Do you prefer JRPG with open overworld exploration or do you prefer to access specific locations through a hub?

Dragon Quest IX's world is awful though.

>Implying empty overworlds are ever a good thing

Overworlds are fine, but rarely done well. It can be as pretty as you want it to be, but in the end it might as well just be a backdrop if there isn't really anything in it.

i like how dragon quest 7 does it

overworld>hub>shit>open world exploration

>empty
Well maybe if you're on the mountains but XCX is far from empty unless you mean non-hostile npcs

It feels like an MMO. There's just a bunch of monsters running around doing monster things. I understand that it's a new planet and humanity is still getting it's bearings, but they explicitly state that there is an organized effort to explore the world. In reality, it's YOU that's mapping out the entirety of the planet. The rest of the humans may as well just be in stasis with you, your buddies, and an AI central command doing everything.

>Implying the overworld I posted is empty
Literally every square inch of the map has something you need to do, be it finding treasure, fighting an optional boss, completing a sidequest or planting a mining probe, in order to complete the region's survey, and there's literally monsters everywhere for you to fight or run away from and items you can collect to complete sidequest or catalog in your collectopedia.

Where is this "openworld is shit" meme coming from?

Sounds like he meant zones with on field enemies.

casuals who are off their add medication

Mechanically I actually like Tales of Zestiria's world design on a technical level,
being able to travel through interconnected sparse maps is a pretty good solution in my opinion to trying to find the balance between the old school overworld maps and the open-world-centric designs of modern games.

That's not to say there aren't open world JRPGs with good maps (Xenoblade X is a very successful example as of recent according to many anons)

But I like the way Zestiria's map is set up because while it gives you the open world experience, it limits that to just a few large areas,
so rather than create a truly fully open world it implies that there's more out there you don't get to see, which I find incredibly amazing when this feeling can be conveyed well, but sadly this only came through mechanically.
I believe that the only reason the world felt empty and empty and lacking at times was more due to the artistic and creative choices taken by level and environment designers.
These are just my thoughts as someone who's been getting into JRPGs over the past year and a half, and I know Zestiria wasn't exactly the first to do this but it's the only game I can remember playing that has.
feel free to tell me about any games with interesting, fun, or even experimental open world designs, I'd like to build up my library.

Games like Skyrim or fallout that have this may allow for more travel/exploration and self inserting, but their stories and storytelling methods are usually weaker because of the freedom they give.
It allows for another type of gameplay emphasis,but other aspects can suffer because of it
It's to be expected though, games are a young medium and we're just barely seeing what we can do with them.

Lemme run around niggah. But it usually doesnt overly effect whether i like the game or not.

There hasn't been a good open world game since Morrowind.

People who only play hyped games like Elder Scrolls, Assassins Creed or Final Fantasy. And obviously the open worlds in those games suck.

Personally I prefer it to be more like your related picture than open world

>le empty overworld

When will this meme end? Games that are trying to build on a world shouldn't have fucking treasure chests and facebook clickbate articles littered in every fucking orifice of a game, user. Thats how you get uninspired maps like Skyrim vs Morrowind, which by your definition is more "empty" by comparison.

What game is this?

it's YOU that's mapping out the entirety of the planet.
That's an interesting point to bring up.

In most if not all games that are open world, it's harder to express that sense of a living world where other people are going about doing things too because if other NPCs get stuff done then what's there for the player to do?
It's a really hard situation to overcome without going back to linearity or at least semi-linearity.

I know the .hack games did something interesting with it since they were actually in an MMO setting and could play it off as such, but in single-player JRPGs, or RPGs in general it's always gonna feel like no matter what the world revolves around the player.

I mean occasionally you'll get an interesting game where you can witness random events going on in the world, but there's only so many of those that can be programmed into a game.
And you can't really stop that from happening unless it's an MMO like Star Wars Galaxies where the world was created and fueled by communities of players rather than a set questline.
This is why I've kinda thought that a TRUE open-world game would have to be purely run by players and could only be an online experience at least until the point where we can develop A.Is for every npc, but that's too far fetched for now

>Implying MGSV wasn't good
>Implying GTAV was bad
>Implying inFamous 2 wasn't great
>Implying the PS3 Ratchet & Clank games aren't great
>Implying you know what you're talking about at all because all you play is shitty Ubisoft games and Skyrim

japs can't into free roaming open world

That screenshot? That's Xenoblade chronicles x. Looks like noctilum

I would prefer one with alisha as the main girl

Xenoblade Chronicles X

>it's another "I don't understand what open world means" episode

Every single overworld in a single player game ends up feeling empty regardless of how much you put in it. That's entirely because it's ONLY you going out and exploring. You can go out and map out the world for 100% completion, but at the end of the day, it's pointless. The overworld might as well just be a few corridors leading to treasure because without the treasure being the specific goal you wouldn't bother with those empty corners to begin with.

