore greentext?

this is my very own copy+pasta. its about both MoS and BvS. enjoy

First off I really enjoy seeing Superman grow. Him growing into the ultimate hero is rarely explored, and is some of the best parts of Birthright and Secret Identity. I like that through MoS and BvS, Superman's arc has followed the heroes journey almost to a t. To the point where the metaphorical death and rebirth becomes literal. One of the key elements of the heroes journey is that at the end the hero brings back the "boon" or "elixir" making the world a better place. I believe that exactly this will happen, that the plan from the beginning, at least once they started conceptualizing or entertaining the idea of a larger shared universe, was to have Superman bring the world, one that intentionally tries to reflect our own, to a better place, one that more reflects a more classic heroic setting.

1/6

> "Is she with you? I thought she was with you"
> "(After SuperDouche destroys a military satellite and leaves tons of wreckage for the same military to clean up) " I thinks he kinda cute" *blushes*

> "HONKA HONKA!"

For example, Superman is put in a no win situation by Zod in MoS. Zod tells Superman he is going to have to kill him or else people die. Flat out forcing Superman to choose between humans and kryptonians. Superman killed Zod of course, mirroring a moment from Byrne's Man of Steel run, but not without it coming back to haunt him in the form of Doomsday. In BvS Superman is presented with yet another ultimatum, kill Batman or Martha dies. This time Superman chooses the third way, learning from the first time with Zod, and instead decides to be honest with Batman and ask him for help. They even illustrate this arc within Superman further by having him first just trounce Batman's Batmobile and order him to stop (since with Zod all the at worked was overpowering him). That doesn't work, so next time he sees Batman he tries to talk to him, but suffers for making the mistake of once again just using force. But he again makes the mistake of fighting back, and again pays for it. But once he finally stops trying to fight and just asks for help "to save Martha" he starts winning Batman over. And its not until Lois, Superman's loving anchor, is even more honest, revealing Martha to be his mother, does Batman finally help him. Superman, then, ultimately has to sacrifice himself because of the mistake he made in MoS. This does another thing I really adore about the movies, it takes iconic parts from the comics and synthesizes them into one narrative without making them just empty shoutouts, it instead uses these moments to add to the narrative and themes. And its not just moments like what I mentioned above from Byrne

2/6

>it sucks because I say so! And no amount of rational argument coming from you can convince me otherwise!

wow you must be a lawyer or something

One of the best examples of such integration of the comics is how it uses key scenes from Dark Knight Returns (even doing a 1:1 remake of the death scene) as way to deconstruct it. I know for a lot of people deconstruction is a trigger word, so if you want you can instead say an inversion. While DKR had Batman very much in the right, BVS puts Batman on the wrong side. BvS turns Batman into the reactionary stooge that upholds the status quo, which was Superman's role in the comic. They also have the same dead Robin plot point, but this Batman never gets a new one. Batman fights Superman, but this time he goes in with the purpose of killing Superman instead of faking his own death. When Superman is nuked, it is from America instead of the commies, and he willing takes a blast to defeat a monster instead of trying to defend the earth. He also rejuvenates from the sun in space instead of sucking solar energy from Earth (as he does in the comic). And last but not least, in BvS Superman dies with a hint of him coming back instead of Batman. This kind of engagement with the past and with the stories that came before, the homages and commentaries on past comics, that is one of the aspects that makes the long 75+ years of Batman and Superman so fantastic to me, and BvS carries on in that tradition.

3/6

Oh, god, this post and this hread. Snyderfags went full damage control and still trying to prove that BvS wasn't pretentios generic transformer-like flick

I actually agree with you on that

I'm sure you're all sick of reading this, but now that I've typed so much I figure I'll continue with a few other bits I enjoy. To go back to Superman redeeming Batman, there is an intended meta element to it too I feel. Batman is an old character in BvS, and he is an old character in the movies. He has had many more movies than Superman has, and it all these movies (except for the Adam West one and the black and white serials) has has killed people. And we have been fine with this. In the movies, we the public and our inherent jadedness have turned Batman into a killer, much in the same way the universe Superman enters in BvS has turned Batman into a killer. Its not until he shares a screen with Superman does the public question why he kills and start asking for the no kill code back. And at the end of the movie he gets it back, after Superman sacrifices himself and proves to Batman, and the world, that he is indeed just a force of a good, or as Batman says it "men can still be good". Its illustrated when Batman corners Lex in his prison cell and does't brand him (instead opting for more classic Batman scare tactics). Even in the comics Batman started out killing, but once he became more integrated into the larger superhero universe they started telling stories where had a no kill rule. And this brings me to, you guessed it (sorry if my pattern is getting predictable) another thing I loved about these movies. They find ways to look at the big picture of a character, like Batman, see how the character has changed over its entire history, and make it part of the story.

