How do we fix Pym Cred Forums?

Pretty much this.

I know how to fix Janet. A strong right cross.

Slott's MA was decent Pymwank.

Oh man, this would actually be pretty cool. Pym decides to quit heroing again and instead try and save the whole country at once. He has to deal with the stress of office, to the point where he has another breakdown and begins hallucinating political rivals as villains wearing suits, it culminates in Pym bulding a device that simulates telepathy, so he can spy on the obvious plot to overthrow america. After this all comes out he goes into therapy following his impeachment leaving his running-mate in charge. President Vision

the dude is in need of serous psychiatric care

thanks to marvels compressed time line all these traumas happened to him within a few years and no one actually stops and helps him

pym if you look at him and his action, he is spiraling out of control while making desperate cries for help and just trying to fix his mistakes while everyone constantly brings up his mistakes and never helps him or gives him a break he needs mental care

he's needed mental care since he got shrunk down and had to fight for his life against ants

and the thing is, he's been psychologically consistent at least since yellow jacket

he needs mental help and recovery, he need to face his traumas and realize they are traumas then to start making amends for his past with a more healthy mental state

that or kill him off and replace him with Marvels adventures avengers pym

that guy was great

>he needs mental help and recovery, he need to face his traumas and realize they are traumas then to start making amends for his past with a more healthy mental state

You should read Ant-Man & Wasp.

You don't. He's the best crazy scientist and mentally unbalanced hero marvel's got, plus Pymtron is great.

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fuck that does sound pretty cool I have to say

Just write a story, any story, that doesn't bring up Janet or Ultron.

Movieverse Pym where he's a grumpy old man that has to deal with some catburglar hitting on his daughter

We put the violent schizoid behaviour into Pymtron, tretain the bipolar issue because it gives him a flaw and reset him to his prime characterization thanks to quantum physics: Ultron drop from himself all the traits he didn't like about his father (his creativity, his passion, his memories included), and they're now wandering information bits in the microverse, waiting for being selfaware of themselves as Hank Pym.

youtube.com/watch?v=4NjCzbfz-Lw
Make a writer listen to this.

They should have done something more creative with Pymtron. Instead of just being Ultron with some Pym skin on, it should have been the two of them in one body traveling the cosmos debating the merits of organic life

Double-down on the fact that he's entirely a mad scientist, who just so happens to be trying to save the world instead of take it over for once.

Don't make anyone understand him because they can't. He's Reed Richards but weirder, his inventions seem strange or pointless but damn if they don't work.

My nigga. I used to have this thing memorized. Easily Warrock's best song.

Hey Antman hit his wife just as much as Spider-Man and Reed Richards hit theirs.

Oh but as far as fixing, honestly I like where we are right now. We've made it physically impossible to have an Ultron Story without Hank Pym in it.

A good idea for a Marvel event? What is this madness?

That's... true.
Well, in the case he IS still there, ofc.

Yeah he's going through his Hanktron phase.
I'm sure soon he'll be back to being Dr Pym the Scientific Adventurer or Giant Man again or something of the sort. That's just how Hank rolls.
You can't tie him down to one personality. Or alignment. Or mental illness. Hank Pym simply is. Deal with it.

> start making amends for his past with a more healthy mental state

he could build all the womens safe zones in the world and build anti spousal abuse beam, but he'll still be the dude who is unforgivable

DELET THIS

Its the nature of being a C-lister. Writers continue to retread the same plot because its all they remember about Pym

Really hope the Pymtron merge sticks and we can really see some cool SCIENCE! adventures like this idea with a writer embracing all the weird.

Yes but not because he accidentally created an evil robot with HIS brain patterns that makes him question whether he himself is truly a monster.
Because he hit his wife while he was having a nervous breakdown.
I suppose some moments stick with readers and writers more than others.

It's the nature of the big two.
Stories get retread over and over.
Batman will keep losing Robins, and then regaining them.
Spider-Man will forever be on the verge of achieving happiness only for it to elude his grasp once more.
And no matter how long Captain America remains acclimatized to the modern world, he'll always feel like a man out of time.

I definitely could see it happening.
Just cause it's not the direction they're currently going with, doesn't mean it can't happen later.
OOH! Or if Hank is dead, they could do the thing like with Morph in Exiles where they rewrite Ultron's programming so he thinks he IS Hank Pym and use that so he could start helping people instead of trying to murder them!
Or since he is sorta dead, and Ultron already thinks he's Hank they could give him some robotic anti-depressants. I mean Hank has said that his main problem that he needs to monitor his mental health. Maybe Vision could write a program that could help Hanktron deal with that. or we could just keep Starfox around and anytime Hanktron starts getting too murdery, we hit him with some love juice.

