Is France the Next Big Thing?

First, the United States was the epicenter and originator of popular animation and cartoons. Then, into the later 20th-century, Japan overtook America as the new great animation station.

Is France going to be the next big animation wonder? Will it be able to produce the next big wave of animation, comics, and cartoon storytelling within the next severa generations?

Other urls found in this thread:

youtu.be/rXLnE9DmH1M
youtube.com/watch?v=Q62RjHfX5yM
animecons.com/events/state.shtml/202016016
twitter.com/SFWRedditVideos

They gotta do something about that Muslim immigration thing first. And this is coming from a liberal.

Hint: Rebuild the Middle East.

>Japan overtook America as the new great animation station.

Just because you go to anime cons doesn't mean the country cares about anime as much as it cares about Disney.

...

Only if it keeps producings sexualy charged characters.

.

France had animation and film before the US did. Google Emile Cohl.

Immigration is an entrepreneurial, cultural, and economic boon to a given country. I know a lot of recent immigration and refugee problems have created some social unrest, but people coming to other countries of their own valuation is somewhat of a risk in of itself, and the fresh ideas and drive that they possess in a new society will allow them to thrive and produce new things that wouldn't have otherwise been produced.

The same applies to the animation and creative industry. Immigrants penetrating the art sector will contribute new IPs and concepts in an otherwise stale market that cannot think outside the box. (i.e. Superman, the greatest American hero and progenitor of all western superhero comics, was invented by Canadian immigrants to the United States)

youtu.be/rXLnE9DmH1M

But it never hit the big time on the level of Disney and other big name studios. France might have developed the technology first, but it never dominated the market and brought fresh new concepts to entertainment in the same way the United States or Japan did. How, however, that might be changing.

...

I doubt it and frankly I kinda hope not. We're fine making things for their own purpose instead of trying to conquer the world through animation. And you probably don't want us to try either, remember Arthur and the Minimoys or however they translated it.

When will we see the rise of German animation?

The King and the Mockingbird is credited as a big influence on Miyazaki and Takahata, who in turn heavily influenced theatrical animation in Japan.

After France.

That doesn't count tho

I'm not sure what you mean by "hit the big time" in this context. I think that creating/pioneering film and animation is substantial enough for any credit. The US stuff by Disney is good, but you have to remember that came about 30 years later. And with anime another 30+ years after that. So, you can see it is not such a simple thing to compare them all together. I think what you are really referring to is longevity.

Huh? Why the fuck wouldn't it?

What do you mean?

>Then, into the later 20th-century, Japan overtook America as the new great animation station.

ITT: Things that never happened

>French animation
>survivining Macron "reforms" on anything

Are you paid well by Soros at least? Just asking.

>Rebuild the Middle East.
Arabs countrys are way more rich and able to do it than the West.
don't hate Europe when your Emirates prefer to fund a new golf trak in the desert.

Macron follows the money and knows that france leades the world in art. He's ok with it. He's not right wing like the world tends to portray

I hope so.

In that video he addresses Japan's case, which I disagree with him on, as Japan's a special case of a country. Despite its social and economic problems, I don't think they'll need large-scale immigration. But all of his points still remain for literally every other country on the planet. He speaks true.

What is this?

Immigration is a cancer for humanity, that destroys the different civilizations in the name of global economical dictatorship.

>(You)

The only reform he's made that concerns media is changing who chooses the leaders of public media from the CSA (censors) to unions of public media workers. This is somewhere between irrelevant and good.

Could you faggots abstain for one fucking thread.

HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA

Macron is like a politically correct Trump, economics wise

He's a centrist

Why? Your boss is offended?

Because we're trying to talk about cartoons here, not dummy's first hot take on global politics. There's a board for that.

France should be able to produce the cartoons that America will never do.

Some shit adaptation of a mediocre but fun french comics
And apparently as much Cred Forumspedo bait as that shit Sisters comics

I see people praising French cartoons a lot, but as far as good recent TV animation I'm only familiar with Lastman
Have they produced anything else worthwhile?

nah, french always had a couple of great cartoons (especially when they work with japanese), but the large majority is childish crap even worse than Ladybug

go watch Dofus and Wakfu
Asterix - The Mansions of the gods was fun too but I couldnt find a solid sub for it, sadly.

no
france also heavily subsidizes their arts & film industry in order to out compete hollywood and they still get drowned out.
as much of a hit as wakfu was on image boards doesn't mean its a success with a general international audience, they had to have a kickstarter in order to even produce a dub and it was terrible.

