Baldur's Gate 2

>he thinks this is the hard part of BG2
>not the dungeon where every enemy level drains the whole party
loving every laugh

>that massive shitposting bait greentext
you deserve a rock on your head

>the game doesn't let me click and win
>waa waa goo goo wah

>Enhanced Edition of 2 is fucked
explain
I almost got it a few mins ago

IWD EE is the only good one.

Most of what you just said isn't that common. Outside of spellcasters and a few enemies in the underdark most enemies don't bother with heavy CC.

You sure you're not just doing that shit to yourself since you know... The game has friendly fire turned on by default.

I remember reading that they added some new content that clashes really hard with the rest of the game. It's probably ignoreable but I'd rather not deal with it given the chance.

It can't be modded and most of the content beamdog added was pretty shit. If you turn off hp bars/outlines off it's fine, though.

oh I thought it was some gamebreaking things lilke some major bugs

I ignored that shit in bg1, damn they need to be hanged

These reasons are why the Berserker fighter subclass is the best in the game.

It comes immune to all those problems.

It's way op and you solo the game a zerker.

You're supposed to use protection spells/potions before your character are disabled

>I thought it was some gamebreaking
Nope just easily ignorable optional content, mostly in chapter 2 if I remember correctly. The poorly written new characters are the worst offense, but if you don't like them you'll probably won't pick them up even by accident anyways. Cred Forums likes to overreact.

What are those broken classes? Also are there broken classes in bg1?

then I'm fine
I ignored that in bg1

thanks user

Barbarian, Berserker, Inquisitor, Sorcerer, wild mage and some dual/multi class

>mfw the chaotic evil berserker NPC turns out to be aggressively homosexual in the EE content

Should have known, thank you sjw gaming

It's funny how the 2 gay companions are evil

What? I've played EE and Korgan was not gay. They weren't allowed to change any of the original companions.

Dorn

>Luckily there are spells and potions against these effects - but I can't use them, since I lost control of everyone.
If you know all of this why wait to use protective measures? Just to complain on Cred Forums?

Do I have to play the first one get with Baldurs Gate 2?

No

git gud

BG2 is piss easy to break, you can beat the game solo if you wanted

You barely talk to me anymore user, what's in that head of yours lately?

In bg1?
No, cleric/fighter against mages maybe.
Op may bitch but vanilla bg1 is worse by a long shot.

He's not chaotic evil or a berserker, you fucking retard.

At least it isnt "sleep every encounter" of baldurs gate 1.

Anything that can equip a longbow will destroy bg1

no, they tell you more or less the story, but it would be helpful to read on a wiki the plot of bg1 at least or ask here

Well if you don't mind, would you resume it? I don't care if it's three words
Also, does it matter if my pc (actually laptop) doesn't work for shit?

you're one of the sons of the god baal, and some old man named gorion (a wizard) raised you in a fortified library.
Then from sudden you are told to leave your ass from that place and nothing else.
turns out one of your brothers (sarevok) who you didn't even know you had wants to kill you and be the only one left son of baal to gain his god superpowers.
He tries to get sword coast dry of iron to control it through a merchant company, then he tries to get promoted to duke of baldurs gate.
you fight him in an underground baal temple.
I don't know how the fuck you get caught in the bg2 starter prison because in EE at least there is no ending or what the fuck

MEME GAME HOLY FUCK THIS GAME IS SHIT HOLY SHIT LOLOLOL

The PC is raised by a wizard named Gorion. Gorion is killed by a mysterious warrior named Sarevok. He is the PC is half-brother and both are children of the dead god of murder, Bhaal. Sarevok seeks to become the Grand Duke of Baldur's Gate and to launch a bloody war that will ascend him as the next god of murder, but is stopped by the PC.

So after you fight with him what happens? I mean you say there's no ending but do you win or

I think the dude that captures you ambushed you while you were adventuring or something after you killed severok.

Ah, ight
So in the second one, you still play as the same character?

Oh yes, you kill him and the second game has a new antagonist. You learn more about Sarevok in BG2.

>EVERY fight in the game is re-loading again and again and again in hopes of it not happening this time.
There are people out there who have completed no-reload runs of the full game.

You're not being careful.

