I have to force myself to admit I enjoy this game

I'd actually put Dual Destinies below JFA. I just loved JFA's 2nd and 4th cases.

T&T

There are no bad ace attorney ganes just that are less good than others

You're a bloody wanker.

Not sure but if you're asking for help on that part but if you are here's a hint: the statement you have to present on is the one where he says he was never alone

Full answer: present the reception photo

Comparing it to SoJ

5-4/5 > 6-5 > 6-DLC > 6-3 > 5-3 > 6-4 > 5-DLC > 6-2 > 5-1 > 6-1 > 5-2

I hope the ghost of Dahlia finds you.

AJ is legitimately bad because it ruined Phoenix and Emma as characters, had a shit plot, the thing with keeping Lamiroir's identity secret was retarded, and worst of all, they never bothered resolving the issue of Phoenix tricking Apollo into using the forged Ace. Still disgusts me to this day.

>6-2 worse than 6-4

Yes

3 > AAI2 > 1 > AAI > 2 > 6 > 5 > 4

Blackquill carries it that far. 2 suffers from poor pacing with the case being rushed to conclusion in a single trial. The villain's motive is nonsense since Trucy frankly should've been the one he wanted to be killed

Nice. I respect putting JFA over SoJ/DD.

For me it goes like this:
T&T > JFA > AA > AJ > AAI2 > AAI > SoJ > DD

>it ruined Phoenix and Emma as characters
Yeah god forbid characters ever develop in actually interesting ways.
>they never bothered resolving the issue of Phoenix tricking Apollo into using the forged Ace
I don't even know what this means. What was there to resolve?

Forged ace is no different than saying the spice bottle was poison

Man, I don't get the Apollo Justice hate. At its lowest it was still way more fun than JFA's first three cases. Call it bait if you want but Turnabout Serenade was actually a good case for what it was. If you paid attention, Apollo was getting just as fed up with the hoops he had to jump through and the inconsistencies as you were. It did a much better job of portraying a dark age of the law without the need to throw the word around every 5 lines.

I also respect Apollo a lot for not needing someone else to help him understand what being a good lawyer is about. He needs help with the actual defense part but he always had the rest down.

Dual Destinies was okay to me. If it were a food, it'd basically be Oatmeal. Nothing special, but it'll get you by. That said, I fucking loved Blackquill. I wish we got him for another game instead of this new prosecutor. He doesn't look all that great.

AAI2 > AA > SoJ > DD > T&T > JFA > AAI > AJ

JFA gets unfairly shit on because of Big Top. Which is possibly the dumbest case in the franchise, but frankly was still fun, sometimes even funny, and had a certain charisma and whimsy that many cases lack, which itself is pretty much exactly in the spirit of the series as a whole.

That was not interesting character development.

>hur she's pissy all the time now and eats a lot

Wowie.

>b-but it's because she didn't get to be a forensic scientist

Deepest lore, never before seen depths of development.

Such scattershot criticism.

Let me be rational:

Ace Attorney 4's weakest areas are:

1. A protagonist who gets overshadowed by a previous hero, whose role steals too much thunder from the new guy, robbing him of any meaningful presence on his own.

2. The lack of an antagonistic prosecutor, though something I personally appreciate, did deprive the game of a strong sense of drama in the courtroom.

3. The third case is hinged on a very bad premise that only serves to annoy and aggravate the longer you get dragged through having to disprove it without calling it out on how bad it is.

4. The ending of the game is underwhelming, reaching a tepid anti-climax that does not involve much interaction or gameplay.

What it did get right is a much more robust protagonist than Phoenix Wright (who comes off as shallow when compared to Apollo Justice's mysterious past), some EXCELLENT music (second best in the series, I thought), an absolute barnstormer of an opening case, a unique antagonist for the series, and some fun characters (Trucy, Klavier, and Vera Misham).

The alternative isn't nearly as better as you're trying to make it seem. Characters that don't struggle are boring.

Are you retarded?

The problem with the forged ace isn't that it was convoluted or contrived.

The problem is that using forged evidence for any reason flies in the face of the ethics of the series as since in every single game before and since.

>Phoenix gets tricked into using forced evidence
>loses badge for it, bum for years
>"I think I'll do the same thing to this new kid, but it's alright, because I'm the good guy!"
>they win a case using dirty methods
>the very next fucking core game revolves around denouncing such methods

Do you not understand this? Phoenix would never have done that.

The way I took it to mean is that Phoenix was demonstrating that you could get away with it.

He doesn't like it and thinks the system is broken but in order to make his point, he needs to make an example of it and what better way than to also take down the person who abused that system to sabotage his career?