>Is France going to be the next big animation wonder?
Nope.
We just don't have the entertainment infrastructure for it.
Hell it's already really hard for our national channels to produce live-action TV shows that aren't cheap SOL or very lowkey crime stories, so bigger animation projects are completely out of the question, asidre from a handful of movies really.

>Have they produced anything else worthwhile?
Not really in TV format. Far too expensive, none of the networks can really afford it outside of kid shows that are easier to sell and broadcast.

I'm French but I don't own a TV so only shows I'm familiar with are ironically through Cred Forums, and they're not really good. As a general rule though We're better at theatrical than TV.

Mansion of Gods was theatrical.

>tfw Besson is willing but has absolutely horrendous taste in animation

in TV animation?
In the 80s oldies category, Ulysses 31 and the Mysterious Cities of Gold are great cartoons (but it's franco-japanese)
More "recently" (already 11 years ago), Oban Star Racers was uite good

France seems to have more creative freedom than the USA (just an observation). Euro animation also seems to have anime influences without seeming copy-cat. I'm not well informed on this, but France does look like it has a lot of potential animation wise.

What about Italy? Whats Italy's potential?

>t. 'the unconquered' descendants of ye olde Kent and Essex, who took invader dick like champs

You do you, you six toed pony fuckers.

If we're allowed to go that far back then there's a decent number.
From the 70s through the 2000s or so you've got the Once Upon a Time... series.
Animal of Farthing Woods was an EU production but used mostly British and French talent.
The 90s Tintin adaptation was good, as have been all the Lucky Luke ones (1984, 1991, 2001).
Aside from New Lucky Luke late 1990s and early 2000s Xilam produced solid things like Space Goofs or Oggy and the Cockroaches.
The Lascars is pretty good.
I feel bad for forgetting the Shadocks.
Even Galactik Football, despite being mediocre, is probably a better sports cartoon than anything the US has produced.

And yeah actually recently there's Les Grandes Grandes Vacances which Cred Forums seems for once to love for other reasons than waifus.

we have more creative freedom than USa because we aren't restricted by puritan laws and an extreme mindset of " doing animation solely for money"
in France, i believe there is a real research of experimentation and research about animation

i don't know about Italy, what did they produced recently ?

Italy has made pic related, they're allowed to rest on their laurels now.
Are you trying to summon WITCHfag?

>in France, i believe there is a real research of experimentation and research about animation
Sort of but that's mostly art students over at Gobelins these days, not in mainstream TV animation, not anymore.

>Implying the Germanics can make anything that isn't terrifying.

Lets ruin the thread by summon him
W.I.T.C.H and Winx are 2 that come to mind

t.bh what you see on TV is what makes mainly money (except for oddballs like LastMan) you need to be in a partilcularly restricted kabal of indie animator

What France needs is it's own version of the Manga industry, and then the popular french comics then get adapted by studios into animation.

It's like you have no idea how France works.
Our local comic book industry is ridiculously active and has been overproducing for a while now.
Problem is again that there isn't really anyone who can pay for TV adaptations of succesful comic books because animation is that expensive. Meaning that there are some adaptations but only of the really most popular stuff which is usually childrens gag or SOL series.

>What France needs is it's own version of the Manga industry
That has existed for longer than Marvel or DC have existed. Pic related is one of the French equivalents to Shonen Jump, and has been published consistently since 1938.
>then the popular french comics then get adapted by studios into animation.
That has also been a thing for decades.

>French
Well Belgian really, but same difference when it comes to this.

>Tintin Magazine is dead
>Pilote is dead
>A Suivre is dead
>Métal Hurlant is dead
>even fucking Pif Gadget is dead
why did things have to go so wrong?

Oversaturation maybe? General downswing of the market (especially faced with manga starting in the 80s)? I dunno but it's a good question.
There's still L'Echo des Savanes at least.

Oh and Pif is still a thing, albeit only published every 3 months.

Let me rephrase that. What France needs is it's own version of the Manga industry, in that it needs to be popular with nerdy Americans with NEET bux.

Fluide Glacial is still arround too right?
>I dunno but it's a good question.
That was kind of a rethoric question, we know what killed the prepublication magazine and it was :
>TV
When we got rid of the 2 national channel standard and got first 4 then 5 then 6 and cable in less than 15 years, there was a sudden afflux of entertainment that was pretty much all for the same price that you were already paying anyway (except for cable obviously) and that was what took comic books out of their spot as the first form of entertainment for the family
>split in readership
I don't think it can be overstated how much of a divide Pilote and its editorial policies created in the late 60s and how that caused the massive split in the 70s between the aging family friendly formula that had been the norm for so long and more leftfield, artsy, experimental stuff. So in the end the "all ages" formula of Spirou and Tintin couldn't survive and the traditionnal adventure series were outdated in a sense now that there could be similar things focusing on one audience precisely.
And it's interesting to see that to this day editors are still reaching for that unattainable title that will be good for everyone.

