If ever I was asked to give an example of nostalgia blindess, or kids going 'the older the better!', it would be this statement. Pfeiffer's Catwoman was entertaining, yes. But she was everything Catwoman wasn't meant to be. She was an insane lunatic who skipped about like a little girl. She was basically a more provoctive Harley.
Of all the live action cat-women we've had so far, Hathaway was clearly the best. She was able to emulate Selina Kyle's ability to manipulate others and go from 'Catwoman' to whatever identity she was faking perfectly.
Pfeiffer was sexy. She was not 'the' Catwoman. Stop kidding yourselves.
Just saw this yesterday, failed to see a single flaw over my huge boner.
Brody Rogers
1st for Halle Berry
Jayden Thomas
Pfeiffer is the reason for my latex fetish. That enough is to make her the best.
Nathaniel Wilson
I think you're comparing 2 different Era's of Catwoman. Phieffer's yes had an awful and drastically different origin. But her over all performance/demeanor as Catwoman was informed by a depiction of Catwoman that was less cunning thief and more garish cat themed caper. The Bat Woman that had henchman, the catwoman that wore a cape high heels and a dress. The Catwomen from the tv show. That was her starting point. That's what she had to draw from and to work with.Even most of the sleeker versions of Catwomans costume run nearly parallel to the release this movie. Hathaway is obviously more closely modeled off the more current Selina a look I'm almost positive wasn't created until early 2000's at least.
Wyatt Lopez
Only time I found Catwoman interesting.
Dominic Turner
Pfeiffer and DeVito really had a good time with their roles in this. It's a shame Burton didn't keep making these.
Elijah Johnson
Weirdly not the last time someone named Pfeifer would have a shitty take on the character.
Nolan Brown
...
Matthew Hughes
There's a difference between being a better adaption and a better character. Stephen King's The Shining miniseries was a better adaptation of the book, but the majority of people would agree that Stanley Kubrick's film was a much better piece of art. Art shouldn't be limited to its source material for how it represents itself, that would be boring. Why do many fans want everything to the same as the source? Just read/watch the source material. Motion pictures are not inherently better than books or comic books, so why cant you just be happy with source material? Why must you insist that adaptions be exactly like they used to be? If it wasn't for people willing to change things, Mr. Freeze would still be a corny and forgotten Batman villain. Sure you might not like the all the changes people make, but you always have the source material to enjoy.
Adrian Morris
Changes for the better are fine, bad changes are not.
Andrew Miller
This !
Owen Parker
That's entirely subjective. I feel like another problem source material fans have with adaptions is that they are usually more popular than the original. Just look at The Joker, make him a rapist everyone is fine, but if you put arguably stupid tattoos all over his body then everyone loses their minds.
Easton Ward
How many people actually liked that story anyway?
Dylan Lewis
I have no idea. I'm a cartoonfag, not a comicfag.
Caleb Baker
>entirely subjective Yes. And? Are you saying we're not allowed to dislike anything because of that?
Gabriel Foster
Nope. Discussion is just fun, it doesn't have any real meaning. People will have different opinions no matter what. I was just trying to make a point that peoples issues with Tim Burton's Catwoman are directly linked to their knowledge of the source material. Most people who like Tim Burton's version probably only have a basic understanding of the the original character anyways, so the character's resemblance to original becomes entirely irrelevant to a mass audience. Frankenstein was generally an unintelligent monster in the films, but was intelligent in the book. Doesn't change that fact the films are considered classics by many.
Mason Walker
I don't know if this is the best example. In this instance I think you're talking about a comibook that is known of but by my estimations isn't really popular. This was more... people knew of it than actually read it. Where as the Leto's appearance as Joker was a widely publicized thing. It was big reveal, not just to some comic fans but to pretty much everyone. Part of Jokers anniversary part of advertising for the movie. there was a lot more exposure for the tats and because of that a lot more opinion. Of the people I know that read AZZ's Joker, not many if any had any more a positive view of the Jokers than they did with SS.
Parker Martinez
Popular media is inherently more criticized than obscure media, regardless of quality.
Gabriel Turner
No, Hatheway was not the best by any measure. She didn't possess any of the charm or charisma the character is known for, and wasn't nearly as sexy as she should have been. Hatheway didn't portray a sultry, dangerous and irresistible femme fatale half as well as Pfeifer did. Pfeifer owned the role, despite the fact she had a vastly different origin than in the comics.
