The terrorist Ahmed Rahami shot at police officers and planted bombs to try to kill American citizens. So does he deserve the protection of the U.S. Constitution? Should he be treated as an enemy combatant instead and denied due process?
I would say it's a pretty clear and resounding 'yes'. Terrorists deserve to be shot and killed on site. They gave up there rights when they decided to commit a crime. Hang the muzzy
Discuss.
In an ideal world, I would agree with you. We both know, however, that they'd use such a ruling to their advantage and declare pretty much anyone they wanted to as being a "terrorist" in order to strip them of due process.
...
If he's a citizen of the United States he deserves due process.
>Terrorists deserve to be shot and killed on site.
And you wonder why these orgs run rampant.
It's a wonder we caught this fucker alive.
(He Isn't)
Absolutely.
Either everyone gets it or no one does.
Yes.
That doesn't mean endless appeals. He deserves his day in court, the benefit of the doubt and an attorney.
It's pretty open and shut though. He's an islamic terrorist, not an american. he killed people and planted bombs on american clay. execute him
This.
Whether you like it or not, the man is an American Citizen. If Timothy McVeigh recieved due process, then so should this piece of trash.
We are a nation of laws. If we don't abide by them for everyone then it becomes okay to ignore them for everyone.
Unless we want to devolve to the point of the government deciding you are a terrorist for not agreeing with them and shooting you and your dog on your morning walk, we will give him his due process.
Anyone suspected of committing a crime in the US is guaranteed due process under the US Constitution.
Anything less is literally unconstitutional and a sure sign of a crumbling republic and the encroachment of a dictatorship.
Then it shouldn't be a time consuming process for him to have his day in court.
You take them alive with a civilian police force you give them a civilian trial. You take them alive with military forces you give them a military trial.
It's pretty cut and dry to me.
>Terrorists deserve to be shot and killed on site. They gave up there rights when they decided to commit a crime. Hang the muzzy
No no no, they have to interrogate him first.
/thread
Snowden was a terrorist that clearly wanted to harm the united states of america and its citizens. He should have shot as well!
Yes, he should still get due process.
Then, he should get the full extent of his inevitable punishment.
well, yes. of course
there is no need to waste the money when we can be done with it with a $.25 bullet
Of course he does. Everyone has a right to due process, as well as a right to a fair trial, as well as a trial without cruel and unusual punishment, you retarded basic human rights usurping cum faggot.
Yes give the gov more power to declare anyone they wise to not have rights. Fucking retards.
Why is he even arrested? He did nothing wrong.
Sure give him due process, then execute him with something involving pork and make sure its well known.
So informing people that the United States government is indiscriminately spying on millions of innocent Americans makes you a terrorist now?
>there is no need to waste the money when we can be done with it with a $.25 bullet
And once you start using the $.25 bullets, you create a situation where rule of law is out the window and the government can do whatever the fuck they want. I don't think you realize what the fuck you're asking for.
If that's the society you want - go emigrate to north korea or china. That's more suitable to your bootlicking tendencies.
Yes.
Do you need a copy of the Constitution?
/thread
He divulged classified information to our enemies and put the entire country in danger. That's pretty clearly treason.
No for the same reason Maggie Thatcher didn't recognize ira members as POWs. It grants terrorists a dignity that we do not wish to give them.
I am for the constitution and unfortunately he was a citizen so the 14th applies.
I can't say I support the constitution if I only apply it when it conveniences me.
No matter how much I want some niggers to hang.
He divulged classified information to the american people which revealed that their own government is violating the constitution.
And the response, particularly from dumbfucks like yourself, has been to attack the messenger for revealing the crimes of the state.
Kindly eat some .45 aspirin. You're more a traitor to the republic than Snowden is.
Justice is for people, OP; not animals, no matter how well trained.
While this case may be cut and dry, leftists will still use the precedent that "terrorists" aren't worthy of due process. They already have a foggy definition of a terrorist for this exact purpose
Committing treason does not invalidate your citizenship nor your rights. You'll be tried in a court of your peers and you be sent to jail if you commit this crime. We are a civilized country not a shithole in Africa, I suggest you go there and live for the rest of your miserable fucking life.
If he got his citizenship the right and proper way, no, because he's in custody.
...yes. Jesus Christ the slippery slope is real with due process shit.
Ideally people like this will resist capture and get 5.56mm of due process
>So does he deserve the protection of the U.S. Constitution?
Of course.
If you start to make concessions, soon they'll make everything became "terrorism" just to punish people that disagree with the government. "Psychological terrorism" or something like that.