I think a Phoenix with nothing to lose would have, especially if the only conclusive evidence is the lack of conclusive evidence, which is exactly what the ace was forged to point out.

Phoenix knew that the justice system was fucked, and he knew he could use that fact to his advantage in this case.

It isn't as bad as people make it out to be. Main issue is that it's probably the easiest. Otherwise it cannot possibly be worse than AJ.

>What it did get right is a much more robust protagonist than Phoenix Wright (who comes off as shallow when compared to Apollo Justice's mysterious past)
Nigga wut? Only reason for this is because the series has increasingly focused on Apollo. As a character he's basically a Phoenix without any of the quirks that gets annoyed at everything.

By risking another person's career?

They could have been caught and Apollo could have ended up the same way.

DD establishes that Phoenix DOESN'T believe people can get away with operating outside the law. That's what DD beats you over the head with the entire game.

I think Apollo Justice's biggest downfall is that it left itself open for a sequel and then Capcom ignored all the sequel hooks to deliver...whatever you'd call Dual Destinies. I think there was going to be a lot more to Kristoph that needed exploring.

In fact, the only thing I genuinely hate about DD was that it ruined one intriguing aspect of him. Those black psyche-locks seemed evil from the way Phoenix described them, yet when pure, innocent Athena had some, they just became repressed memories.

They left far more open with Apollo's story than they ever tried to do with Phoenix Wright.

All you got with Phoenix is stuff that was expressly explained to you (he once dated a really nasty girl and he used to be an art major).

When we were introduced to Apollo he was the same vanilla protag as Phoenix but by the end of the game, you wanted to know more about who he was. I thought they were building to something really cool (then DD came along and basically threw everything onto a tangent with Athena taking the spotlight and Apollo's past getting about as much elaboration as Phoenix's with his mysterious best friend who is inconsequential to what they seemed to be building towards in 4; SoJ sounds like it's better about this, though, even if it's still not touching on the key points that made AA4's sequel hook work).

why?

it's the best one

I played this for the first time recently and didn't enjoy it as much i remember playing the DS entrees years ago. Is it consensus disliked or have my tastes in games just changed? How do people like the one that just came out in comparison?

The game is excessively easy and Athena can be a bit much to swallow.

DD is probably the most divisive. Everyone agrees it was too easy. Almost everyone agrees the sequel was better.

I like Athena. She brings a good sense of comedy relief to the series.

DD did confirm to me that we definitely need to tone down Phoenix Wright's involvement in the story going forward.

They have the tools to build a really solid new generation but 6 still tried to anchor itself to Wright, which is disappointing.

I really hope she gets to be the main attorney in AA7. Her starring role in DD was as assistant and defendant.

Oh, I totally forgot about Clay. I hate that Clay, despite supposedly being a key part of Apollo's backstory, was never once mentioned in his original game. I get that AA4 itself can't really do anything about that but it really annoys me.

You wanted to know more about who he was. Not me. His only real difference from Phoenix was that he yelled a lot. Having personality isn't the same as having backstory. Apollo has way more backstory than Phoenix, but he lacks in personality by comparison. He's not bad as a character but he feels very out of place and a bit bland. Compare to Phoenix who is also more normal than most but still feels like he belongs.

Phoenix needs to be used about as much as Edgeworth imo. One big case, maybe even the dlc case, and let the new kids handle the rest. Why the fuck does Phoenix, the experienced attorney, have to go up against Payne in the tutorial case every game?

the forged ace thing totally makes sense for phoenix's character in AJ, the problem is that the writer's didn't stick to their guns and reverted phoenix back into the same dude in the next game. in retrospect, it reads as nonsense

I mean, I get that it's strange, but think about what the rookie attorney's career was weighed against in that case. By taking the gamble of giving Apollo forged evidence to present, he was able to get a crooked attorney--and a damn fucking good one at that--put behind bars and got the wheels turning for the justice system to take a good hard look at itself. Small price to pay if things didn't work out if you ask me.

But even then, it was pretty much a sure thing that it would work out. The only way that the forged evidence could be revealed as such would be for Klavier to admit his guilt anyway. Phoenix did something he knew would work but despised for the good of the justice system's future because it was the only option he had.

>One big case, maybe even the dlc case, and let the new kids handle the rest.

I no rite

The vision I had for AA6 was taking the character swapping even further by having a different attorney-assistant pairing in each case while still building a story thread that lead to a conclusion.

The order I had in mind was:

Athena-Apollo
Apollo-Athena
Athena-Phoenix (in this case you play as Phoenix during the investigation but Athena during the trial)
Apollo-Trucy (AA4 throwback)
Athena-Trucy

And then in the DLC case you'd play as Phoenix full-time and maybe have Trucy or even Maya as an assistant.