>Implying MGSV wasn't good
It was okay.
>Implying GTAV was bad
It was definitely bad.
>Implying inFamous 2 wasn't great
It was mediocre.
>Implying the PS3 Ratchet & Clank games aren't great
Non-linear isn't necessarily open world and most of them were mediocre.
>Implying you know what you're talking about at all because all you play is shitty Ubisoft games and Skyrim
Nope, I'm sure I've played every game you have and much, much more. You're retarded and have shit taste.

Alisha is trash though. SorMik being adorable and canon as fuck is what makes Zestiria worthwhile.

Xenoblade Chronicles X has one of the best open worlds of all time though

>MGSV
I thought MGSV was pretty good, in the background there was a lot of interesting technical stuff going on to make the world feel more realistic, but I don't think it ever really gets noticed.
Also while I think the maps were fine it was the usage of them that made me feel see where the dev team was lacking.

We could've seen more indoor areas (especially in motherbase) and we could've had more civilians.
I know it was in the middle of nowhere, but they could've at least given us one town that was populated with at least 100+ non combatants, it would've made for interesting gameplay.
I have a theory that possibly FOX wouldn't have been able to do that on consoles though, don't get me wrong it's optimized beautifully but there's only so much more it could do.

thanks, looked kind a familiar but wasn't sure, that game looks really beautiful though.
Reminds me of Avatar.

Open overworld is typically superior when done properly.

i don't have a preference, both systems can work if they are actually well thought out

The only problems with JRPGs is they take "open world" literally.

MGSV isnt good because of its open world. The world in that game is one of the most bland, lifeless worlds I've ever seen.

I'm stuck Cred Forums I need some help shopping on Amazon for some things I need for my house, but I want to pick up an JRPG for my ps4. The last three JRPG I bought were Tales of Zest (meh), Ateleir Sophie (good), and Dark Souls III (great). I was looking at Nights of Azure, but wasn't so sure on it.

Are the Senran games any good?

If not any hidden JRPG gems you know of for ps4? (I played original Valkyrie Chronicles, very off put by the new "direction".)

Really makes you think that 20 year old games have twenty times more exploration and freedom than anything released this year combined.

Hell, what game does have a world map from 2010 onwards?

You're 100% correct. The only way to make open worlds feel alive would be to make "events" constant. Stuff like traveling and finding a group of strong people fighting a horde of enemies to protect a caravan or roaming armies wrecking shit would improve the formula greatly.

Hubs and randomly generated dungeons are just lazy bullshit.

But Dragon Quest VIII is open world. That's why I posted it.

Give me ONE game where open world functioned in a way that a traditional hub or more-linear approach couldn't have done better?

Hubs are god tier and efficient

rando gen is rarely done well in 3D games, but roguelikes already figured it out years ago

The type of millennials who say FF XIII is "decent"

That or ADHD autists who feel overwhelmed by open worlds.

Grand Kingdom is decent. You should definitely pick up Final Fantasy type-0 HD though.

Unless you like waifus and shallow gameplay with plenty of grindan stay away from Senran. Nights of Azure is also pretty shallow and repetitive, but if you like overt Yuri then go ahead.

Unless my body permanently changed from the medication I've took during my childhood, I have ADHD and love open world games.

I saw Grand Kingdom read a few of the reviews, people said the online was complete ass. Almost just bought Senran, but don't know if $50 worth what you say is shallow gameplay. Not much on waifus desu.

FFXIII and it's sequels are my favorite in the series. There is nothing you can do to change my opinion, no matter how much it triggers you.

Assassin's Creed or the Saboteur, GTA and it's fellow R* games like Bully and RDR, the just cause series, Spider-Man games and many other super hero games like Prototype or TIH:UD

If you want Senran then wait for a sale or something. It's definitely not worth $50

It wasn't cannon tho, and neither was Alisha before you get your panties in a knot.