4/6

Refute it, then. Calling "headcanon" is fucking weak. There's even dialogue in Suicide Squad that relates back to what I've said. Funny part is that I was saying it for months before we knew the first detail of SS's plot.

Was Martha always fat in the comics?

In fact they do the same thing with Lex Luthor. Lex always started off having a full head of hair and being a crazy mad scientist. like he was in BvS There are examples of this throughout the golden age, and a few times in the silver age. Its also re-tread by Birthright and Gene Hackman in the Reeves movies. We see the beginning of Lex's passionate hate for Superman, to the point where he lets it derail his speech at the library fund raiser. We also get to the classic Lex move of him dominating and controlling every conversation he is in. And those he can't control he gets rid of. By the end of the movie we see Lex much more stone faced and cold (sans the scene chewing bell speech, though I don't mean that in a bad way) and finally with a shaved head. A transition into the modern age Lex who keeps a more precise and calculated public persona.

I don't have much to say about this last point, other than I thought it was neat that Wonder Woman regains faith in humanity parallel to Batman, and humanity, (re)gaining faith in Superman, and by extension the superhero.

5/6

Humor in Watchmen were good. Remember Comedian's jokes.

We hate this movie. It's the redditors who keep praising this crap.

I guess really I love that the movie gives me so much to chew on, and that every time I watch it I see a new little thing. Like last time I saw it, I noticed that after Batman's nightmare about dictator Superman, his worst fear about what Superman can become, its followed by Superman looking at the photos of Batman's dead victims in jail. Which is Superman's worst fear about how bad Batman can become. Or how the movie gets progressively more saturated with color as it goes on, the world literally becoming a more colorful and bright place. Or how the bat-creature in Bruce's dream is a homage/twist to a deleted scene from Val Kilmer Batman. I love all these layers it intertwines almost effortlessly.

Anyway, thanks for whoever read. I apologize if this sounds pretentious in any way.

Thank you for these.

Way to ignore everyone's arguments kiddo

my pleasure friend-o

Saying this movie was good is a meme.
Everyone knows it was terrible.

I though everyone knew this by now.

> maybe, but the scene itself is pretty powerful in my opinion

You're entitled to it.

> So since the characters aren't behaving like you want them to and some are not main characters, all emotion is nulled. ok.

No, it matters if we care about the characters and their sadness. The Spider-Man series has some good scenes where some nobodies stand up for him, and they're powerful moments because they're the culmination of the underlying themes of sacrifice and responsibility -- Spider-Man has given up shit for them, and now they're willing to give their lives for him.

Superman sacrifices his life when he doesn't need to to stop a threat that shouldn't exist, using allies he shouldn't have and a weapon he shouldn't use. If the people of Earth thought he was a menace and a false god when he was alive and he saved the planet from Zod, why are they suddenly unified in grief when he "dies" saving them from Doomsday? They hated him five minutes ago because they thought he blew up the Capitol, remember?

Which brings me to...

> What does any of that have to do with the building that exploded mid movie?

What is this expression supposed to convey? You're borderline autistic, so I'll help you out: it's concern. Not fear, not horror, not sorrow; concern. This is the expression of a man who is trying to remember if he locked his apartment door before he left for work. It's the expression of a man who is considering buying a Napa Chicken Salad Sandwich but wondering whether that counts as junk food because of the dressing. It's the expression of a man who is reconsidering the placement of his glass of ice water so close to his laptop.

And let's not forget that, just moments before, we bore witness to what is essentially toilet humor, and ruins the tone of the scene. A jar of Lex Luthor's piss has shattered, which has presumably evaporated in the heat from the explosion.

Maybe that's why he's making that face.

you are doing the same thing user

...

DKR, actually, have worst scene of Wayne's death. Who the fuck would put gun under necklace and why would Thomas try to FIGHT against FUCKING GUN POINTED DIRECTLY ON HIS WIFE. And Snyder have choosed THIS scene to re-create. Genius.