Also you have to remember Burton had far less material to work with than Nolan had, Brubaker's run wouldn't revitalize the character for another 10 years, so his changes to the character weren't as disrespectful as it would be today.
Hunter Young
I never liked Hathaway's Catwoman, she had no charm or presence at all. A couple of shots of her butt riding the bike can't replace those. Like a lot of things in the movie she was really just there to make sure Bale's Batman could get an arguably rushed happy ending. It didn't help that her femme-fatale side was overshadowed by Talia's
Dominic Cruz
You actually liked Talia al Ghul in Rises? Her role was like my only gripe with the movie.
Elijah Edwards
While I don't consider Michelle Pfeiffer to be "the definitive Catwoman", I still think she's the best one we've got so far. I understand why you think Hatheway is the best. You feel that because Hatheway's Catwoman hared closer to the comics, she is the best. Which is a perfectly valid reason. However I have a different opinion.
>She was able to emulate Selina Kyle's ability to manipulate others and go from 'Catwoman' to whatever identity she was faking perfectly.
While she does do those things in the film (though whether she did it "perfectly is a matter of opinion), her performance still felt lacking to me. So it didn't really matter she did those things that Selina Kyle/Catwoman has done in the comics because her performance WHILE doing those things wasn't that good. Her performance felt forced. I just didn't buy it. I didn't see Catwoman. I just saw Anne Hatheway trying to convince me that she was Catwoman (and failing).
Now while Pfeiffer's Catwoman is considered less comic accurate (though there are most likely some comic influences despite popular misbelief), I feel that she gave the better performance. Her performance had so much more passion while also feeling more convincing. Unlike Hatheway, Pfeiffer didn't feel forced to me. I didn't feel that she was trying to convince that she was Catwoman. To me, she WAS Catwoman. A Catwoman that's perhaps not the one some comic and Batman fans wanted but still Catwoman. I didn't really need any convincing. I just immediately bought the character that Pfeiffer was playing.
Now as I said early, Pfeiffer's Catwoman most likely did have some influences from the comics. Those influences are pointed out and detailed in links that will be posted in a reply to this comment because I'll exceed the character limit if I post them here.
This. The character has a complete different backstory, but making her sort of a "voodoo-undead" sexy woman makes her much more awesome. That and the fact that she's pretty much crazy and more evil-spirited makes her truly one of the best adaptations of the character.
Plus, she's the hottest actress to have ever portayed her.
David Gray
>every version of a character has to be the same
Jace Watson
If he paid her it wasn't rape
Benjamin Edwards
But that's part of the reason I love Batman Begins, it's so completely different from the comics. If I wanted a comic, I'd read a fucking comic. I want the movies to go batshit insane with the characters and do whatever the fuck they want. Batman Begins is by far my favorite Batman movie.
That's also the reason I like MoS and BvS.
Brandon Williams
Imagine Keaton with today's advances in costume design
He can turn his head now
Joseph White
It's not like he would turn his head in that situation
Jackson Gray
The Burton movies were the only live action stylistic interpretations I ever liked. It truly feels like watching an elseworlds story. Back when he still gave a shit about to art, Burton had a really definative style that built a world with very little effort. His characters mannerisms, the set pieces, all conveyed a great tone in his movies. So when I'm watching Batman and Batman Returns, I understand I'm not watching a "Batman movie" I'm watching "Tim Burton presents BATMAN!". That's why something like this work, but I feel Ironman 3 didn't. Ironman 3 didn't pull me into a different realm, it just turned an iconic villain into a cheesy gag character for the sake of a twist. Despite hating BvS, I give Jesse Eisenberg's interpretation of Lex more leeway than Shane Black's Mandarin because Lex felt like he belonged in the world they put him in.
Bentley Harris
>But she was everything Catwoman wasn't meant to be >Not the best because not authentic to muh comics Oh, get over it. No good superhero movie has ever been good because it prioritiesed being true to the source material. In fact, a good one must be good enough to stand on it's own and that means reinventing the wheel sometimes. If you need to consume a single other piece of media to understand a character in a movie then they're not a good character. As a stand alone character who never appeared before or again this Catwoman was great.
I suppose you think Jack Nicholson and Danny DeVito weren't an amazing Joker and Penguin either.