Thanks a lot for sharing the resume with me, I'm kind of hyped to play it now, I'm downloading it

Yeah, he captures you Minsc, Jaheira, Kaleid and Dynaheir while you're out adventuring.

Yep. The game was made to import your BG1 character and continue their story. BG1 is a low level D&D campaign, BG2 is a higher level campaign.

I thought there was some dialogue after the sarevok fight and irenicus was mentioned at the ending or something
damn I was so buttmangled when the fucking ending came

>what about 1:EE
fanfic characters who manage to be more cringe-inducing than many of the custom npc mods for the original.

Other than that it's fine I guess.

They explain it in dragonspear

>you still play as the same character?
The second one continues on with the assumption that you had a full party containing yourself, Imoen, Khalid, Jaheira, Minsc, and Dyanaheir.

dragonspear is placed between bg1 and bg2 right?
is it worth?
will it make me want to smash the computer?

BG is save scumming: The game

Get lucky or reload.

Baldur's Gate Trilogy shows that it was Mae'Var who captures you on the orders of Irenicus. Then, Irenicus reneged on whatever deal he had with the Shadow Thieves which is part of the reason why they're assaulting his hideout at the beginning of BG2.

Not necessarily canon since it was part of a mod, but interesting as it ties in the whole relationship between Irenicus and the STs, and a little more reason to want to take out Mae'Var later on. He's a bit of a bitch to kill with the Tactics mod installed.

Just don't bother. It's not one of those "so bad it's good" experiences. It's just an extremely underwhelming extra few zones chock full of immersion-breaking writing.

I still don't understand how people defend BG's combat
there are 1 man indie projects with better rpg combat
D&D just doesn't work properly outside of a tabletop setting

>there are 1 man indie projects with better rpg combat

Like what?

Underrail is a recent example

>is it worth?
Didn't get very far, it was pretty boring and i didn't give a fuck about the story or antagonist, also the writing is very modern Bioware like.
The combat is fine, they improved the AI: archer run away from you, rogue backstab you weakest characters and use hips/invisibility potions, archer target low armored characters, cleric use sanctuary, etc. The problem imo is the number of trash mobs, it make it pretty tedious.

>I still don't understand how people defend BG's combat
Once you've been able to use things like Improved Alacrity, Chain Contingency, and Project Image, then you'll begin to understand.

It' not particularly deep (especially on the fighter side), but its magic system is deliciously exploitable.

>it become good after 100 hours

Why is it better

>D&D
Is this the worst cancer plaguing the RPG genre?

sure the game can be broken open
but its EASY to do so and requires virtually no effort
not to mention there are no enemies ingame that require this level of abuse

and it only gets pseudo-interesting if 2 conditions are met
1 you are playing a caster class
2 you are high level

if these are not met BG is boring which included all of BG1 and most of BG2

the sheer fact that more than half the classes in the game are simply neither fun nor effective to play is bad game design and so is the fact that the classes which are interesting make the game so easy it could be played blindfolded

yes actually

And? Go back to play Skyrim then.

>you are playing a caster class
An arcane caster class
>the sheer fact that more than half the classes in the game are simply neither fun nor effective to play
Most class are fine until ToB

the ui was fucked in all games

Playing as a Thief is great fun within 2-3 hours if you're smart about it - they level up ultra fast and have the perfect excuse to use all of their skills in the first dungeon (nashkel mines). Chunking kobolds with well timed backstabs is its own reward.

great variety in builds that remain effective but don't invalidate challenge
combat has a lot of options in approach, execution and if necessary withdrawal
movement is an integral part of the thought process and not something you do between fights
no loss of player agency: win or loss it is your own accomplishment or fault

On my first playthrough level drain was the stuff of my nightmares. Also the Ilithid and Beholder fun parks. I actually had to take a break from the game at that point, for 6 months.

>not open world
>not cinematic experience
>not dumbing down

RPGs have 99 problems but DnD aint one

>My brain is so slow that I need turns so the enemy cant move at all

problem is, backstabbing isn't all that fun when its literally all you do
and then BG2 comes along and backstab stops working against half the enemies
sure you could cheese the game with traps but at that point you still haven't alleviated the boredom problem given
Set trap
Kill Enemy
is neither fun nor challenging

How is it different from BG?