Michael Bay is way better than Snyder

>post about obvious symbolism at the begining of thread
>all arguments are about how awesome and deep movie because of obvious symbolism
Nice one, pleb.

No I'm refuting points and making my own points with a healthy dose of snark. if you notice Im replying to someone who won't even refute my point but gets to deem me wrong anyways. Do you see what I'm saying?

>kiddo
you got 'em on the ropes now champ.

The gun was on his father, and the mugger put the gun under the woman's necklace to keep it trained on her

You millennials sure are dumb

"Appeal to authority" fallacy, try harder Marvelcuck.

>god the symbolism in this movie is soooo obvious!

>that Martha scene was dumb because they share the same name

Do you not see the hypocrisy here user?

Thank you user.

Sweet diss there big hoss

I half suspect that they set up the Batman as a pre-existent hero in this universe, they're not only making a nod in the direction of all his past films, but also to his more grounded pulp vigilante roots, characters like the Shadow and Zorro.

It might also be commentary on how of all DC's big-timers, the Batman was the only one to have really benefited from the "grimdark" phase of the 90s, consequently the same era in which Superman's death arc occurred.

It's the shit image that bothers me the most

Necklace is not long enough to hang on gun like that, you blind mongolid. And there is no reason to even try to do such thing. He can shoot her from this distance every time and he did it. Why would he even try to put gun under necklace if he decided to kill her anyway.

I can't believe I'm seeing a genuine post on Cred Forums

I see projection, user. And trigger shit is not smart at all anyway.

Why is Cred Forums so afraid of capekino?

youtube.com/watch?v=8hsSWr937jc

It's artistic value it's not meant to be practical or realistic... stop scraping for excuses

obviously didnt decide to kill her, it was a heat of the moment thing (since he just ran, only taking the pearls).

also the necklace is obviously long enough to hang like that, since it is, right there in the picture in question.

But it makes perfect sense, it's not like they have the same name and by virtue of that fact alone they suddenly are super cool. There were other factors at play.

There were plenty of things wrong with this movie but that simply is not one of them.

Well, in comics the government officials tend to be corrupt, useless, or complete morons

Read them all superbro. I really like your analysis and I'm always glad there are folks like you out there making these connections.

You happen to know anything about the Tarot? I've been trying to decide what to make of this. Magic's always been a huge part of DC and I *think* I know what this is implying, but I'd like to hear other long-time DC fans' thoughts on it.

Because that's the definition of pretentious? BvS tried to be deep and thought provoking but instead is shallow and simple.
CW which tries to keep it's plot simple on the other hand is unexpectedly complex and political, simply because the characters are much better fleshed out anf it actually focuses on the conflict.
There are many other reasons why CW war is better but you pretty much already answered your own question.

>"HONKA HONKA!"

2:20, you fucking mongoloid:

youtube.com/watch?v=DcJac6OykfM

Oh, it's just suppose to look "cool" and "deep", I get it.
He shot her for no reason. There wasn't any movement or sound to make him do it like he did to Thomas (Who TRIED TO HIT MAN WITH A GUN, FATHER OF THE YEAR)

I don't know why that Link in the bottom popped up

The fuck?

>, a lot of posters on Cred Forums
No one actually from or authentic to this board likes it

of course DCucks wouldn't know Problem Sleuth

Well, in comics the government officials tend to be corrupt, useless, or complete morons

Here

forbes.com/sites/insertcoin/2016/05/09/captain-america-civil-war-shows-exactly-why-batman-v-superman-failed/#629a32e46bb1

Everybody go home now

>all those Jared Leto madman memes
>There's actually a scene of him lying on the ground

pure kino

Son, one day you'll realize just because the characters look human on a screen, and are even played by humans, doesn't mean they're thinking, feeling entities.

or maybe you won't. As that seems to be one of the hallmarks of autism. read: not understanding that characters aren't real and have no thoughts or opinions beyond what people ascribe to them.

It does perfect sense, but it also make Batman is FUCKING unstable retard who've killed dozens of people for no reason and got healed from "I don't care about people safty and I hate everyone, fucking alien killed muh people, better kill him too" by trigger. But I agree, Martha scene is far away from being worst thing in this movie. And there is a lots of them.

...

...

>I'm a pleb
ftfy, you didn't need to type so much.