Kayden Ortiz
Yeah but them stitches and leather though Coolest look.
Aiden Martinez
>No good superhero movie has ever been good because it prioritiesed being true to the source material
kys
Nicholas Allen
Penguin Ackbar!
William Flores
>Hathaway was clearly the best but she didn't even dress like a cat... she was more like stiletto-heal woman.
Samuel Flores
>It's a shame Burton didn't keep making these.
Blame WB for pussing out, hiring Joel Schumacher and making the next couple Batman films light and more kid-friendly because parents thought Batman Returns was too dark and mature for their precious little children.
Levi Morales
>deadpool is a good movie
no, you kys
Dominic Thompson
Twenty something years later I still love this version of cat woman and I wish there were elseworlds featuring a version of Selina like this. As a little kid; I watched Returns and wanted to be THAT phifer catwoman was awesome, but I agree she was Selina Kyle in name only.
Eartha Kitt and Anne Hathaway are truest to the character though I think
Tyler Hughes
I liked it
Wyatt Smith
Yeah, the Burton movies were more like a dark reimagining of the 60's show, and for that I accept them.
Catwoman and Penguin are nothing like their comics counterparts, they're edgy versions of Julie Newmar and Burgess Meriwether.
Ian Lewis
But I saw these as a precious little child and I loved them! Although as a kid I couldn't tell Forever and B&R were bad because they had pretty colors and shit.
Daniel Roberts
Anne Hathaway was utter trash, just like the rest of that movie.
Eli Kelly
You wanted to be a crazy cat lady falling apart at the seams?
Angel Morgan
Prety sure Burton had no real interest in returning.
Juan Bennett
Michelle Pfeiffer? Ha. The only true Catwoman is Julie Newmar, Lee Meriwether, or Eartha Kitt.
Leo Cox
Kek
Colton Price
>Only true is three different people
Leo Hill
You mean the movie where they changed Deadpool origin? Changed Deadpool's girlfriend from a mutant to a regular human? Changed Deadpool's villain?
Leo James
you mean the thing they do all the time in deadpool comics
Samuel Nelson
Deadpool's origin hasn't changed in the comics that much and that doesn't change my point.
The Deadpool movie isn't accurate to the comics. They changed tons of shit.
Christopher Thompson
You mean to tell that a comic book movie adaptation doesn't follow the source material 100%? Stop the fucking presses the world needs to hear of the new and shocking revelation.
Blake Rivera
Catwoman is supposed to be an insane slut. That is why she's such a good match with Batman, who is also insane. Pretty much every major character in Barman is a bit nutty.
Jacob Fisher
THAT'S MY WHOLE FUCKING POINT, YOU RETARD!
See how this shit started.
This guy posted this , talking about how a cape movie doesn't need or rarely follow the comic book continuity. Then this smart-ass posted this trying to prove that Deadpool was somehow comic accurate when it isn't. Then here's my post proving how different the Deadpool movie was from the Deadpool comics.
Mason Butler
What was wrong with her? She followed her father's steps, had a weird love/hate relationship with Bruce, as short as it was... death scene aside i liked her
Ian Ward
Voodoo-undead? But she was never dead
Christopher Sullivan
One of my favorite Joker stories.
Alexander Powell
Batman Begins is hardly what one would call a "batshit insane" Batman story, though...
Colton Garcia
>more closely modeled off the more current Selina a look I'm almost positive wasn't created until early 2000's at least.
Hathaway's look was clearly inspired by 60's Julie Numar Catwoman. If she were the modern one she's have short black hair, goggles and no high heels.
Christian Martin
This. As much as i love the Nolan movies they pretty much followed the usual "let's turn these comic characters in people in suits" Hollywood logic, that's hardly brave or whatever user would call it
Juan King
>This. The character has a complete different backstory, but making her sort of a "voodoo-undead" sexy woman makes her much more awesome. That and the fact that she's pretty much crazy and more evil-spirited makes her truly one of the best adaptations of the character.