And by Klavier I of course mean Kristoph.

were there locks on kristoph that haven't been opened yet?

As far as I remember it, his black psyche-locks were never unlocked.

The thing about the forged evidence is the only person who could prove it is someone who'd hang themselves if they did.

I think that's what gave Phoenix the justification for his actions: he was using forged evidence to convict someone who was absolutely guilty and did it in such a way that their only way out is to prove they were guilty all along.

Yeah, you see black locks on Kristoph at one point but you never unlock them.

>I also respect Apollo a lot for not needing someone else to help him understand what being a good lawyer is about

Except he literally says the opposite when Kristoph breaks down at the end of the game.

I agree, but there'd still be an issue with it. Athena is still technically a rookie since she's only taking two cases, so she'll still need Nick as her mentor, and one of the main complaints about him in the series is that the recent games focus on him too much. I wonder how he'll take a back seat without Athena's game feeling too much like Apollo Justice.

The theory is that the black locks are forcibly broken when the verdict is read.

All of Kristoph's planning and all of his meticulous organization was torn asunder by the jury deciding the case, not his manipulation of the system, and it broke him psychologically.

I don't know why people complain about the recent games focusing on Nick when 1-3 were mostly him. Just because you're playing him more often doesn't mean he's the focus. 5 was focused more on Athena and Apollo, while 5 was all about Apollo. If anything it would help to have a game that truly focuses on Nick and expands more on his backstory. We know less about him than the others.

Phoenix knew the card existed, but that Kristoph destroyed it. So he recreated it.
I think it's different than trumped up charges based on made-up evidence.

>The villain's motive is nonsense since Trucy frankly should've been the one he wanted to be killed
I'd argue that his goal wasn't necessarily to eliminate the Gramarye name, but rather to see it get dragged through the mud. In that case, his motivation makes perfect sense.

Ah whoops.
Meant for

That's exactly what he wanted. What idiot told you he wanted to kill Trucy?

I think it's because there's not much character development for him left while there's plenty to work with for both Apollo and Athena. It was fine in the first trilogy, but it gets a little boring if you don't see a character growing much from one installment to the next.

Tbh the lawyer name part of the titles (aka the Phoenix Wright part) should be dropped for AA7

But then Capcom can't get away with their paper-thin justification for not localizing spinoff games.

COMPLEX MOTIVES

The user I was responding to seemed to be under that impression.
I was pretty sure that my interpretation of his motivation was right but even though I just played the case like a week ago I have a shit memory and wasn't 100% sure.

Because it plays like shit, basically playing as well as every other game's worst aspects. New characters mostly suck, old characters aren't even themselves either. for the record I'm fine with change but you have to really justify it and I don't think 4 did a good job with phoenix. With Ema they did explain it at the end, but she really a bitch the whole time so she really wasn't enjoyable to be around. Zak is so fucking stupid he almost ruins Kristoph's entire motive as a character. Klavier is the game's real sidekick, Trucy does nothing but say magic panties and the game has no real prosecutor. The end of the game actually ends with you losing if it weren't for the jury system too.

It's just really a mediocre experience which has a good hook (4-1) then just completely shits the bed by the end.

I honestly don't get people who wish the series focused more on Apollo and/or Athena rather than on Phoenix.

I've tried to find the two of them interesting and I just can't, especially Athena.

I don't really see the issue with focusing on one main protag indefinitely as long as the cases and supporting casts continue to be unique and interesting.

One thing I wish they'd change is the whole "One primary prosecutor per game" thing.

Let me go againsy Payne (Winston, fuck Gaspen), then Blackquill, then Franziska, then some new guy, then maybe an high profile Edgeworth case.

But they won't do that because they've become obsessed with having to link every case (other than the second one) in each game together.

You are correct. If he kills Trucy, she dies a hero and is fondly remembered. Make her a murderer then she gets the chair and the Gramarye name is ruined. His motives make perfect sense.

Tbh baka senpai

>Trucy does nothing but say magic panties

That's her character in 5. People were annoyed they took a GOOD character like Trucy from 4 and pared her down to such a shallow gimmick in the sequel.

We don't need Trucy to ruin the Gramarye name, it already is ruined.

because all they care about is the illusion of character development, AKA backstories that the writers pull out of their asses each game just to keep a character (Apollo) relevant.

There is even less to work with in Apollo since he's had at least two character arcs by now that involved his backstory. That said we know he's gonna probably get another one next game in his relationship with Trucy.

Also worth pointing out that having some more focus on Nick as a character doesn't mean he has to be playable for most of it.

Not in the eyes of the general public.