If they wanted a more flexible justice system, the US should have choose a absolute monarchy instead of a liberal democracy when the US was founded
Islam is incompatible with the Constitution. Islam requires the elimination of all man-made law, which Islam defines as tyranny, and its complete replacement with what they think is the perfect legal system: the Shariah of Allah as confirmed by all the scholars. There is nothing un-Constitutional about killing an enemy of the Constitution. That is what all servicemembers take an oath to do.
American citizens deserve due process, but muslims shouldn't be american citizens.
Not liberals; establishment.
Whether it's a liberal or conservative veneer - the ones actually running the show are the establishment, and it's the establishment that wants to muddy the waters so that they can eventually declare domestic dissent to be terroristic acts, and since dissent is terrorism and terrorism gets no due process, dissenters get no due process.
And thereupon we have a situation where everyone posting on Cred Forums is rounded up into gas chambers for disagreeing with the deep state, all done with no due process or day in court, because the dumbfucks here argued against it and helped push it into reality.
It's amazing how fucking stupid people on this website can be.
But because of the Espionage Act Snowden wouldn't be tried in an open court. He'd be tried behind closed doors without the ability to defend himself.
Ok, so everyone on Us soil has the right to trial now.
We can keep him in a minimum security holding cell for the next 5 years while the investigation goes on as well.
Happy?
Why?
I thought US was a secular state
Doesn't work that way bud.
Otherwise you just have the government fabricating the fact that you're a muslim.
Oh look, they found a koran on you, guess you were a muslim oh well no constitution for you!
Use your fucking brain for ten goddamn seconds would you?
This is the only valid position.
If he's an American citizen he deserves due process, if you start picking and choosing on who deserves what it opens the floodgates for abuse.
That's what all religions want, including christianism.
"But Peter and the apostles answered, 'We must obey God rather than men'."
Yes.
t.Military worker for the NSA
"... against all enemies, foreign and DOMESTIC".
Stop sucking dicks for 10 minutes a day and pick up a fucking history book.
Anyone, citizen or not, who finds themselves accused of a crime by any government is entitled to due process. You can't let the accuser be the jury and jailer. It's unamerican.
>labels like enemy combatant are just excuses to avoid being honorable
Well, it's better to milk him for intel than to kill him and lose any leads. Anyway, other inmates are just going to give him justice, they always take care of the sickos in jail.
Yes he deserves due process. Everyone arrested for a crime here in America has a right to a trial by jury and to be presumed innocent until proven guilty. Even if the guy is as guilty as sin and the trial is mostly a formality, we must still go through all the motions with as much sincerity as possible. Not only to uphold his rights, but to ensure that every American arrested gets the same fair treatment.
Yes, it's a shame but necessary to prevent us going down the slippery slope of weakening the fifth and sixth amendments. I'm sorry it has to be this way but there's no use in letting a few Muzzies ruin it for the rest of us. Just stop them from coming here in the future.
t. aggressive constitutionalist
of course he deserves due process
hes a fucking citizen
he'll obviously be found guilty on all charges, he'll probably confess. the fuck is wrong with CNN and the rest of you
>Snowden is a domestic enemy
>disagreeing with me
???
>They gave up there rights when they decided to commit a crime
That's not how the constitution works.
Does he deserve due process? Yes; because its the fucking law. If that due process leads to him riding the lightning on old sparky then all the better; but I'm not going to take a shit on the constitution just so I can hang some camel jockey a little quicker.
No. Put him on trial, then execute him. We're not savages.
>Yes; because its the fucking law.
Not an argument.
Replace the Muslim with a white nationalist when the revolution comes
Scarier isn't it?
terrorists have no right to due process uinder the constitution, neither do sex offenders its been proven in the supreme court. Both groups should be killed on site.
With such a publicly known case if they try to use that act that would most likely mean the end of that act.
Look at how fucked up our government is. We don't want to be staring down the barrel of my own gun one day.
You sneezed in front of a public officer and frighten him you are now a terrorist.
You told your wife she looks attractive you are now a sex offender.
Your put to death not for these acts but cus the gov wants you dead
Everyone who can be taken in alive deserves due process, how is this even a question?
>the second time (((liberals))) directly attack due process in less than six months
The timeline is accelerating. If you are white and you don't have a gun you deserve whatever enrichment happens to you.
The oath is to defend the Constitution, not the political narrative to the pet projects of aspiring tyrants. What Snowden revealed was blatantly unconstitutional and fundamentally anti-American.
If you want to be a bootlicking turbo-cuck, so be it, that's your right -- but don't put "shoe shiner" on your business cards, call it what it is.
>declare war on mudshit jihadist
>throw mudshit jihadists in gitmo
not that hard desu
>You sneezed in front of a public officer and frighten him you are now a terrorist.