I don't like the idea of Hank being full on dead. He's one of the few superheroes who hasn't needlessly gone through the whole death/rebirth cycle.

I want a "Superior Ultron" ongoing that explores this

I kind of always wanted Janet to go looking for Hank, for some reason, and to find him sitting in front of Maria's grave, in the pouring rain. He's not even aware it's raining, he's just caught up in some train of thought, like Hank does. The quintessence of Hank.

I don't think any true Hank story is complete without Maria and Janet. For me, they are his touchstones.

On the other hand, think of what Hank has been thru. This is a man who never stops, who never gives up. He wakes up every day with a spring in his step, and a smile on his face. "Today is new day, for a new Hank Pym! Time to shine, buddy!" And then life shits all over him again. But come tomorrow...

death is just another example of this. Hank will shake it off. Cos thats what Hank does.

I'd read it.
I don't know if it could top Spock or Doc Green, but it could definitely beat the Superior Iron Man ongoing. Then again, anything with a definitive ending can beat Superior Iron Man.
Thanks for explaining nothing Bendis!

Pym is one of those characters who doesn't have a consistent personality nailed down. Yeah people like to play up "he's crazy" angle but that's all retroactive stuff that stemmed from years of writers fucking with him. Slott's Pym had an actual consistent personality.

I do like pacifist EMH Pym and it fucking triggers me that that characterization didn't become a staple of the character.

Why fix him?

As a broken character, he's unique. You can write much better stories with messed up hank than you can by making him Reed Richards-lite.

I could see Hank forcing himself into a death-like state using some sort of procedure in order to accomplish some goal in Death's realm.

This user speaks truth. Never forget the Parker used his spider-strength on a pregnant MJ.

One COULD argue that Pym was undergoing a severe psychotic break and dissociative episode at the time, so "he" really didn't.

But that would be some pretty thick bullshitting, even if there were serious extenuating circumstances.

But Marvel keeps making jokes and bringing it up even at really inappropriate moments in the comics themselves.

Even when the entire fanbase isn't talking about it, Marvel keeps digging it up, unasked for.

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I really hate this scene. Both Reed and Hank feel totally out of character.

pym isnt c list. no character gets as much attention as he does and is c-list. retreading his greatest hits just comes off as lazy

it sticks with readers because writers keep bringing it up. then you have mental cases in stark, danvers and barton talking shit, when they dont have a dsamn pot to piss in

OH NO TRUE BELIEVERS, MARVEL HAS MADE PYM INTO A FUCKING NIGGER. HOW WILL HE GET OUT OF THIS HORRID STATE OF LIVING, Cred Forums?

Marvel already has an Ant Man that steals stuff.

>One COULD argue that Pym was undergoing a severe psychotic break and dissociative episode at the time,

I can't tell if you're making a joke or not, because that is what happened.

Retcon. He was perfectly sane when it happened, just angry, jealous and sick of feeling impotent because Jan was the breadwinner and a non-fuck up as a superhero.

Really build up his rogues gallery. And not just Protector, the Voice, Scarlet Beetle, etc. Give him some real heavy hitters. Guys you would never think Pym could defeat. Build a group around a certain theme (kind of like how Johns did for GL).

Pym's theme should be about getting back to the days of exploration and science, the same kind of men and women who put us on the moon and explore the oceans. But how that same drive can just as easily destroy.

Figures like Mr Sinister and MODOK, Nathan Garrett Black Knight with Iron Man like armor. And maybe a few ringers forcing Pym to think creatively and differently each time. Absorbing Man, Sandman, Taskmaster (more of a Lang guy, but not by much really).

Pym, as a character, should represent a bygone era of scientific advancement, one of immense reward, but not without the pain. He should embody both of those.

You can't and I say this as someone who grew up reading him in West Coast Avengers which Marvel conveniently forgets.

Millar's Ultimates is what really cemented the Pym wifebeater meme. Retards automatically assumed that 616 Pym was exactly like his Ultimate counterpart despite the fact they're from different universes. The 1990's didn't even touch on the Janet Slap that much and treated it as resolved until Chuck Austen, Mark Millar, and Bendis dredged it up in the early 2000's.

616 Pym is a dead-end, the only good Pyms are in Marvel Adventures, Earth's Mightiest Heroes, and the MCU.

Way back in the 70's, Janet married Yellowjacket, a mysterious guy that no one knew and it was later revealed to be an alternate personality of Pym thanks to exposure to chemicals...and the Avengers didn't get him some help or have the marriage broken up despite the fact he wasn't in his right state of mind.