It's much better than AA4.

>Trucy does nothing but say magic panties
How to spot someone who needs to replay AJ.

She was like that in AJ AND DD. SoJ is the first game where she actually did something. It's more unforgivable in AJ though, where she's your "sidekick" for most of the game.

What AA7 needs is a rookie prosecutor. Someone who's trying their best to beat Nick in court and is fairly competent but still green. I'm tired of literally every rival prosecutor in the series being a veteran (Sebastian doesn't count. Justine babies him the entire time.)

Mr. Hat or whatever the fuck they called him was more of her gimmick by the end of AJ though.

No.

I understand the consensus against AJ and don't get mad whenever people bash it, but aside from 4-3, it hits all the right notes for me. It has such a cool atmosphere, especially the first and final case... really moody and sad.

It's not my favorite AA for sure, but I still love it.

The problem with that is the prosecutor is supposed to have the state on their side. They have access to police, forensic reports, autopsies, and other tools to prove their case. The defense can only use evidence they have and arguments against witnesses to prove their case, hence why bluffing is such a big part of the game.

It'd be hard to present a prosecutor who isn't that skilled without overlooking all those other things that they have to support their case. When it comes to being a prosecutor in Ace Attorney, they don't really have to be good at it, just prepared.

she never does anything when she's with you.

>But she helped phoenix cheat at poker when she was a babby

shame she never does anything useful or particularly endearing when she's with you. Before SoJ, her highlight as a character was being a cute loli.

Alternatively bring Justine and Sebastian back. I get that the Judge is a running joke but I'd like to see a new Judge (and I mean ACTUAL new judge). As for Sebastian, I dunno if I'd want him as the main prosecutor, as he'd probably be a veteran himself, but I'd definitely like to see him as some point.

Someone mentioned once about having a younger female relative of Payne, and I'd be ok with that as long as it wasn't just a rehash of Franziska.

>mr reus
>mister reus
>mysterious
IT'S THE MR. GENCY EXIT AGAIN

Not really though. The best prosecutors also need to be able to actually debate the defense instead of just pulling another witness out of their ass. It's why Edgeworth, Bkackquill and Nahyuta gave the protagonists so much trouble while Klavier and Franziska didn't.

>Canadia judge
>London judge
>Labyrinthia judge
>Khu'rain judge
>DGS judge
>not new judges

Fuck, I've been mispronouncing his name so I didn't get the pun.

I don't get the people who want Phoenix to fuck off, I still like him way more than Apollo. I want a game that focuses on just him and Athena, with multiple prosecutors and not just one new guy.

Klavier is a unique example because he's not trying to be hostile in court.

He knows when to fold. He knows when he was prosecuting the wrong suspect and will willingly stand down from his position in order to get the right verdict.

Again, I liked this. It's not antagonistic but it's different and refreshing. Did it contribute to Apollo's marginalization? Absolutely, but it was still welcome in some ways.

>Attorney turns things around
>things look good for a change, Rookie Prosecutor is panicking
>judge decides its time for a "not guilty" verdict
>suddenly, Rookie Prosecutor says its time to turn his thinking around, takes a deep breath, and looks calm for a second
>after a moment, he comes to a realization with an "AHA!"
>proceeds to lay out a revelation using the evidence that turns the entire case upside-down, and requires the judge to extend the trial for another day

I've wanted this for so long, so badly.

Younger Klavier in AA4 had something like that going for him.

i bet you call the Ace Attorney series the Phoenix Wright series

You should look to the reason Khura'in was introduced for evidence of that.

The developers' exact words were "we ran out of challenges to provide Phoenix in his homeland".

That sounds like a sugarcoated way of saying "we're out of ideas". It's definitely time to shake things up.

OH WE'RE PIRATES WE LOVE TO SAIL THE 7 SEAS

What AA7 needs is cases where your client's innocence is actually dubious. While I realize that "winning" in an AA game is inherently dependent on the fact that your client is (almost) always one of the only people who couldn't have possibly committed the crime, I can't remember the last case I played where there was even a shadow of a doubt.

I'd love to see a case or two that really shakes things up and makes it so that the people you're trying to defend are actually guilty like 2-4. With all the games essentially highlighting how awesome defense attorneys are and how shitty prosecutors are, I wouldn't mind the next game's theme being criminals taking advantage of the team of outlandishly competent fake-it-til-you-make-it attorneys at the Wright Anything Agency.

Outside of that, I'd also love to see some cases that weren't murders. 3-2 had that unique element going for it until the twist at the end of the first day and honestly it bummed me out a little.

First, that was mostly in regard to Trucy only ever talking about her magic panties. She does so when it's actually relevant, but it only became her definining schtick in DD. I found her to be a very amusing sidekick in AJ.