Must be charged with a criminal act.
>You told your wife she looks attractive you are now a sex offender.
Anyone who has sex with a child under 18 its rape and that is proven scientifically in court since its impossible for a child under 18 to consent to sex with an adult. If it is an adult and the victim is a woman than the man is just as fault since its always a white male mostly looking at any sex offender registry.
Kill em all, nothing of value is lost, and you lose the argument.
So you're arguing that the state can disregard its own laws?
Because that's the only place you can go with that line of reasoning. You really want to go down the rabbit hole with that one dude?
What sort of due process is this?
No, he's Muslim
Yes but, try the shithead for Treason. Also bring back the firing squads also
>Must be charged with a criminal act.
oh now you want due process? come on
Age of consent varies depending upon the state. They all arnt 18.
In my ideal world, no.
But if he is an American citizen, then yes.
Is he a citizen? If so he gets due process, no exceptions.
Is he not a citizen? Then he doesn't necessarily enjoy that protection.
Case closed.
Fuck that sandgoogle.
>since its always a white male
What are crime statistics for $800?
Let me guess, #you'rewithher
Give him due process and fry his ass in the electric chair.
Due process for the American white man used to be based.
Terrorist getting fried the fuck up or getting the firing squad... metal as fuck western justice.
Remember hangings?>
No.
Every piece of power you give them will be reworked to point at us.
You are an idiot. The whole point of ISIS and other groups is the rejection of man made law and rhe seperation of church and state. They want us to break our rules because they can call us hypocrites who break the law when it suits our agenda. If we do not grant him his rights we are no better than those backwards ass shit brains.
The West could turn the Middle East into a biohazardous, radioactive crater ridden landscape that would be less habitable than the fucking Moon. But we do not even consider doing that because we are not monsters. We are striving for an ideal. And if we bend at all then it will not be long before we break and our society crumbles.
So yes, he deserves his day in court, because the alternative is the eventual destruction of our civilization.
>.. later on, fifteen years down the road.
>This user thinks back to this post
>Thanks to google storing anons IP and matching with their posts, he was convicted of posting on the one and only, "Cred Forums" website.
>In 2031, it is illegal to have ever posted on the "Cred Forums" website, let alone to have ever insinuated someone should be murdered.
>In 2031, this user goes to jail for the rest of their life for associating with the mysterious "Cred Forums" hacker and calling for murder against a naturalized citizen.
Toss him into a wood chipper, and feed the results to pigs.
>too cost effective
about .50c per round 5 guys, 1 is blank
lethal injection is some $10,000
Seriously, if it weren't for liberal lawyers and judges, due process would be fine in these cases.
Just choose a conservative jury, put the death penalty on the table, give him a trial... then watch him fry.
It's fairly simple.
White man lost his fangs and now the sheepdogs want justice done outside of blue pill zones.
If the blue pilled want to get murdered, then they'll let him walk. If they want to live, they'll give him a trial and either kill him or put him in a prison in Alaska.
America needs its own version of Siberian prisons.
"It's the law" isn't a valid justification for a law
that's obamba tier nonsense
due process is a god given right
He deserves due process and due process should see him hang from the end of the rope.
Hell, I thought you guys should have given Osama a trial. Mostly because I make my decisions based on what I would find the most amusing, but also because it would have been the right thing to do.
> Dilithium mines of Rura Penthe
>30 years hard labor
>he's a terrorist
That hasn't been proven in a court of law.
Yes, it is open and shut, but there must be a trial. It's the American way. John Adams defended the British soldiers responsible for the Boston Massacre because he believed everyone deserves a fair trial. This sandnigger is no different. It's evident that he did it, and it will be proven in court. We can't stray from American values, though.
PoW treatment.
Due process.
>So you're arguing that the state can disregard its own laws?
> using that image when it's a proven fact that the state has always (and will always) disregarded their own fucking laws
If there is clear video and photo evidence of them doing it and/or confessing or bragging, they should be skinned alive on live tv and broadcast on all channels at once. Their corpse should be fed to pigs.
>Killed people.
He failed like your mother picking a suitable mate.
This is the numale liberal perspective where life isn't sacred and we take wild actions out of fear because we're scared. Just move to china faggot if you don't like it here.
>giving non-citizens a fair trial when they aren't even on your clay
He'll get his trial before the pearly gates anyway :^)
Guantanamo sucks dick. Not terrible enough.
They should literally be sent to Alaska, enslaved, forced to work coal mines for 14 hours a day.
The punishment should be worse than death.
No, he really wont. Go spread your christian propaganda elsewhere, faggot.