There was nothing "interesting" about her. It's just your cock and nostalgia talking. Falls out of a building, licked by Cats and becomes "Catwoman" well good thing there were no roaches in that alley
Lincoln Peterson
She was a depressed lady with no power over her own life, abused and abandoned by ger family, lover and boss. Traumatic event happens so she snaps and decides to tell society to go fuck itself. Since, as it was shown, she admired cats for their independence she decides to dress like one and start spreading chaos and get what she wants for once
But fuck writing, am i right? The iconic scene is that some cats licked her, so it's all just about cat saliva, right? Jesus Christ
Brayden Bailey
>But that's part of the reason I love Batman Begins, it's so completely different from the comics. Wut? Batman Begins was a near replica of Batman: Year One! Right down to the scene where he escapes police using real Bats as a distraction . All it needed was Selina showing up to slash Roman Falcone's face or some shit
Camden Diaz
Why? It's not a good story.
Daniel Jones
Or Batman getting stabbed by a hooker.
Oliver Rogers
Did anyone actually like Anne Hathaway's catwoman? I thought it was the worst character i've ever seen in a superhero movie.
Luke Walker
Yeah sorry that shit has been done before. It's not unique nor was it presented in any interesting way. Nice costume though
Alexander Smith
She died after falling off a building.
Oliver Edwards
>It's not unique nor was it presented in any interesting way. Nice costume though
That's a goddamn lie, though. When people think of Catwoman they almost always say Pfeifer name.
Jaxson Butler
So how about that part where she shoots Bane?
Wyatt Brown
I love Year One, i think that's why Begins is my favorite of the Nolan Trilogy.
Kayden Brown
I wish Miller had made Year One as a 12-issue series that actually came out over a year.
James Perez
She started out great in the beginning and felt like Selina, but as the movie progressed sort of became a non character. Kudos for having "not Holly Robinson" in there though
Gavin Peterson
Because nostalgia is a hell of a thing.
Lincoln Jenkins
Unless it was presented in a very unique and interesting way.
Lincoln Bennett
Yes I like phifers version and like I said, I want an elseworlds just about her > depressed lady with no power over her own life, abused and abandoned by ger family, lover and boss For whatever reason, your description just clicked with me as to why I identify with/love this characterization so much. Not sure why it took me twenty years to figure it out, or why I felt like that as a little kid though
Luis Rogers
*being pushed
Liam Cruz
No she didn't. The scene specifically shows her falling through various tents, slowing down the fall. If cat magic was a thing in the movie i think they would've been more explicit about it
Daniel Garcia
Hathaway Catwoman was shit.
And her costume sucked too.
Robert Brown
Why is Catwoman black in Year One?
Jaxson Diaz
Cat magic was much more explicit in Halle Berry's Catwoman and it looked much more retarded.
I'd rather have cats going around Selina, biting her and meowing while she has a stroke than a fucing cat LITERALLY breathing "life" back at her again.
Angel Flores
Why is Harvey Dent black in the 1989 Batman?
Oliver Walker
Why are we so surprised that BvS etc. are turning out the way they are when Catwoman is a thing? It's the same studio, they've been fucking up almost constantly since Schumacher
Brody Hernandez
MoS, BvS and SS have turned out okay imo
Brayden Rivera
I see glimpses of creativity in MoS and SS but i think the end product is ultimately disappointing, although decent enough for an occasional watch and some character moments
BvS is a tremendously misguided effort at best
Nathan Reyes
>Of all the live action cat-women we've had so far, Hathaway was clearly the best. How can one person have such terrible taste?
Ryder Russell
BvS has more creativity in it than MoS and SS. Are you crazy?
Owen Hernandez
Hathaway had 0 presence and brought down every scene she was in.
Asher Reed
This was a change for the better luckily considering Hathaway, the "faithful" one, was also the shittiest too.
Andrew Allen
Finns out.
Parker Robinson
But it was misguided as i said, not only a lot of fans would have a problem with what the movie tried to do no matter start, it was done badly to begin with
Aiden Williams
How about no
Josiah Campbell
The sad thing is that movie started off as a planned spin-off starring Pfeiffer's Catwoman, way back in 1993.
Grayson Hill
>Michelle Pfeiffer hotter than Julie Newmar FUCK NO!
Landon Stewart
>complaining about catwoman not being like she is in the comics in a fucking movie where nobody is like the comics.
Jesus christ user after the bazillion comic movies we've had in the past decade you'd hope to understand that movies =/= comics.
the comics are there for references and details can be swapped whenever the fuck they want.
all this is moot however because >Tim burton
Nathaniel Thomas
>Of all the live action cat-women we've had so far, Hathaway was clearly the best.