I really would rather not.
But you've got the whole Franga branch with things like Wakfu and the Ankama catalog in general (Freaks Squeele) that are fairly popular with Cred Forums and Americans in general, they're just very poorly distributed in the US for some reason that eludes me.

Yeah but Cred Forums's so worthless even /mlp/ is a better board, at least it works as a containment board.

>Fluide Glacial is still arround too right?
Right, for some reason I always fuse it with L'Echo in my head.

The TV part was kind of implied by the general downswing of the comic market, but I didn't know about the splitting readership part. You're way more knowledgeable on that topic than I am, thanks for the info.

dude, you think media workers don't follow all his reform on the working time and shit? get real. After transport their next to lose all their state money and special status.

But they have. Its called euro-manga. But it wasnt successfull.

Possibly, we'll see when that happens, as is it's purely speculation. There have already been 2 strikes from the public media since his election and he's barely grazed them at all, they probably won't go out too easy.

Honestly I wouldn't oppose them losing their full summer vacations, there's no real reason TV production should grind to a halt in summer.

Euro collaboration TV cartoons ought to be a thing again.
Il etait une fois.. stuff was awesome.

>Intermarriage is a cancer for humanity, that destroy the different lineages in the name of global familial dictatorship.

If you want to see how much of a difference there was, try to find the compiled semesters of some magazines. They all used to do it (and Spirou still does it).
Compare Pilote to Spirou or Tintin at a similar period. The difference in tone, styles, types of content is insane. Like, in the same issue of a magazine you can have two pages of Lucky Luke, Gotlib being a shithead, a single-page quickie of Brétécher, four pages of Druillet, Achille Talon and a short-novel.
And really if you can find some of the Pilote semesters, do get them. The majority of what was in it was not only really good but has also never been published ever since, especially as it had so many one-shots and quickies, some of which by people who are completely forgotten now.

>Hint: Rebuild the Middle East.
Hint: America should just stop destroying it in the first place.

France and Ireland are both great. They aren't controlled by big studios afraid to take risks (America) or a shitty fan "subculture" pressuring them into making formulaic schlock (Japan).

I only ever read Spirou as a kid (well in the 90s there wasn't much choice left) but even there there was some tonal whiplash between something like Cédric and JKJ Bloche or Soda, although nothing to the level you're describing.

>And really if you can find some of the Pilote semesters, do get them
I'm shit out of money right now but I'll think about it if I see some.

They are getting there.

Stuff like Les Nombrils (French >Canadian), the whole lanfeust/troy series and Sky Dolls is kinda like France own's manga niche.

>Fuck your sister
>Allow millions of Arabs and Africans into Europe
>Pick one

Fuck off.

>One family interbreeds with itself for centuries.
>Versus populations of millions.

Also plenty of the newcomers are very inbred, so you're not actually doing the population any favours genetically by introducing them.

They had to adapt ultimately, this started in the mid 70s. In the case of Spirou they ended up publishing stuff like Archie Cash (the story of a Charles Bronson lookalike enforcing law and order in South America. It was pretty violent for Spirou at the time) or the whole debacle with Les Innomables later in the 80s (a series about drug smuggling and prostitution in Hong Kong and later on about the Korean War, illustrated like Astérix. The backlash from parents was pretty bad). The damage had already been done .
90s Spirou was still somewhat better than the Disney translation dumping though. As you said it had JKJ Bloche which is pretty neat

>user lists legit points
>Counter with buzzwords and conspiracy theories you learned from Cred Forums

Just leave, kid.

Why should issues of culture and heritage be argued on the basis of economic wellbeing for a few people at the top? How does Pierre, Hans, or Dave, benefit from mass immigration?

Interesting.
Not being a regular enough reader, I tended to skip things that relied on continuity, since I didn't actually read week to week. So things like JKJ Bloche or even Bluecoats were mostly lost on me as a kid because I spent most of my allowance buying capeshit religiously. I did get into Bluecoats not long later via albums (my main BD input throughout childhood) at least.