>killing non-citizens for crimes committed and claiming the justice system doesn't apply to them
Korea will be knocking on your door next to shoot you for mocking their leader.
The souls of terrorists should be drained, they energies leeched, and they be forced to work in difficult conditions.
They should pay back the cost of dealing with them.
We need to treat these barbarians lime Romans treated barbarians. We need to crush their spirits.
I mean, I could see that. As long as he definitely gets convicted at the end of it. It seems like a waste of time and money though desu
Absolutely. All citizens get due process. We have a constitution. If you don't want due process then give up your right to guns
>Terrorists deserve to be shot and killed on site.
Yes, but then they'd twist the meaning of the word terrorist to mean whatever they want it to mean to get rid of dissidents. Which definitely includes the average Cred Forumslack.
you wanna get fucked? cause ill fuck your loose cuck ass
not a numale
not a liberal
voting for Trump
why don't you try some other buzzwords, retard?
Don't see why he shouldn't just be hanged on the spot.
Came here to say this.
everyone is owed due process of law as an inalienable right. That's why it's in the FUCKING BILL OF RIGHTS YOU GOD DAMN MONGOLOID.
Its we the people, not us and them.
Hang him while his set ablaze.
Fuck. Ok, better question. A muzzie swearing an oath in court on his holy book means jack fucking shit. That falls well within the sort of deception that's both allowed and encouraged in islam. Not only that but doing it for real is expressly forbidden because it'd be a form of shirk which is the only unforgivable "sin" or whatever the fuck they call haram shit. What's the solution here??
You know you are trolling
every citizen*
BoR doesn't apply to non citizens
Due Processes
Only reason being, the next terrorist could just be drone striked (legally) on US soil.
Everyone deserves due process. yes even niggers and sand niggers
Thats racist tho you are saying non americans arent human
2/10
/Thread
>It's pretty open and shut though
Then the trial will last a day or two cuck.
I don't care if he did it on live stream chanting aloha snackbar while wearing his SSN and Federal driver licence he still has rights to a trial as an American citizen and stripping him of those rights and allowing government to do this only makes his attack successful in its political goals.
There are things much more important than Soviet "Justice"
I wish we lived in a world where I could wholeheartedly agree with you. I firmly believe in due process, and I feel like it's the highest form of justice that is distinct to the US.
That said, I also think our court system is absolutely fucked and that our government is corrupt to the fucking core. So in this instance I believe it'd be best to get it over with and put two in his fucking melon.
Oh good, someone reasonable. ? Any thoughts?
You are a bad troll enjoy your ban
niggers
>be american in 2031
>government comes to violate your first amendment rights
>shoot them
>eat burger
Marxist doctrine is poisonous. I'd say follow it at your own peril but you're following it at ours too, so instead I'll say grow the fuck up and get your head out of your ass.
Lying in a court of law is illegal regardless of what book you swear the oath to tell the truth on the oath stands regardless.
You're inventing a problem that simply doesn't exist
Grow up just because someone has american citizenship doesnt give them more rights
I'd also easily say that swearing said oath means jack shit to anyone regardless of religion if they're liars anyway.
It certainly hasn't stopped 90+% of Congress from violating their oath for example
Sweet. Good to know. This is going to be a stupid question but why the fuck is that part of the process then? Nailing them for perjury after the fact comes to mind off course but that can't be all of it, right?
Who is this "Cred Forums"?
came to say this. it's already been said.
we can all stop now.
0.5/10
blow me leaf
You are shit troll
>That said, I also think our court system is absolutely fucked and that our government is corrupt to the fucking core.
>So in this instance I believe it'd be best to get it over with and put two in his fucking melon.
The government being as insanely corrupt as it currently stands is a very very strong argument for due process to be even more intensely defended.
Relinquishing a right to a corrupt government is exponentially more dangerous than relinquishing it to a benevolent government.
...
The designation "enemy combatant" should only apply to overseas warfare, and even then it's dangerous because it undermines the Geneva Convention on treatment of Prisoners of War. It's an unnecessary end-run around established procedures that work. On domestic soil, someone making war against the US or aiding its declared enemies should be tried for treason.
Only slippery slope left is his ass hole at night from all that prison rape
"deserve" ? hahah wow, how stupid people have become.
its due process. "deserve" is not even part of the equation in the eyes of blindfolded justice.
I was wondering when we'd get to this.
Due process is for US citizens as a civil right, is for statutory, criminal jurisprudence.
Due process does not apply to war, or enemy combatants.
Its the reason we've had Guantanamo. And the ONLY reason we've had Guantanamo for so long..so we can keep enemy combatants without the question being raised of due process having to apply to them.