Second, Trucy is almost always one step ahead of Apollo. This is actually a complaint I see a lot.

Third, what would you have her "do"? This is like saying Maya doesn't "do anything" but talk about hamburgers when she's with you in the trilogy.

>not trusting in Justice
It should be theoretically impossible to finish this game unless your a wanker

Oh, well now I just feel dumb for not getting his pun. I thought it was a real name for one like Ema Skye

>Turnabout Serenade was actually a good case for what it was.

The bullshit was that it's established right near the start of the case that it couldn't have been a kid who fired a huge fucking revolver, yet they just roll with it despite how overwhelmingly fucking obvious it is who the actual killer is

I don't

I loved it. It had low points but it was perfectly fine.

Klavier is unique to the point it works against him. While sure, if AJ was a better game he would have been better received some what, he's still so crazy mary sue-y it's hard to really get on board about liking him. He's hopeless rich, has his own band, is young up and coming prosecutor and faced with a huge moral dilemma like prosecuting your best friend and brother and has no real hang ups about it. He's perfect to the point he has no character growth, when ever other prosecutor needed the defense to open their eyes and grow as a person.

>I'd love to see a case or two that really shakes things up and makes it so that the people you're trying to defend are actually guilty like 2-4

That was too heavy-handed ("LOL, MURDER BY PROXY ISN'T REALLY MURDER, RITE?").

I think a good way to do this is to make the defendant somehow responsible for the victim's death but have another character actually be the one who caused it (in other words there's no way the defendant's hands can be completely clean but at the same time it's letting someone else who needs to take responsibility get off scot free).

Perhaps have that revelation that the defendant isn't 100% innocent be the Thought Route of the case so it comes through as an epiphany. A way to make the case make sense, even though it undermines the defense's ability to get their client off the hook.

The worst thing about that is they have actually laid a lot of groundwork for him to get some serious character development, since he doesn't seem to know the people he associates with very well. That could change a man but they never expanded on that.

>Reus
>Ruse
>Mr. Ruse

ALL ABOARD MR. RUSE'S WILD RIDE

Do you guys think Phoenix ever does normal lawyer things?

Yeah his premise is just too hard to swallow, AND they failed to really give him any growth despite huge chances to.

I think I didn't like DD because it completely reversed Phoenix's Character Development

I am not too crazy about AJ but I thought that was well written and made a lot of sense.

Yeah, I realize that it would be hard to pull off while also making sense and maintaining a sense of accomplishment.

I just think it'd be thematically interesting, particularly given how much the protagonists like to accuse prosecutors of doing anything it takes to win, when they're essentially doing the same thing themselves. I think it'd be neat to have some introspection there and highlight the true nature of the protagonist's motivations: do they truly fight for the sake of justice, or because it's their job to defend their clients? The only case to really ask that question was 2-4, but I think it's something that's worth revisiting, particularly given the uncanny fact that only innocent people ever seem to find their way to Phoenix & co.

Having completed the DLC Case, I feel warranted in posting my tier list, now updated with my opinion on it and the DGS cases, and would like to use this opportunity to invite others to post their tier lists as well particularly since these threads are likely to enter hibernation again until the next AA announcement

Post em

are these in any order?

Within the individual tiers, they're organized by chronological release of the main series, followed by chronological release of spinoffs.

Give it to me straight /aa/

how much would I actually like this show?

>only innocent people ever seem to find their way to Phoenix & co.

Phoenix literally can't take guilty clients because the Magatama catches any liars. Engarde slipped past him because he "technically" didn't kill anyone.

I don't get this DD was bad meme. Someone explain it to me.

Watch Detective Conan if you want the "murder of the day" show.

Ha, that's actually a fair point. I suppose the same could be said for Apollo and Athena, since Apollo's bracelet tips him off to liars and Athena can hear discord in their hearts. Gimmicks for days, man.

What's the point of killing someone. If that was enough then his job was pretty much done as pretty much all the Gramarye ar dead. Hell, he should worry about killing Valant in the first place if that was that.

The keyword here is humilliation. You can't humilliate and destroy the life of a dead person.

As someone who likes every game but AJ, DD had to soft retcon some things so narrative wise there were some logic holes the game doesn't really focus on. I do enjoy it, but more towards the end. first 3 cases were kinda weak but case 3 was pretty corny bad.

DD suffers of the same Justice for All did. It's just a bridge between the first game and the last game of the trilogy. Therefore is completely irrelevant aside from the introduction of a few characters and maybe a good case.

Case 3 was my favorite case excluding dlc. The students were all entertaining and had their own secrets that made the case interesting.