It would be nice if we could incorporate some of the ways we do animation and put it into a single show

Actually no, he doesn't speak the truth. What he said is over simplified drivel. There is a lot more to the case of this particular migration than "If a bunch of red blobs mix in with blue blobs we get purple!"

He's a fucking moron and so are you if you think this is that simple.

it's that comic page a Rebecca sugar work?

>Bluecoats is still going on after 46 years and 61 albums, Cauvin and Lambil are still at the helm
Holy shit.

How do you mean? Like a Fantasia/2000/The Prophet anthology type show where it's mostly segments of mostly unrelated more or less experimental animation?

That could be neat but I don't see it making money, and it would require a hell of a budget to even get off the ground.

No, it's Germany as what is going on in France is 20 time worse then what is going on in Canada and Ireland is too busy blowing Butch Hartman and Genndy Tartakovsky to do anything meaningful.

In short just move to 3DCG like a normal person and you will be much happier this way.
But those greats still had Americans involved, namely people like Tom Ruegger and Bruce Timm as their own content was not as good to say the least.
No, far from it.

France is pumping a tremendous number of good animator. Thing nobody knows is that they all end up in Pixar/Disney/Dreamworks because no publisher ever want to remotely fund something unknown or too adult/special or something. And when someone achieve something, the movie/cartoon tank because they spent all the money on actual animation rather than marketing.

Fucking hell, I was absolutly turbomad by the absolute absence of coverage for the Dofus movie. Lastman cartoon almost did not exist because their publisher dumped the creators at the last second.

This. Give me my fucking Metal Hurlant back.

I think there is one simple reason: Ankama don't have enough dosh to afford such a risky move.

Tintin
Luck Luke
Wakfu and Dofus
Oggy and the cockroaches
Oban

lmao

This. I watched it last month and I felt fucking ashamed for not knowing it before.

Plus, there is a lot of japanese artist who got inspired by Moebius' work.

Animators are now taking inspiration from anime rather than American animation. America has abandoned 2D animated movies and outsourced its TV animation to Asia decades ago. Anime has taken 2D animation and animation in general beyond anything America could even envision. The anime industry has about twice the output of America. There actually are cons for anime, all over the world. Not so much for American animation (at least I've never heard of any). So yeah, Japan has overtaken America.

Cauvin will eventually consume Stan Lee's soul.

I'm gonna have to end up learning French, won't I?
My ancestors would be ashamed. They're probably ashamed of all the 2D porn I've fapped to, though.

Or maybe they were fapping next to you?

Uhhh....

>what is going on in France is 20 time worse then what is going on in Canada
How is that even close to being true when it comes to animation?
When did Canada make something like LastMan or Les Grandes Grandes Vacances?

I'm french and I'd rather not have our Cred Forums-related content be too big
Becoming number one also means having to produce massively
Let's stay in a position where we can produce innovative quality.

>I think there is one simple reason: Ankama don't have enough dosh to afford such a risky move.
Wouldn't someone on the Anglophone market have to make the move to adapt them, rather than Ankama themselves? Isn't that how most BD makes it to foreign market?

>Cauvin, Druillet, Peeters, Thilleux and Leloup will all die during your lifetime
I keep my fingers crossed that this happens after the Hergé heirs lose their shit when Tintin falls into public domains.
Nothing will make me as sad as knowing that Jean-Louis Pesch wll probably be dead within the next ten years

>Not so much for American animation (at least I've never heard of any).
Really?

>Also plenty of the newcomers are very inbred, so you're not actually doing the population any favours genetically by introducing them.
Well, introducing them prevents a population from becoming inbred themselves, and diversifies their own gene-pool to the advantage of their offspring. What's the problem?

youtube.com/watch?v=Q62RjHfX5yM

>There actually are cons for anime, all over the world. Not so much for American animation

You share a website with a popular cartoon that has it's own board here. There are even MLP conventions in Japan.

Somebody pls shop his shirt to say 'je suis de Fantasio'

>after the Hergé heirs lose their shit when Tintin falls into public domains.
Man, that's going to be awkward as fuck,

I cannot fucking wait. They've been such dicks about the whole thing, their tears are going to be absolutely delicious.

Yeah you're probably right, but nobody seems interested by their products. At least they're made their way to Netflix.

> Druillet
> the best artist I ever knew
> Want to adapt the Divine Comedy
> Will probably die soon because of drugs, cigarette and a fucklot of whiskey

why live.

Something from the last couple of years you numbnuts. Otherwise I'd have said The King and the Mockingbird or Fantastic Planet.