Compare this to the early 80's when Carol Danvars was impregnated by her own son/rapist via time distortion. How did the Avengers react? They congratulated her for having a baby despite the fact that it came out of the blue and didn't deeply question it.

Later on, Danvars got the chance to lash out at the Avengers for not doing shit. Pym never got this chance because nobody in Marvel knew what the fuck to do with him for years.

Never fucking happened because nobody wants to remember the Clone Saga. And Peter Parker is an A-Lister and a fuckton more fans than Pym.

In fact, Pym is the only founding Avenger (besides Janet since they're usually paired together) whose never had his own solo book. How pathetic is that?

None of Pym's original rogues are good barring The Voice who can actually be Purple Man-level dangerous, Madame-X, and Whirlwind. He really needs a better roster of villains.

>Figures like Mr Sinister
I recall an user from way back mentioning this. Essex is the anti-thesis of everything that Pym views as science as. In fact, the 2 of them developed grafting biotech onto humans independently as well as philosophically. Pym would be a great nemesis for Sinister.

I also think he needs to battle a magic-based foe. SCIENCE vs Sorcery shenanigans.

I've always thought AIM should've had Pym in their crosshairs but for some reason, Marvel never considered this.

He had a solo book, actually. He headlined Tales to Astonish for a hot minute, and had a weird solo run in the seventies where he was stuck at a mini size. I think he never had a recent solo run because, ultimately, he and Wasp became cornerstones of the Avengers, and work better there than an exploration of their characters.

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Pym versus magic would be great, especially if they play up the fun aspect of his personality. I think he could even handle Mephisto (a deal based villain playing up on Pym's insecurities would be interesting).

And AIM is always a good choice. Maybe even Norman Osborn, they had a weird fling during Dark Reign.

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>Maybe even Norman Osborn, they had a weird fling during Dark Reign.
I like how Marvel had Peter consult with Hank a few times. Hank would definitely be a great foe against Gobby.

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>I've always thought AIM should've had Pym in their crosshairs but for some reason, Marvel never considered this

>he could build all the womens safe zones in the world and build anti spousal abuse beam, but he'll still be the dude who is unforgivable
Why?

>greatest hits
Hehe.

IMAGINE:

AN ANTMAN THE SIZE OF AN ISECT

because he'll always be the dude that hit janet.
he could manage to reform ultron to be an asset to society, and you would still have heroes talking shit under their breaths about him

All you need is writer who gives a fuck about him and good story.
But Remender left and here we are.

>All you need is writer who gives a fuck about him and good story.
Which automatically gets ignored and/or retconned by the next writer/editor.

That must have been some pympslap.

Because those writers and editors don't like Hank, yes. Forgot that tiny but important detail.

That's messed up.

I just want a book of him going on science adventures with his kids, William, Nadia, and Mark.

I kinda want Pymtron to still have Hank alive inside him - just playing up the negatives Pym's been through. Like, reminding him of all the negative stuff that has happened to him - getting pushed into marriage while mentally unsound, getting forever remembered by the entire community as a wifebeater for an accidental hit... basically, Ultron's own hate-fuelled negativity crosses through to Pym, and drives him to hate the Avengers, in a way he couldn't bring himself to do before.

>getting pushed into marriage while mentally unsound
>implying they won't show Hank kidnapping Janet and having some voodoo priest marry them

EMH Pym was best Pym

I kinda want hank to have a virtual reality copy of himself where he altered his mind and actually helped himself removed all those self blocks, and mental traumas, so this Pym could always be the hero he wanted to be (like the program he made of Goliath). Pymtron comes back and tries to merge with this pym personality due to the doubts that the original pym is actually dead inside of him. He fights the avengers yet again by making clones of himself, and the new pym personality slips into one, and declares himself Hank Pym the extraordinary shifting man, playing a vital role in defeating pymtron.
The new robot Hank Pym is then welcomed to be a new avenger in which he promptly declines stating that being an avenger brings too much trouble and that he would rather help people than just police people.

Honestly more men would end up being wife beaters with the shit they put up with and abilities they have in real life is anything to go by so if anything, I would add more flaws to characters, not try to strip them out of old ones.

stop making him a tragic emotionally unstable hero.

Pity Hanktron is permanently glued to the villain paper after the reveal of what he did on his way to Earth

What'd he do, shrink some aliens?

>nobody wants to remember the Clone Saga
You realize they're doing it again, right?

XD

>accidental hit

>Believing Shooter's lies