>On my first playthrough level drain was the stuff of my nightmares.
That's why I always recommend people play SoA with Undead Hunter their first time ;)

its turn based with action points as resource
similar to say the older fallout games but vastly more refined

No, I mean how does BG not have those features?

>the sheer fact that more than half the classes in the game are simply neither fun nor effective to play is bad game design and so is the fact that the classes which are interesting make the game so easy it could be played blindfolded
Welcome to D&D!

If you want the best of all worlds, just roll a F/M/T or something.

That or a blade. There's one user who always insists that Blades are the best and most fun.

I've played plenty of good action-rpg's that require swift decision making and plenty of good turn based rpg's that require precise action management
BG requires neither given you can pause the game at any time and you only get 1 action per "turn" or else you've found out to get more than 1 and you already won because its the mother of all cheese in anything D&D related

D&D is a terribly simplistic and outdated combat system regardless of edition that only works in a tabletop setting due to the fact such a setting cannot support more complex combat and the fact there's a DM present who can overrule said combat system when it does something truly stupid

Not him but what i want is not the class i pick to become useless because they make everything immune to its main feature

>due to the fact such a setting cannot support more complex combat
No, due to the fact that in tabletop simplicity is greatly valued ofer time-consuming complex mechanics that interrupt the flow of the session. Even D&D was subject to a lot of critique for being too rule-heavy.

>you either have all your spells charged and all encounters are negligible or you are a sitting duck
>must spend weeks urgently escaping from an small basement dungeon because you have to rest 8 hours after every fight
Thanks D&D!

early BG has zero player agency
you either win the attack roll with your bow and kill the enemy or said bow wielding enemy kills you
it has the strategic depth of chutes and latters at this point
combat has very little forms of approach, a good number of classes has only one execution( right click, watch numbers) and even those that have a lot of options tend to favor 1 or 2 foolproof strategies, withdrawal is never a true option in D&D games, you start to lose you may as well reload
and BG(2) has a MASSIVE discrepancy between effective and ineffective builds, tons of trap options and despite having quite a few classes and variations many of them end up feeling similar

>he needed to sleep in the Irencius dungeon

and the reason for that is all calculations need to be possible with pen, paper and a randomizer
however compared to the potential of the electronic medium this is laughably simplistic, a phone can simulate a 2 hour D&D session in less than a second and many good crpg's do take advantage of this

and until we invent true ai you cannot have a rules light videogame

>tons of trap options
Name 10

>early BG

So your entire criticism of the game is based on the earliest part of the game?

lack of player agency is an early game problem
build discrepancy a lategame one
add it up and you have a shitty game all throughout

technically every class that's not a mage is a trap option
it looks good but ends up worse than the mage at everything

that's quite a bit more than 10

>you either win the attack roll with your bow and kill the enemy or said bow wielding enemy kills you
Only ever true for L1 mages/sorcs in candlekeep. After that, it's down to strategy and every death is avoidable.

I don't see how build discrepancy makes the game shit

So one class is superior = all other classes are useless? Are you serious?

A class that's worse than another but can still finish the game easily isn't a trap option

there's very little strategy and up to lv 3-4 crits can still kill you out of nowhere

I mean the entire aspect of positioning and movement is non existent within D&D rpg's, that by itself is friggin huge

>I don't see how build discrepancy makes the game shit
a game with build discrepancy at the level of BG is impossible to balance and if it can be finished by the worst builds then invariably it has no challenge for the best builds

and the discrepancy is not only in effectiveness but also in enjoyment
playing a fighter in any D&D game is a completely braindead zero interaction style of play

steam or gog version?

Min-maxing is a mistake.

D&D is about the characters you play, not the class.

>balance
Hi Josh

>a game with build discrepancy at the level of BG is impossible to balance and if it can be finished by the worst builds then invariably it has no challenge for the best builds

Well, guess what, it cannot be finished by the worst builds. Also, no builds are broken by themselves, what's broken is several spells and items.

>playing a fighter in any D&D game is a completely braindead zero interaction style of play

This is mostly true, but also irrelevant. D&D is a party game.

a certain level of balance is needed to prevent the game from being either impossible for half the players or else being to simplistic for half the players

I mean if you're casual enough you prefer a game with no challenge over one that actually requires some form of skill, more power to you I guess.