>FFXIII and it's sequels are my favorite in the series

shit taste right there

Yes it was. Anybody who thinks otherwise is legit delusional.

>World of Xeen
>Might and Magic 6
>Dark Sun
>Fallout 1 & 2
>Morrowind
>Gothic
>Eschalon
>Deus Ex
>Arcanum
>Postal 2
>Dwarf Fortress
>Baldur's Gate 1 & 2
>Daggerfall

Should I keep going?

Okay. I'll continue to play them and enjoy them.

Every single bit of promo material before the games release said that they were canon. I don't understand why they did that.

The devs outright said that Sorey isn't into women at all, and that Mikleo is his 'one and only'. You have to be on at least 9 levels of delusion to think they aren't a couple.

The light novel even goes into Sorey's thoughts about how beautiful Mikleo is.

I prefer a quick game, something around 10-15hours maximum, an infinite amount of replay value in a NG+, harder modes, secret enemies and bosses, sequence breaks and something that encourages speedruns (finishing under 5 hours = special item, beating without using a certain item or skill = another special item)

open world is bullshit

it's not needed, it doesn't make the game better, it doesn't give the player the illusion of choice, it doesn't encourage multiple playthroughs and specially it makes you waste good 100 hours just to beat it when you could have used that time to enjoy two or three better games

So both are confirmed 100% gay? It really does not seem to be the case, both the game and anime really make little allusion to that kind of relationship. I could easily call them real brothers but not really a couple. Also all Tales are notorious for having protags that have very little interest in women, just take a look at Lloyd, Luke, Yuri and Jude for example, they're surrounded by women with the hots for them but man they never even notice I swear.

>So both are confirmed 100% gay?
Yep. Have been for a long time. Did you not play the game?

I did, and while there are some extremely fujobait moments there was really no clear indicative to the player that they loved each other that way. Like i said, their relationship looks very brotherlike and cute, but not really romantic. I'd actually believe you if I saw a dev statement (or a very direct line ingame about it) that says "yes they are gay for each other", otherwise I won't. If they are I don't mind really, but this no source thing and the conjectures and theories really don't prove much.

If someone strongly believes that earth is flat I'm not going to correct him, I'm just going to think hes an ignorant and that he'll eventually realize how stupid he is being.

So be happy and enjoy FF XIII to your heart's content.

Let me clarify, people who say they have ADHD, not real ADHD sufferers, you know, like those ones who call themselves "autist"

I have ADHD and games with ridiculous amounts of stuff going on are the only things that genuinely keep me immersed. Newer open world games don't usually scratch that itch, but D&D-based open world games and grand strategy are fucking great. I can't imagine being "overwhelmed" by a game. I think you might have ADHD and autism confused with lowest common denominator retards.

Either open world or classic rpg world maps. Not that in between shit we've seen in the calm lands off FFX or that sort of open area in FFXIII.

Why? Because a "complete" world is important in jrpgs to make it feel believable and to make it feel like you're in a real place that exists.

FFX had no world map, so the empty spaces outside the areas you walk in weren't filled up by anything. Sure you had a map at the end of the game, but it was an undetailed 2d image and you couldn't even walk around in it.

Traveling through a 3d world map enabled you to see where what is located. If you travel to a new place you can look back, and if things are out of visible range you still can pinpoint where they are in the world. Oh across this ocean is the junon canon, behind this mountain is midgar, this area of the map is all snow, I wonder what that spot there is, let's see if there is something to find. It's a great feeling and I cannot fathom why they would throw it away.

open world is the logical upgrade from this, and it meshes the exploration of the world map with normal gameplay constantly. It's different, but still believable.

I'm overwhelmed by FO3 and NV maps. Just thinking about how much fucking walking it takes to get anywhere is enough to turn me off. I sort of regret finishing FO3 because it absolutely killed any chance of me wanting to get into NV no matter how much better people say it is.

>Postal 2
>Deus Ex
>Open world
You're an idiot.

>I have ADHD and games with ridiculous amounts of stuff going on are the only things that genuinely keep me immersed.
Typical of ADHD, you want a lot of things happening at the same time. Slow games with basic mechanics, casual combat systems, etc are dull.

them being straight is no less of a conjecture or theory
moreso, even, since there's less evidence that either of them are straight

Yes.

Should be semi open, not copletely open from the start. More areas open up as you progress in the story.