>BvS is full of on-the-nose symbolism
Bullshit.

You, like all plebs didn't see the symbolism until it was pointed to them in those meme infographs. Now, your kind is like:
>uh, yeah, I totally saw that kek, too on the nose.

>They hated him five minutes ago because they thought he blew up the Capitol, remember?

Nah, we're given normal(read not knee-jerk reactionary protesters) people's reactions to the demonstrations. "The world" didn't hate Superman, just the people who were most negatively polarized by his existence. There were people equally fanatic in their love of him, and then there were the shots more representative of the bulk of humanity, including people he'd directly saved who just shook their heads in confusion over the hatred.

That shot of the oil rig crew was absolutely beautiful.

>kino

you have to go back to R*ddit

Oh look, it's this shitty thread again.

>EARTH IS YOUR HOME BECAUSE YOUR PEOPLE WERE IGNORANT FUCKS
>YOUR SPECIES HAVE KILLED THOUSANDS OF PEOPLE AND DESTROYED HALF OF MEGAPOLIS AND HOMES OF EVEN MORE THOUSANDS PEOPLE
>YOU DON'T OWE THIS WORLD A THING, YOU NEVER DID
Both Kents turned from kind people to total shitbags in Snyderverse and it's so cool and realistic!

Of course there were but it's still weak no matter how you present it. It's just forced on every level and in the end it's still Batman becoming best buds with Superman because their moms have the same name.
Would Batman have reacted like that if Supes mom had a different name? Would he have reacted like that if Superman actually went "MOMMY!" instead of calling his mom by his first name? Would Batman act the same if Lex or any other villain also called out for their mommy?
Is he sane now or is it just a mood? An exception to the rule?
How does the fact that Supermans mom has the same name as his mom negate ANY of the reasons he listed why he needs to battle him?
Why even listen to him at all? He didn't the beginning? Actually why kill him slowly and not just ram that fucking thing in or use Cryptonite bullets in the first place? You see, you just start deconstructing the entire movie backwards from this scene alone. It just absolutely broke the willing suspension of disbelief.

>mfw I can barely remember major plot details of Civil War, but BvS haters have actually expended thousands of words of type and dozens of hours of analysis explaining their ongoing consternation

It's only bad press if they spell your name wrong.

>Call it shit
>"lol you've got no arguments xd"
>explain why it's shit
>"omg you care so much it must've been good!"

Is this level of denial even healthy?

CW didn't need memeful shitposters to make it a success.
But sure, take it. At this point DCucks will probably take anything positive they can say about BvS

Just two years earlier, he stepped up to bat for humanity against what little remained of his own kind just weeks after finding out what that kind even was. For every person that died during the fight, hundreds of thousands more lived by virtue of his willingness to fight for humanity's right to simply be. If he'd chosen to hang up his cape at that point and live his life in peaceful obscurity, he'd already earned every right to do so.

That's one of the things that gets me - just how much more noble a character he is than the Batman. Bruce has pined his entire existence over the senseless loss of his parents at the hands of a common criminal. Superman had to choose between us and all that was left of his own people, had to end the sole living connection to his culture with his own two hands because Zod was such an uncompromising, fanatical fuckhead. Then he endures two years worth of navel-gazing assholes second-guessing his every move and he still suits up and goes out into the world to do good.

>explain why it's shit

You're just going on and on about one scene and sounding like a fucking fool.

>That's one of the things that gets me - just how much more noble a character he is than the Batman.
Well, that's simple, user. Bruce in Snyderverse is insane retarded asshole and you don't know how he is supposed to be. Same with Supes. In comics - they're both nobel in their ways, and that's make their duo of light and night awesome. Duo of two murderous edgelords looks like shit. If Zack wanted it, he should make movie Edgeman vs Murderman and don't touch iconic heroes.

It's the one scene that threw most people off and I explained why.
You on the other hand are just a retarded memeposter

>destroying any chance your entire race had to survive in order to save humans, and then on top of that choosing a 40 year old redheaded hag as your gf when you could have literally any pussy you desire

Clark Kent, the Supercuck

>He shot her for no reason.
exactly, it was senseless violence

So how is it your super assassin kills people in full view of the only video camera for miles again? I thought he was just brainwashed, not brain-dead.

>the criminal committing senseless violence was white, not black

the most unbelievable part of this movie, and that's saying something

thanks for reading! I don't know much about the hanged man card, other than its supposed to be about letting go.