That only really aplies to the tabletop experience, and that's a laughable excuse because there isn't anthing about the D&D system that makes it specially about the characters compared to any other TRPG system.

>This is mostly true, but also irrelevant. D&D is a party game.
and D&D has a very clear protagonist
"he's your character, you'll get to play him only 5% of the time" is bad game design in every possible way

meant BG instead of D&D there, my mistake

>and D&D has a very clear protagonist
what?
what part of 'party game' is so hard to understand for you?

>rpg
>challenge
Kek

>a certain level of balance is needed to prevent the game from being either impossible for half the players or else being to simplistic for half the players
It's a single player game, you moron. Classes are essentially difficulty levels.

:^)

>and BG has a very clear protagonist

So? It's still a party game. Nobody is forcing you to play solo fighter.

difficulty ranging from braindead to braindead with the occasionally reload

>D&D is a party game
With the tabletop game you can have fun regardless of the system if your friends are good enough, but in a PC game all characters should be reasonable fun to play, but even taking the party as a whole the combat isn't that much fun.

>Classes are essentially difficulty levels
There's literally zero indication of that being the case in the game.

do you have a palladin or cleric int he group?
you need disspell magic. its the best spell in the game.
clerics have it.
also that one paladin kit is a dispell pally.

One of the most difficult games of all time is not braindead. Stop making a fool of yourself.

Also download SCS/Ascension or something.

a party game with zero party management, just a bunch of extra buttons to press

play it for the story, play it for the characters, play it because you're lonely and need a dating sim but gods sake play something else if you want a mechanically well designed experience

>JUST MOD IT
skyrim confirmed for best rpg ever

>a party game with zero party management,

What the fuck does that even mean?

let's be honest, AD&D is a shit system.

the BG series would be perfect if it was retooled to 3.5e.

On one hand, you're fucking retarded and probably would benefit from getting lobotomized. On the other hand, vanilla BG2 encounter design is dogshit, because of how piss easy the fights are, so you're not entirely wrong bashing the encounter design.

The only way to play BG2 is to install Tactics and Ascension, even the "half-measure" mods like SCS2 don't make it challenging enough for anyone with two brain cells to rub together.

roll cleric, win game the edition is not a good solution

a good solution would be to get rid of D&D and instead spend time developing your own combat system

What TRPG 'S do you reccomend? And which mechanically well designed?

a good thing about baldurs gate is you actually have to figure out what to do to win
regardless of what class or stats you picked for your main character there is always a solution at any point in the game
you can try to figure it out or you can whine about it like a little bitch

You can very easily play the game without interacting with any of the newly added content.

Darkest dungeon.
Witcher 3
Dude sex: manchild apart.

If the guy is too retarded to use basic protection i wouldn't recommend difficulty mod to him

>but in a PC game all characters should be reasonable fun to play

So now we went from "the game is shit because everything" to "game is shit because fighters are boring". Give me a break.

We're talking about RPGs here, not dungeon crawlers, action-adventure games and shooters with stats.

>3.5
Oh boy, gotta love fighters being even more useless with their nonsensical 20/15/10/5 shit.

are you actually serious?
have you played any decent rpg at any point in your life?

BG(1and2) have among the worst encounter design in the entire genre, virtually all encounters can be beat by cookie cutter strategies, you barely if ever have to actually think about your approach

>entire party wipes in BG1 in a gnoll encounter
>Imagine the girls in the party are raped by the beasts and turned into submissive breeding slaves
>get a raging boner and stop playing

Baldurs Gate is a powerful game. It plays you as you play it.

Oh yeah, I know the guy who made Witcher, he's pretty cool and everything

There's basically a lot of bullshit. For example the nabassu on ulgoth (fucking EE) which has the death gaze makes that part roll a chance for a hold spell or get fucked and just quick load. AD&D is a bad system, because hold and crowd control spells are basically bullshit. Good thing they limited or mitigated this horseshit in 3E and up.

Dunno which edition of NWN2 you were playing, but fighters absolutely destroy any spell casters at epic levels, which is the level range of ToB.

I have no clue how things work in PnP, but high level casters are an absolute joke in NWN2.