Conpletely open is dumb because you find a dungeon or whatever to enter, that becomes a linear experience. The story must unfold in.a linear manner.

There is no benefit to a huge open world fro the start. Everything is wateted down and is typically balanced so a p'ayer of any level doesnt get eaten alive or trapped somewhere.

Majora's Mask does this right. Giving you an open area to play in, that gradually opens up more over time. All the while having direction, yet freedom to do other things.

Elder scrolls/fallout is completely.open with pretty much no direction and nothing particularly unique to discover anywhere.

This so much, FF always does this right, start in a linear closed world, suddenly present you with an open map that you can seemingly fully explore but you don't have the resources to do so (can't cross oceans etc) this way the world map opens more and more as the game advances but you always have massive exploration options.

>Elder scrolls/fallout is completely.open with pretty much no direction and nothing particularly unique to discover anywhere
But that's wrong. Only the newer games are like that.
>Majora's Mask does this right
MM was more of a theme park than true open world.

Way to make a post that says nothing at all.

>FF always does this right
>start in a linear closed world, suddenly present you with an open map that you can seemingly fully explore but you don't have the resources to do so (can't cross oceans etc) this way the world map opens more and more as the game advances but you always have massive exploration options.

But many FF games don't do what you just described. And the few that do certainty don't do it well.

>irony
What exactly needs to be further explained?

There is no irony. In the context of your post "theme park" has no meaning.
>thats wrong, only newer games do that
What part of the quote is wrong? Define "newer", provide reasons.

How old are you?

Overworld, but if I have to be honest as soon as I get quick travel it may as well be hub world for me since I will probably never bother with the overworld again unless its neccessary.

open world with realistic movement speed that varies based on terrain type in a giant map with no fast travel or worldmap

I prefer something like Zelda offers
Having a somewhat open world but not a truly open world, where you can only go to certain locations after finding certain equipment/completing certain tasks

At least PS1 FF do.

FF VII.

>You literally do a hours long part of the story without leaving (or even being hinted that something such as a world map even exists) Midgard at all, but still there is a lot of backtracking and exploration available

>You get out of Midgard and get dropped in the immense open world. From here on now the side quests are mostly endless only growing exponentially as you advance the game and get different vehicles to explore different parts of the world.

If that's not a perfect gating system while allowing the player full and rewarding exploration I don't know what is. Also just dropping an open world like that isn't necessarily a good thing, since it removes the sense of discovery and thriving to reach new, inaccesible parts of the map because you know there will be so much exploration in them.

I thought FFVII was great until you left Midgar.

>In the context of your post "theme park" has no meaning.
You don't know what a theme park game is? Heavily railroaded? Creates the illusion of open world without actually being open world? Not ringing any bells?
>Define "newer"
Daggerfall and Morrowind weren't what you described at all. Daggerfall was largely about fast traveling to gigantic labyrinth-esque dungeons. Morrowind was about actually making a serious effort to gather information, using that information to journey across an extremely varied environment with a significant amount of methods for travel at your disposal and reaching your destination, going into a dungeon, that unlike recent Elder Scrolls titles, were painstakingly put together and many of which actually oozed quality level design and variety. You have no fucking idea what you're talking about.

>How old are you?
Probably older than you, nintoddler.

Give me some good JRPGs that aren't turn based with random encounters and infinitely respawning enemies.

Nier

Undertale is the only one I know you can actually decimate monster population by killing them.

Then again, I wouldn't want to be called an Undertalefag since I hate Tumblr and reddit, so ignore this post

>it's another memer that doesn't understand the concept of openworld

Plenty of other series have done what you pointed out. And better. There's a reason people keep mentioning Dragon Quest VIII. It didn't just start you off in a self contained city but on one of three major continents. And you could explore huge areas right out of the first city. And over the 80 hour game, you got a ship, a sabercat, the soul of a bird and the zoom spell to expand your ability to explore. But most importantly, there was just more to find in DQVIII than any of the FF games.

...

Best Open World ever created. Monolith Soft on a tier of their own.

Hub please. JRPGs with anything open only means random battles. They are mostly empty, full of pointless deadend and you cant move 2 inches without having to spam X for the next 30 secs.

But jrpgs are the shithole of rpgs, so even with a hub it will most likely be shit.