IF we would house such enemy combatants on US soil, a good case could be made for them to receive due process. So Guantanamo is a necessity...which is why Obama could never get rid of it.
Yeah..a good case could be made that since this person was on US soil AND a naturalized US citizen, that he should have due process. I don't like that, you don't like that and it shouldn't be that way. He's in reality, an enemy from radical Islam, not a statutory criminal.
But this is how its going to go down. ACLU and Al Sharpton or the same ilk is gonna have him lawyer up, and demand due process. If it goes all the way up, the Supreme court is going to rule on it, and yes they will give him due process since he's on US soil and a citizen.
And at that point...you and I are going to have our all our war enemies ad infinitum on US soil claiming, and getting...due process forever. And as you know, that changes into a war we can never win.
>YFW you realize that this type of engagement has been planned, because our enemies realized they'd never win at a war with us.
They had to come in...and this is how we are having our own civil rights used against us. There will come a point where they will vote our 1st and 2nd amendments away. Not in 10 years, maybe not in 50. But the Muslims have been playing their same convert/conquer/kill game since 653 A.D....they plan long-term.
>This is going to be a stupid question but why the fuck is that part of the process then?
It is an old tradition from 17th century London where one could plead a lesser sentence from the jury on religious grounds. If done the defendant would receive a branding on their right hand(T for thievery F for felony M more murder) as to ensure 100% that they would only be able to make this plea once which was all that was allowed.
It has stuck around as a tradition and modified into what we have today regarding perjury.
This is a rough explanation but you'd be better doing your own research.
There's no such thing as a stupid question but one should highly considering asking Google first
Clearly secularism has made an upstanding citizen out of you, apostrophe-dodger. Reminder that you'll burn in hell for your transgressions.
He will know the pain of treason
>crime
>act of war
You are trying to apply statutory jurisprudence to war. Yeah, the supreme court will end up agreeing with you, but at this point, NO..legally, statutory crimes in the US are not acts of war. War is its own level, and international law applies to that. US laws do not apply to acts of war, or enemy combatants...yet.
But they will. They will. see my previous post.
>If it goes all the way up, the Supreme court is going to rule on it, and yes they will give him due process since he's on US soil and a citizen.
It's been that the Constitution applies to people on US soil regardless of citizenship since the 14th amendment user.
It's why non citizens can legally purchase firearms so long as they're here legally and can pass a NICS check
This anyone else saying otherwise should leave.
Deserve? Someone's not a student of Law.
Much appreciated, thanks for explaining it.
>There's no such thing as a stupid question but one should highly considering asking Google first
Usually do. Trusting those bastards less and less every day though. Also don't like passing up an opportunity to talk to folks who know their shit. Anyhow thanks again.
due process isn't some magic phrase
It doesn't necessarily mean a jury trial that lasts years
This desu senpai
Mumia Abu Jamal
YES, leaf, YES. In the US, trials and appeals can last years and years and years and years and years and years and years and years and years.
The trials are speedy to get to them..well as fast as can be. It's the appeals process that can go on for 20 years.
You're parsing that too finely.
AND was my operand, not OR. See my full previous post.
Gee, so are you saying we should have Sharia instead, CNN? Do you shit on Western values like due process just taunt people with brains?
If he's a U.S. citizen in the U.S., then he deserves due process.
You take it from the people you don't like, there is grounds for other people to take it from you.
Doesn't mean he shouldn't get the death penalty though.
Try him the way they try enemies of the state in his country
Any and all citizens of the United States, regardless of crime, deserve due process.
It's one of the things that separates us from garbage nations, like, say, the entire Middle East.
Proud of my fellow Ameribros standing up for Due Process rights.
Feelsgoodman
The word "due" implies that he does. That's what due means, you illiterate faggots.
I hope someone tries to hold this against the "alt-right"
>It's pretty open and shut though. He's a deplorable neo-nazi terrorist, not an american. he posted rare pepes and triggered protected classes on american clay. execute him.
We must not establish legal precedent that can be used against us you dum-dum.
You're an Islamic terrorist, you converted to Islam and are no longer an american. You killed people and planted bombs on american soil, traitor. You're to be executed immediately. **KNOCK KNOCK**
we're dumb enough to let him slip through the cracks. we gave him citizenship, let him go to the middle east and back and grow out his scraggly fucking hate beard in the name of a medieval pedophile goat fucker warlord. he's done far more damage with the attack than take a few tax payer dollars.the least we could do is embarass ourselves by allowing him to exercise the rights we granted to him out of sheer stupidity.
You ask if he deserves due process, and say "yes"
then say he deserves to be shot
Jesus Christ you are retarded