You're making it sound like that's bad.

sorry for the typos btw, it's quite late and I'm rather tired.

>implying Druillet can even die
He'll just fly back into hyperspace and transcend the fabric of reality.

Invalid, you might as well bring up Ulysses 31 & Inspector Gadget at this point.

>Superman, the greatest American hero and progenitor of all western superhero comics, was invented by Canadian immigrants to the United States
Tiny numbers of immigrants from one rich country to another, speaking the same language even, is the same as large masses of people with no skills who are hostile to the culture and form of government?

Intellectual property heirs are always a bunch of scumbags.

But... that's MY fucking point to you bringing up a fucking movie from 1983 to compare to TV series from 2015/16, you dense motherfucker. What has Canada done recently that justifies calling France's animation 20 times worse?

Really. I've never heard of them. Disney Expo isn't quite what we're talking about here.

Cons, not boards. And even in terms of internet communities and resources, American animation is on life support compared to anime. There may be MLP conventions (or a convention) in Japan but look at how many anime conventions were held in the US alone in 2016:
animecons.com/events/state.shtml/202016016

Even my small country has something like 30.

Fucking hell I hadn't realized how much he had actually done.
>Bluecoats from the beginning to today
>Cédric which is objectively and subjectively superior to Titeuf and Petit Spirou and that's a fact
>L'homme aux phylactères
>occasionnal Jess Long shorts
>Sammy
>Les Psy
>Agent 212
>all these collabs with Lambil
And he is still going.
It's honestly impressive.

How many levels of cultural Marxism are you on?

I don't know about your country but anime cons in mine have quickly devolved into general "nerdy shit" cons, I remember weebs getting mad about it. The most popular manga con in my region (Polymanga) had fucking Holly Mary Combs from the Charmed TV show as the headliner this year.
t. Switzerland.

>general "nerdy shit" cons
They kinda have to if they want to be more than the local manga stores having their booths and being surrounded by counterfeight figurine sellers. It's hard to get guests from Japan aside from the really big cons and the range of possible events is pretty limited. Once you have a karaoke room or two, some pop quizzes, the weeb associations and forums having their get-together, you can't do much else if you limit yourself to japanese content.

I would say to look at Mexico

There's potential

90>Albert Uderzo is 90 years old
I know he did some really bad Asterix story when he was alone, but I still will be sad when he will die.

Good people make bad decisions, that doesn't make them bad people.

My point was that the high number of "anime cons" doesn't necessarily represent the fan following in these countries, since most of those are anime cons by name only. It just happens that the manga craze of the 2000s is the vehicle cons have taken to flood Europe and South America (cons have been a thing in the US for way longer than they've read/watched nipshit).

What a shitty cover too.

There are more general cons but judging by the descriptions these cons are indeed focused on anime/Japanese pop culture.

>you can't do much else if you limit yourself to japanese content.
You never heard of the Paris Japan expo.

Sorry, but I can't see Germany becomming the next big thing. The networks aren't really that innovative and streaming services are too obsessed with jerking off the crime and mystery genre. Since animation is considered to be for kids, that naturally won't get mixed. And movies, well, they have potential but they will very likely be ruined by unfunny jokes, just like pretty much every German movie.

fAnd even if someone actually makes a good and successfull animated series, you can bet your ass that every network will rip it off make it's own knock-off, and they will always get shittier as time progresses. People who always mock the chinese for making shitty bootlegs propably never saw the evolution process of a successfull German show. Or it just dies straight away because it had 0.01% lower ratings than expected.

He literally said
>It's hard to get guests from Japan aside from the really big cons
in the same fucking sentence.

>no faithful anime adaptation, no scanlation, fucking expensive
I doubt it can work like manga did

Why not make awesome puppet theater shows or stop motion things like that Wes Anderson movie about dogs?

Nah, never heard of the con I've been to 7 times and has fuckloads of vidya, TV related content, the same web-creators every year and manages to get a lot of guests by being one of the biggest conventions on the continent.
It pretty much hasn't been limited to japanese content for a decade now. FFS at one point it was even coupled with Comic-Con Europe because that was the only way to keep it large enough to justify the location.
Oh, and it is still loaded with counterfeight sellers.

Not worth doing that for TV, France isn't as big on puppets as it used to be, and was never as good at stop motion as Brits.

The anime industry should be considered a fluke that's highly unlikely to be repeated anywhere else. Just having an animation industry to speak of is unusual, and even the American industry is a bit of a paper tiger since it relies so heavily on outsourcing and also benefits from American/English language cultural dominance.