Resonance of Fate was good, i'll give your shitty genre that

youtu.be/qncMaOCtEfs

>random battles
RPGs still do that? I thought we all moved on to touch enemy on the field to trigger a battle.

geez grandpa, it's not 2006, you know?

This. I don't really care if I can't explore wherever whenever, as long as every area looks pretty and distinct.

But if I have to choose what I want then give me Xenoblade Chronicles where I'm going from large region to large region in a linear order. That's the best.

>Satorl Marsh at night
>Eryth Sea
>Snowy Valak Mountain

>give me Xenoblade Chronicles
>give me a pigshit disgusting single player mmo
Can someone explain this meme? Is it just nintoddlers being nintoddlers?

>JRPGs with anything open only means random battles.
Even Dragon Quest has moved onto on field enemies. Which has proven to be a negative thing. I'd rather they go back to random battles.

And are you seriously suggesting that zoned, linear games like FFX don't have random battles?

Not a single reason not to agree with you, both are great games.

I personally am a fag for ff exploration system tho, can't help it

I'm just talking about world style, not gameplay.

This is a thread about types of game worlds. It'd be nice if you console war faggots could at least learn to read.

Is FFXII open world?

>world style
>styled like a pigshit disgusting single player MMO

Not that guy, but MMOs are essentially single player games these days anyway. A game removing the online element and focusing more on story is actually a good thing.

I don't care what you guys say, I loved this game

im not suggesting anything friendo. OP asked between hub and overworld. I answered hub because it has less chance of being an absolute borefest of a game.

DESU, theres some jrpgs with random battles that I was able to enjoy, but it rarely was because the combat part was fun.

I know you faggots will burn me for saying this, but corridors with dodgeable ennemies ala FFXIII was the best thing ive ever saw in a jrpg. Now dont get me wrong, its not top notch game design, but its the best ive seen in the genre. You get to choose if you want to fight or not, theres no pointless exploration and you if you take a month long break, youre not wondering which shithole of a town you must now go.

But desu, I'd be able to deal with random battles if gameplay was an actual priority for jrpgs devs. Resonance of Fate is a prime exemple of this, great game, would recommend even tho I hate the genre.

I don't like JRPG open worlds because JRPG'S almost always have shit quest design

Looks like Skyward Sword

The mental gymnastics you guys go through always amuses me.

Please kill yourself

Overworlds. Never really been a fan of hubs. I honestly even prefer pure linear to hubs.
I don't hate em, they're just my least preferred option.

shit combat shit story shit monster designs that are more kiddy than friggin pokemon. they wasted joe hisaishi on this shit.. ugh

the English VA was terrible. I couldn't play 10 mins on the dub. Luckily it came with Japanese audio and English subs.... but the subs were horribly incorrect a lot of the time.

Great game, terrible localization

Mira is the best open world ever created.
Debate me.

wew

You're simply playing the wrong kind of game you fucking dumb shit, go play DMC or something you stupid fuck, if FF XIII is the (((best))) (((you))) have seen then you simply don't like RPGs

It's pretty much 10 and 13 that don't.

That image has literally 0 effort put into it.

>Look at how edgy I am mom!

Depends on the art design and gameplay mechanics. If there's nothing to do there I don't need an overworld or a hub.

I can't, you win

Meant the art detail obviously.

Can square enix even compete?

I love JRPG but I hate when they are linear
Dragon Quest and Final Fantasy are the prime examples of linearity

Give me non linear jrpgs

While FF15's world does look good, no. No they can't.

Ivalice in 12 was cool too.

Hub worlds are good, I love phantasy star online

>you simply don't like RPGs
Nah m8, I thought it was pretty clear. Its jrpgs that i despise, and for many reason.

Guess what you pleb, rpgs have preparation, actual character building, almost never have random battles except a few games and the combat requires more than the X button.

jrpgs kiddies are so fucking delusionnal its the only reason I keep coming to these threads.

Always hub, nothing is comfier than a proper hub

>You will live to see faggots on the internet call you edgy for pointing out that bad games are bad

brothers don't get erect dicks thinking about another user, they are gay.

They can't make people's faces look good but they sure as hell can do everything else

I can't tell you how many hours I logged in this game

...

>posting Adult Swim reaction images
>no counter points

>I answered hub because it has less chance of being an absolute borefest of a game.
See, I don't get where you're coming from. Most HUB games are story focused borefests like FFX or XIII.

I also pointed out that your comments about random battles have nothing to do with it being open world or linear zones or a HUB world.