I guess it doesn't really count by Godot's trials against Phoenix were his first and only trials as a prosecutor.

They gutted the charm out of investigating in the interest of streamlining, made the game practically play itself, the last case was needlessly split into two chapters (this would be like splitting 1-4 into two cases), and they totally phoned in the final villain.
These are my opinions, but they are reasons why it rubbed me the wrong way.

Well that was just my subjective opinion, but case 3 is definitely my biggest argument against DD since the finale has a power of friendship speech to topple the bad guy.

I've just noticed, Phoenix hand from the logo is supporting Athena's tits

>DD had to soft retcon some things
like?

Phoenix, Jury trial, Apollo needed a backstory since he stopped being the lead character so secret best friend he never talked to before now.

>Apollo needed a backstory since he stopped being the lead character so secret best friend he never talked to before now.
so kinda like with Phoenix in T&T?

The only thing that T&T really added to Phoenix's backstory was that he had a girlfriend for a week.

I don't think Apollo ever stopped being the lead character. I mean his name isn't on the title anymore but that's just for marketing purposses. Both DD and SoJ were all about him.

Similar vein but Dahlia was like a college-hood sweetheart for a couple months not a major part of his life. Best friend since middle school is kinda of a bigger impact on his life comparatively.

SoJ was all about him. DD he wasn't the focus. DD just gave him part of a backstory.

and that he met Mia Fey through that girlfriend

>all about him
definitely not DD

SoJ only gave him relevance to the story in Case 5

>AA7 takes place in Nick's childhood and the trials are class trials like the one we saw in the flashback

How was DD about Apollo more than Athena?
Just because a victim from a case was a childhood friend of his and there was like five minutes during which he wasn't absolutely convinced of Athena's innocence during the final case didn't really make him the main character if you ask me.

>SoJ only gave him relevance to the story in Case 5

Nope we knew he was important to the story as early as case 2 when he pulls Nahyuta aside to try to talk to him.

Isn't the whole point of that case that the justice system as it stood was very easily exploited by corrupt officials within it?

That'd actually be pretty dope.

I fully support it if only so we can finally see Phoenix's folks.

>hey son, ya winning justice?

>SoJ only gave him relevance to the story in Case 5
Not even close to be true. Case 2 already established him as the more important of the game. Even in Case 3 there's the big revelation that completely takes away the focus of Phoenix.

Okay okay, DD wasn't all about him but he totally shared the main focus with Athena. One thing's for sure though, Phoenix definitely wasn't the lead character of that game.

His dad should have a spiked beard

He got part of the focus. Athena got the main focus but Phoenix was ultimately the one who ends "the dark age of law". All 3 were involved.

I don't even think I'd say that. Between the three protagonists, Apollo was the least important to DD overall.

>yfw filthy, dumb, Gramarye scum

t. Mr. Reus

having not played Spirit Justice, it's easily the best AA game. Troll harder.

see this

wat do?

Give the cute frog a tiny kiss.

Blackquill alone makes me enjoy this game

>Apollo and Athena talk about how Phoenix sometimes stares at Charley for hours and smiles
Fuck

>Phoenix actually name drops Mia in the DLC case

I'm just glad that for once, a cute girl wasn't a criminal.

As far as edgelords go, Blackquill's pretty great.

>Geiru
>not cute

>wasn't a criminal

Why does Phoenix not mention Mia by name once around Maya before the dlc case?

OUTTA MY WAY GRAMARYE FUCKING SHITS

They are only necessarily a criminal when they have huge (or apparently huge at least) tits.

>huge tits
>everything about Geiru
>the parts in Case 5 where they zoomed in on Ga'ran's and Amara's tits

>mfw I figured Amara was innocent only because Ga'ran had bigger tits.

Why does capcom hate tittymonsters? They're all either dead or criminals.

Is he one of the best villains in the series?

KILLING MAGICIAN PARTNER PRANK (GONE WRONG) 2016

>(HOT TWINS)
>(COPS CALLED)

AA2 did

CUTE MAGICIAN GIRL BRUTALLY MURDERS MAN

STILL CONSIDERED 'CUTE'

THE GRAMARYES DID NOTHING WRONG!

implying trucy wasn't the most competent partner

Her whole design just screamed Disney villain. I didn't even need a chest for her entire presence to scream "I'm the culprit!"

Well it was kind of obvious that Ga'ran was the villain even before her evil outfit, but yeah titty monsters do not get treated well in AA. Only one who wasn't a criminal or dead is Courtney, and she was still antagonistic for part of the game.

t. Trucy

I liked 3-2's little trick that let the client get away with theft because 'you already declared me innocent of that crime'

Ron best boy

Why was 6-DLC so awful in comparison to 5-DLC?