MUH SAWYER HOW DARE YOU EVEN TRY TO BALANCE ANYTHING THE DRUID'S ANIMAL COMPANION BEING BETTER THAN MY FIGHTER IS A FEATURE

if you know the correct thing to do it's easy, if you don't you have to figure it out, that's usually how single player strategy games work

>because hold and crowd control spells are basically bullshit
They're not bullshit, you just have to possess half a brain and bring along a fucking cleric, like any sane party would do, who can protect you from both paralyzation and instant death effects via freedom of motion and death ward.

only because Obsidian very carefully cut all the bullshit mages are capable of

at lv 7 and up in p&p 3.5 a fighter is literally incapable of ever posing a threat to a mage
at lv 9 the mage is better at being a fighter than the fighter
and it only gets worse from that point onwards

You are arguing with more than one person, so just to make it clear, the overal game isn't bad, but the D&D based combat system is lackluster and disappointing because of several reasons which includes the shitty class design.

dispel magic is your friend

It's not our fault you used Wisdom as a dump stat you faggot.

To be fair AD&D 2 was pretty fucking retarded with its stats. Anywhere from 8-14 is practicly the same in terms of gameplay. Anything above 20 is broken as fuck.

>the wisdom increase saving throws meme
It doesn't, look it up

wisdom and charisma are the best dump stats for fighters, if you dump int you get raped by mind flayers

>Every paladin is supposed to be within the top tier of charismatic people
>still meet assholes like this guy

...

Blame ADND's ruleset for that shit. Same with Jaheira obviously having a hard lean towards good acts but whining forever once you actually hit positive reputation.

This is the standard strategy I understand. I'm just saying on a principle, the D&D combat system especially in BG is really tedious if you lack the necessities. This is why the companion system in BG is just horseshit. Why not just give an option to create a party from the start like Icewind? D&D is mainly having different characters with skills to make up for each individual member's weakness EVEN at low levels.

>Why not just give an option to create a party from the start like Icewind? D&D is mainly having different characters with skills to make up for each individual member's weakness EVEN at low levels.

There is literally an option for this, it is just hidden under multiplayer. You can play mp games offline and control all the custom characters.

So Im at fault for never trying to set shitplayer in a dead game?

Fuck off you dumb cunty. Just cause you got forced to sit 100 hours till the game gets good doesnt mean people should.

I just went up against a guy with a micro dick bow and he spammed logs so fucking fast.

I have been spending hours reloading and spamming fireball at him. The fuck can I even do?

Also losing your gear on death, even more so the bullshit perma death.

Is there a way to kill the emphatic manifestation?

No, you're at fault for being a confrontational autist to someone just telling you there is actually a way to play the game the way you want to, though.

Suck a fuck retard.

>I just went up against a guy with a micro dick bow and he spammed logs so fucking fast.
Where?
You can pick up your gear from the ground if a character dies

Someone get this buttmad hothead casual outta here

>perma death
If you aren't willing to put even a minimum effort into learning the game you can just fuck off.

The iron throne place, and im mostly lvl 6.

And thats fair.. if you count out that the tanks die first and all the whimps cant carry their legendary +2 equipment for shit.

Still doesnt justify the exploding corpses and losing a valuable character, leaving you with dogshit leveled cunts.

>having an ego for being good at fucking video games
>and one that's random at that

Tell me how to raise characters who exploded, please.

You might as well put the game on story mode. BG2 has some really good stories and sections, but unless you're abusing magic there is a lot of tedious multitasking.

Or play the goldbox games, which I feel are surperior in almost every way

GoG is free so why anything else

also sauce

>The iron throne place
Top floor? That fight is a bit of a pain because of the shitty pathfinding, going back to the previous floor after they spot you makes it easier

You use every wand/scroll/potion you receive, right? One blast from a wand or scroll can make any fight easy.

>micro dick bow
>exploding characters

>not wanting to be good at video gaems
>boasting about it
>thinking bg2 is a random game

Why are you even on this board

>gog free
you mean pirating it?

artist is incase, couldn't find the full pic

Yeah, thing is motherfucker is tanking something like 100 health. That and his bow does like 13 damage and he hits every time, oh and he shoots 3 times a round.

Somethimes I do kill him, and it becomes a bit easier. Its just that by then everyone is dead.

Well doesnt help he has a buldozer and 5 mages to fuck my shit up.

Of course. Beamdog doesn't deserve your money if you opt for the EE, and neither does modern Bioware.