I think you mean "Skyward Sword looks like Laputa." As does half the Zelda games.

I'm going to post an extremely controversial opinion here: I have yet to encounter a game that has a better overworld than Skyrim. It's as close to perfect as overworlds can get.

Skyrim's map is a fantastic base to build on, but it's greatness is buried under bland default color grading, awful textures and a shitty way-point system that negates true exploration. I can't forget lack luster alternate methods of travel, the horse system is pretty shit.

I really fucking hate that waypoint system. I would much prefer it you had an actual map with maybe a little auto-fill. That way I could see that stairs are 2 minutes to the left so I don't spend 20 minutes bethesda-walking up a sheer vertical slope to traverse to the top of the mountain. Fuck you Todd, I climbed your mountains even when the game didn't want me to. Color grading and textures are easily fixed with mods, but it shouldn't have to be. I wish Bethesda weren't such lazy kikes.

>ITS RARELY DONE WELL IT MUST HAVE AN ITEM OR A MISSION EVERY 2 STEPS
I fucking hate when people say shit like this. It just makes zero sense.

I literally don't give a single fuck which it is as long as it's done well.
If a game gives me snoozefest garbage open world like in TW3, I rather have hubs.

As much as I like an overworld map like the past, I don't know how you can actually do it now really.

Can anyone at least give an idea how it can be implemented?

>Most HUB games are story focused borefests like FFX or XIII
Cant comment on X, The MC was a huge turnoff for me, like 9, or 8 (still played it, fucking triple triads).
But for XIII, everything was skipable except bossfights and a few encounters. If I didnt felt like fighting that particular mob, I just dodged it or stacked a few aerosols. Almost felt like an actual RPG, with preparation and decisions, you know?

>random battles have nothing to do with it being open world or linear zones or a HUB world
But user, you forgot how a hub erases all of the pointless exploration, the numerous deadends with maybe a chest and cuts the tedious travel time.

But I do agree with that hub or no hub, jrpgs have so many flaws and so little rpg elements that it doesnt change much in the end. Most of them feel like playing with the dvd menu of a average shonen in term of gameplay and story

Overworld is a glorified fast travel screen. Except slow.

There aren't enough jrpg overworlds where you could just drive around in it.

It might not be the game series you would expect, but the Mount and Blade series uses an over-world map. If anyone else ever tried to expand on the werid sub-genre that Mount and Blade created it, it would probably led to people trying new things with the over-world system.

XVs world shits all over XCXs shit.

There is depending on your definition of RPG

Someone who came from pen and paper RPGs might find the idea of being unable to have any real say unthinkable.

I hate games that tell me what to do and where to go.

I'd much rather figure that out on my own.

I like the "we tell you the name of the place and you just follow road signs and talk to people like you would in real life" system.

I fucking hate that shit.

As soon as they tell me where to go that's the last place I want to go.

Sylvalum and Oblivia are such fucking perfection

Well, if the world is actually well designed the dev team should have been able to prevent that by making it seem like you have more freedom to do things so you don't have to do things exactly as the game tells you.

Or they could just give you freedom and drop the pointless shitty story they're trying railroad me on.

The whole world is on hold until I do what the dev team wants me to do.

Noctilum > Sylvalum > Cauldros = Oblivia > Primordia

>Literally every square inch of the map has something you need to do
Placing a breakable rock or grass you can slash does not fit this.
You sound like a fanboy mindlessly quoting from an advertisement.

> be it finding treasure, fighting an optional boss, completing a sidequest or planting a mining probe, in order to complete the region's survey,

Ah yes, repetitive busy work for the sake of filling out some arbitrary content quota.
Come back to me when these games have actual meaningful, unique content with good quest stories rather than some checklist of boring MMO-tier quantity over quality trash.

Because at this point it's nothing but a huge world with a bunch of markers just so you guys can say
>b-but it's not e-empty at all!! Look at all these things you can do! Like find treasure #2134 and plant mining probe #213!

>Come back to me when these games have actual meaningful, unique content
Please quantify your expectations in this regard.
>good quest stories
XCX has these in spades. Frankly most actual MMOs probably have these too.
>Because at this point it's nothing but a huge world with a bunch of markers just so you guys can say
So unique enemies aren't content. Mining probes don't count even though they open up fast travel points. I ask again- what exactly is it you want if not gameplay?