AA is full of ups and downs, and is nowhere near as perfect as people think it is. That includes the original trilogy too.

What about Desiree?

I was expecting Blackquill to be some complete edgelord that would shit up the whole game. Never did I expect him to be the best new character in the game. Life is full of surprises.

AJ wasn't well received. That's part of the reason he was a buttmonkey in DD. And Klavier just gets dragged along to appeal to fujos.

Does anyone know why he got popular in DD? Cuz I don't get it.

Are you completely forgetting his presence in the 5th case

Punished Justice

Psylockes were pointless in this game. No penalty for failing, and they're solved as soon as they appear. I miss having to do research to solve them

>Phoenix still using his magatama to decide who he should defend after that whole situation in 2-4

It really downplays the whole "I'll believe in my client until the very end" thing when you happen to have a magic lie detector in your pocket.

It does the opposite in my opinion, since no matter what comes up in the case he knows his client is innocent.

exactly

there's no longer the element of "trust" he so loves to preach, he just knows his client is innocent, and so the evidence will point to it

It's not infailable though, as 2-4 showed. As long as you answer in a way where you're not lying

But he does trust them. And as 2-4 showed, Magatama does not cover everything. It can only catch lies, not reveal the entire truth. Matt hired someone to kill him, but he didn't do it yourself. All he ever asks his clients is "did you do this?" He never grills them. If there was no trust involved he would grill them to make absolutely sure they're innocent.

>since no matter what comes up in the case he knows his client is innocent
This isn't always true. Like I said, after the whole 2-4 incident, the magatama can't always be trusted. Before he had it he would talk to the accused to get a good grasp of their character, have them tell him about the incident, then decide whether he takes the case or not. Just look at accused people like Will Powers and the whole Lana and Ema scenario

nailed it

Y'know honestly, Why did Phoenix even hire Apollo in the first place? Couldn't he represent himself?

>Couldn't he represent himself?
user...

Retard.

You know you don't have to be a lawyer to represent yourself, correct?

At this point is a known forger of evidence. Any evidence he produced would be, rightfully, distrusted to possibly discredited.

Kristoph would have most likely walked free.

>Someone who got disbarred because of evidence forgery is representing himself for a murder trial
Come on user, even you have to admit that sounds crazy

Thanks for giving me actual answers.

>Believing a man who forged evidence
Just let it go and move on.

You really could've came to that conclusion on you own

t.Spoonfeeded braindamaged monkey.

Godot is a really weak prosecutor. The game is building him up like he's the most dangerous foe Phoenix ever faced but he rarely challenges Phoenix the way Edgeworth and Von Karma did. HE just says "YOU HAVE NO EVIDENCE"

hasn't lost a case in 6 years, the most terrifying of prosecutors

He's also a piece of shit

Because he knows he's just making shit up. He only needs to tell him to prove it because that's the most difficult part.

So did Edgeworth and Von Karma. But they always baited Phoenix into traps that strengthened their points, while easily tearing down Phoenix's bluffs

Godot doesn't do that, he just says awful analogies and asks for evidence.

>they never bothered resolving the issue of Phoenix tricking Apollo into using the forged Ace.
That was entirely on Dual Destinies, and one of the biggest reasons why that games felt like fanfiction.

AJ was the fanfiction game user.

>the game with actual character development and evolution of the series is fanfiction
>the game that just blindly ignores everything that just happened and crams in characters for fanservice dutifully flanderized isn't
Sweet rebuttal bro.

>The game capcom wants to forget it ever existed in the first place besides including Apollo
>Not fanfiction
Sweet delusions, burgernigger.

>Character development
>Phoenix loses his badge because of an idiotic reason and becomes a completely different person with no hint of the old character except in the trial he lost his badge, a flashback that is the only single instance of character development at all.
>Apollo is just phoenix wright lite
>Trucy and Klavier have no major hang ups or growths as character
>Ema comes back as an unlikable bitch until the last chapter where you find out why she's such a bitch, which arguably makes her even less likable but yes this is the singular instance of character growth in AJ
>Ignores Apollo's growth through an entire case in DD because it's convenient
>Ignores DD entire arc with Blackquill, and to a lesser extent Athena

I'm not surprised you like AJ more given how much bullshit you're spewing.