I've also read the interpretation that he is supposed to be connected to both the earth and the heavens. Maybe its supposed to be how Joker brings out the worst in Batman and Superman brings out the best?

You're the fucking retard, son.

It was established early on in the film that Bruce's disconnect from his own humanity was his parent's pointless death...his mother's even more than his father's, who fought back against the thug.

So, yeah, it was the mere mention of a mother (something he never really thought Supes had) that caused him to reconsider.

Snyder/Goyer's mistake was exploiting the commonality of the mothers' names, which turned into this year's biggest autistic trigger. Had this coincidence not existed, Supes would have simply said, "Save my mother!" with the same outcome.

To say nothing of being too cheap to buy a ski mask or a pair of panty hose...

I found some info on what the Hanged Man is supposed to mean in its normal position - sacrifice, suspension, and enlightenment. It's the reversed position I can't find much info on.

Personally, I've been interpreting it as the Joker being somehow aware of how the world has changed in the aftermath of Supes's death and possibly how magic is really on the upswing in their world. There may even be a fourth-wall component to it as well. Regardless of whether it turns out to mean something more, I find it a little creepy.

Lel
Do you actually believe that?
I mean just imagine it
"P-please..."
"Huh?!"
"Save my... mommy!"
"HOLY CHEESE CRACKERS BATMAN! SUPERMAN HAS A MOM! YOU CAN'T KILL HIM NOW!"

I like this interpretation, I hope its a thread that continues in the DCEU

It was Hydra footage for internal use... Whoever wanted the Starks dead obviously wanted to see them be killed to be sure they're actually dead.

>he doesnt realize its not just the mother, but Lois too
>that it was about realizing that Superman had a regular, human upbringing and really was just like him (a guy trying his best to do good with what was given to him)

Why would he even shot her? He shot dad, because he was too retarded to try to hit him. Why did he shot Martha? People don't shot other people for no reason. Big or small - there must be one.

People do kill people all the time for no reason, either panicking or whatever.

There are two names for it, manslaughter, where the perp kills someone without any intent, and a crime of passion, in which someone kills someone with intent to kill but without any premeditated reason.

Here's what I believe. Batman witnessed his father, who he idolized, die with his mother's name on his lips. He spent his whole career trying to *be* the hero and protector his father tried but ultimately failed to be.

Then along comes this alien who knocks down his building and kills a lot of people(at least in his eyes) and renders everything he'd ever accomplished seem meaningless in light of what this guy's capable of. He sees him as a walking extinction event just waiting to happen and he devotes his entire return from retirement to finding a way to take out this threat. Through all of it, through his brutality, his embrace of torture, and his cavalier attitude about killing, he still regards himself as a hero.

Then at the moment of his triumph, his "enemy" prepares to go to his death with that same name on his lips, this alien threat, lying there helpless and his last thoughts are not of himself but of someone he loves. It's in this moment that he realizes how far he's fallen and just how much closer Clark is to being like his father, while he's allowed his own obsessions to drive him into the role of a murderer.

Look at his disgust when he throws the spear away. When he goes to get it, he's King Arthur in his mind, the hero rightfully wielding the magic weapon to slay this "dragon." Afterward, it's just the whaler's spear of Ahab, the obsessed hunter.

Do you actually believe that? He shot father for reason, ok. When he standed infront of Martha, waited a little and his finger were like, twitched so hard it pull the trigger?

I guess it should not have been slow motion, to have an even greater impact on just how quickly the situation devolved.

Because their compliant, brainwashed assassin can't be trusted to tell them the truth?

While we're at it, in what world do punches to the face and strangulation remotely resemble injuries sustained in a car crash?

That's the whole point. That's not fucking Batman. It's some unstable insane retard, who can be easilu triggered by his mother's name, can easily be manipulated by autists and can't understand what is portuguese for the half of the fucking movie. Also he've exposed himself infront of Superman, Luthor and Diana. He is fucking stupid. And lost hard drive also. GREATEST WORLD DETECTIVE.

>mommy

Says more about you than the movie, user.

>He is fucking stupid.
That's what obsession does. It makes you a tunnel-visioned retard. It's the thin line that Bruce always walks - controlling his obsessions instead of letting them control him.

Alfred points that out to him in the immediate aftermath of his Man-Bat nightmare, reinforcing what his own subconscious was already trying to tell him.

>That's not fucking Batman.

>MUH BATMAN
>MUH SUPERMAN

Rise to the storytelling challenge, bitch.

Neither character has been anything like consistent over there sixty or seventy year run.

Hydra is an organization, not a person. While the people directly involved in the winter soldier project obviously know how reliable they are, the upper dogs might not be so confident about that. Especially with all those plans that didn't go as planned.

Or let me put it this way: if you really think it was public footage, why was it so hard for Zemo to find it or why had Tony never seen it? It's fucking obvious it was a Hydra file and Bucky was supposed to kill them at deliberately that spot

Funny because if Snyder hadn't used Batman and Superman but random Joe #1 and random jack #2 absolutely nobody would have even given a fuck about his movie and even DCucks would've agreed that it was shit.

It wasn't a Hydra file originally. It was footage from a security cam at the end of some posh estate's driveway, possibly even the Starks' own, and Bucky killed them in plain sight of it, undisguised and in full view, when a disposable camera would have been equal to the task.

While we're at it, knowing of his dad's involvement in the Super Soldier Program and general ties to government projects, why was Stark not chomping at the bit to decrypt all those Hydra files himself? He could have tasked any number of employees with the project. If Zemo found a reference to the date of his parents' deaths in the online archive and decrypted it, why was Tony not already aware of the connection as well? I mean, he's a tech genius billionaire, after all. Zemo's just some random asshole working on a shoestring budget.

he just shot her cause he panicked, stop being such a picky bitch

Wow, that's gotta be the stupidest post on this thread yet.

>So does Random Joe a naturalized alien (literally!) that has godlike abilities?
>Is Random Jack a billionaire turned vigilante, branding criminals?

>muh headcanon

...

Obession does it to ordinary people. Not to Batman. That's why he is fucking superhero. Because his mind, will and body were trained for his entire life and he can handle all these shit and his only goal to save others from the dark.
Who needs to take characters from established universe for 20 fucking years, right? Let's just take Supes from three different comics and make them into one. Also Batman from another universe and downgrade his intelligence, detective skills, and make him fucking unstable.

Yeah, but there's every indication that the Battle of Metropolis wasn't the sole cause of his downfall. That's the entire point - he's a fallen hero at the start of the story, practically a Dark Knight in the old D&D sense of being a fallen Paladin. Something compromised him. Badly.

Safe money is on the Joker.

The look on his face is disappointment with himself.

And movie could actually be emotional if we had, at least, few fucking movies to feel anything for Batman. We simply don't know and don't care what've happened. I mean, even if we know, we still don't care, because we didn't saw it. We didn't felt it with Bruce. We don't give fuck about his grief. We didn't saw him as a noble hero who cared about other people more than in anything in universe. We only have seen angry insane retard who were angry on edgelord for being more devastating than Bat himself

Didn't Bucky spot the camera right after? He probably told Hydra and then they got a hold of it. I assume they've done so many many times.

So if some of the upcoming Batfleck films turn out to be prequels, that won't do it for you? I don't know this for sure yet, but I sort of think that's where they're headed - showing his rise, fall, redemption, and possibly passing the mantle off to a new Batman.

>didnt saw it
>retard who were angry on edgelord
>don't care what've happened

How old are you?

All my super assassins case their targets with more care and choose their killing ground with greater discretion. They don't needlessly complicate the situation by causing decidedly non-fatal car crashes into the monitored driveways of posh estates.

I'm telling you, once I get my kickstarter funded, I'm causing some serious shit. Hydra are a bunch of rank amateurs.

Well, if solo Batman movies will be good and show us what you've said, BvS will look better. But that's the point - Do the fucking solo movie first. Don't force shit to make easy money.
That's not my native language, fuck off.

>rank amateurs
Compared to Doctor Colossus?

That's a matter of preference and I totally understand where you're coming from. I like this approach because it adds an air of mystery to it. I'm dying to know what lead to Bruce being the way he was at the start of the film, what happened to Wayne Manor, and what made him decide to retire in the first place.

I've got high hopes for what Affleck brings us.

Bah, such buffoonery must not be countenanced.

Webm is funny because best scene in the movie and both Cavil and Affleck is not in it. Yeah, I have hope for Batman solo movie. Last hope. But, for now, DCEU is definition of wasted potential.