If he kills the gramarye line they're remembered fondly

If he besmirched the name they're dead to history

>a completely different person with no hint of the old character
If you don't see "any hint of the old character" then you're some thick ass motherfucker, but that's to be expected if you really liked DD's beat-you-over-the-head-with-a-hammer levels of simplicity.
Also usually the product of character development is that a character CHANGES. Another thing you may not expect if your ideal of writing is DD's "go straight back to the status quo".
>Apollo is just phoenix wright lite
He's not any different in DD, so I don't see how this furthers your argument.
>Trucy and Klavier have no major hang ups or growths as character
Never said either of them was a particularly good character, so congratulations for winning your argument against yourself I guess?

>Ignores Apollo's growth through an entire case in DD because it's convenient
DD ignores how Apollo was supposed to be coming off of AJ to begin with, and his entire "arc" in DD is pure fluff.
>Ignores DD entire arc with Blackquill, and to a lesser extent Athena
Athena doesn't change an inch. In fact she's still her identical usual self in fucking 6-4.
Blackquill doesn't change either. He's just surly and angry for no discernible reason, then you figure out that he was "good" all along and now he's still surly and angry for no discernible reason, except he's more helpful towards you.
You don't know what "arc" even means. It's not just a character being sad at some point and then finding happiness again.

Turnabout Time Traveler was so fucking bad. I was expecting a mid tier case at worst and Turnabout Reclaimed tier at best, but it was still horrible most of the time besides the new characters and witnesses.

Well, I guess is official that DD was a better game than SoJ.

>turnabout bigtop
literally made me drop the game

>ad honinem like a child because has no argument
>provides zero arguments beyond "no ur wrong"

As you might say, AJfag, "Sweet rebuttal bro." Your favorite game is shit, and DD is trash because it had to clean up after it.

>Coming from the man who only knows three types of flowers by name
GOD DAMN EDGEWORTH. Who was the 3rd flower, besides Iris and Dahlia?

Florent L'Belle

>falling for obvious red herring design

I just started SoJ's DLC case but besides that, that's some good taste right there. Glad to see DGS-2 on the bottom.

Well, there was also the fact that he was introduced as a convicted murderer and all.
I personally found it hilarious how the prosecutor who looked the most like a complete edgelord ended up being the one with the biggest sense of humour.

>Well, there was also the fact that he was introduced as a convicted murderer and all
>falling for obvious red herring background
It's like you never played a AA game before.

Aren't you such a clever anti-ruseman, user.
Of course I knew that he wasn't really going to be like that, I just didn't expect him to turn out being exactly the way he did, and probably it was the same for the user you first replied to.

>less good

I don't think he even knows those are flowers, since he himself said he only knows sunflowers and roses.
Not sure if it was those two flowers or something else, but still.

It's "not as good", faggot

Honestly, DD being devoid of Spirit shit and having a much more interesting overall plot (Dark age of the law) makes it way better than SoJ for me.

What is the best case in AAI?
I'm on the kidnapping case right now? Is there a case i should be looking forward too?

the answer is yes

I still laugh everytime someone puts Turnabout for Tomorrow that high on their lists

Is there a single AA where the last case isn't the best case?

Professor Layton vs. Phoenix Wright

If Capcom weren't such cheap jews they could make a decent AA that let you play as every character, even Edgeworth.

Apollo Justice

Dark Age of the Law was dogshit.

That would just be way too bloated

Anyone have the download link for the soundtrack?

The DC act was just forced drama dogshit. At least the Dark Age makes sense.

Well it wouldn't be would it, getting your moneys worth is hardly a bad thing.

>DC Act was just forced drama
>Dark Age of the Law made sense

Holy fuck what

AA1 is all Phoenix and I felt like I got my money's worth. How do more perspectives=more value?

The Dark Age of the law was in both AJ and DD and serves as a natural evolution of Nick's character. The DC act is just some retarded law instituted by the queen for no real reason.

>DD
>natural evolution of Nick's character

You are beyond retarded.

The Dark Age was the most forced thing in the series, thejudical system was fucked since the first game, and it took them over 7 games (main series + AAI) to realise that it's fucked? At least the DC Act made sense in the context of Khura'in.

>Dark Age makes sense
>Somehow the whole thing was fixed after one case that really shouldn't affected anything in any way

DS version of the first game. 1-4 is better. Though 1-5 is great too.

I'd like AJ and it more if they would just give them the GBA look of the first 3 games.
The improvements like the 2nd screen for your evidence is nice, that can stay, but I mean the games were already great looking and I don't like how they are now. I especially don't like AAI's look

1-5 is more like dlc. I would count 1-4 as the technical last case.

I think most people agree that one of the things AJ did right was the sprites.
The games lost much of their charm when they went 3d, even though the models allow them to do some pretty neat stuff.

It took Spirit of Justice to make me realize Dual Destinies was mostly carried by Blackquill.
What a shitposter of a Prosecutor.

Please respond

Here
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