I wasn't, I'm not, a huge fan of systemd but it seems to be the way forward...

I actually hate systemD, but what I said above is still true.

I don't know what's so bad about systemd when I compare it to sysv. Quite frankly I don't understand why you would prefer init.d scripts to systemd scripts. Like holy fucking shit what a difference. But then again that's literally my only reference.

>Like holy fucking shit what a difference.
Given all the other shit sysD does, yes, there is quite a difference.

Community distros don't need to be commecial successfull.

>Like holy fucking shit what a difference.
Wtf are you even talking about?

Just open any init script in init.d and then one of systemd.

>tfw Devuan only supports x86(_64) and ARM

I have debian and I was going to just replace system-d but I don't even know what the difference would be. I might just do it anyway because why not.

Can anyone recommend a replacement? Otherwise I'll just pick the first alternative I find like runit

Devian, you should feel right at home, minus Systemd

Having a monolithic "init system" take over every core util?
Yeah that is foreward thinking

Considering how incompetent lenneart is

/httplists.freedesktop.org/archives/systemd-devel/2015-June/033170.html
/httparticle.gmane.org/gmane.linux.hotplug.devel/17392
/httplists.freedesktop.org/archives/systemd-devel/2014-May/019657.html
/httpscgit.freedesktop.org/systemd/systemd/commit/?id=5a8bcb674f71a20e95df55319b34c556638378ce
/httpsgithub.com/systemd/systemd/commit/29272c04a73b00b5420ee686d73c3bc74d29d169?utm_source=anzwix
/httpsgithub.com/systemd/systemd/issues/2402
/httpslists.fedoraproject.org/archives/list/[email protected]/message/XW7V5A3RAWYCACU2ZMPA27ARRLIZUI37/
/httpsbugzilla.redhat.com/show_bug.cgi?id=1170765
/httpsbugs.debian.org/cgi-bin/bugreport.cgi?bug=784720
/httpslists.freedesktop.org/archives/systemd-devel/2015-February/028514.html
/httpsgithub.com/systemd/systemd/issues/825#issuecomment-127917622

You mean literally the same shit minus systemd proprietary service language?

openrc

Friendly reminder:
systemd is a suite of basic building blocks for a Linux system. It provides a system and service manager that runs as PID 1 and starts the rest of the system. systemd provides aggressive parallelization capabilities, uses socket and D-Bus activation for starting services, offers on-demand starting of daemons, keeps track of processes using Linux control groups, supports snapshotting and restoring of the system state, maintains mount and automount points and implements an elaborate transactional dependency-based service control logic. systemd supports SysV and LSB init scripts and works as a replacement for sysvinit. Other parts include a logging daemon, utilities to control basic system configuration like the hostname, date, locale, maintain a list of logged-in users and running containers and virtual machines, system accounts, runtime directories and settings, and daemons to manage simple network configuration, network time synchronization, log forwarding, and name resolution.

>proprietary service language
> proprietary
I don't think that word means what your think it means

It isnt #!/bin/ash
It has its own structured format, that is not plaintext.

Well put.
Socket activation is a buzzword.
Just because all your friends are doing herion doesn't mean you need to do the same.
Commercially, maybe. From a development or personal use standpoint, you're so far off the mark...
I don't prefer it, I do prefer that my init and service management don't go full Mongol horde and invade my userspace tools that I carefully selected...
strawman argument. Open a runscript for a daemontools-styled manager and open systemd. Hint: systemd is typically 3-4 times bigger.
Is a unit file not specific to systemd? How do you parse a unit file? Can you embed other commands in arbitrary sequences into a unit file?

>Commercially, maybe. From a development or personal use standpoint, you're so far off the mark...

I've been a regular contributor of both code and money to Gentoo, Debian, and Fedora. Of the three, Gentoo is falling apart at the seams. Their devs are tired, over-worked, and increasingly not getting enough donations to make it worth their time. Meanwhile Debian and Redhat are both awash in money and fresh devs who are being paid to care.

Don't get me wrong here. I really don't like what's going on, but it's human nature at work. People are coalescing around funded and more popular systems. Effort is draining from those that were more dispersed and centered around a few good devs with time to kill years ago.

In the long run there will always be small community distros, for sure, but from the standpoint of surviving economic hard times that are coming I fear most of the current ones are boned. The belts are going to tighten soon, neoliberalism is out of control, and the commercial distros are going to sail away from the starving hobby devs with ease.

Can any Solaris fags compare/contrast SMF with systemd? I have never used Sol10.

>the commercial distros are going to sail away from the starving hobby devs with ease
Let them. None of the commercial distributions suit any of my current requirements. If anything, many get in the way.

I'm saying Gentoo in particular, and probably a lot of other are going to fold up. It's really going to be a bad time for community distros in the next decade.

I have never used SMF, but from what I understand it was glorious.

>It's really going to be a bad time for community distros in the next decade.
The training wheels are coming off for me. I started dabbling in '96 and I've made my living as an admin for 20 years now. I get the community ones are going to dry up, but that's to be expected. I'm fine with this. Gimme source, I'll survive just fine.

Actually, looking back at things, I'm getting fed up with the commodity nature of this movement. If I wanted more boxed copies of Windows, I would buy more boxed copies of Windows. Instead I have the funkiness that is Gnome 3 and "you don't need that anymore, it's hidden", etc. I ran Debian 7 exclusively for more than a year as my desktop, but with Debian 8 and the funky cold madina of Gnome 3, I gave up, it wasn't worth fighting with G3 over stupid shit. Want that theme? Tough, you're stuck. What that feature? We removed it. Tweak a setting? Open the super-secret decoder ring control panel, and even then, we might have removed whatever GUI control you were looking for in this latest release because, fuck, we're Gnome devs, we know better than you, we obviously know everything YOU want.

And then there will be 3. Everyone will crowd to them, and I will have to learn them to keep my work skills (OK with me, someone will pay me to learn and someone will pay me to use it). But I'll be fucked if I will let that shit into my house.

>It's really going to be a bad time for community distros in the next decade.
In hindsight, this will become an event.

As Linux moves into monoculture and becomes the very thing that it initially resisted, it will become more and more vulnerable to attacks against that monoculture.

That may change; someone might tighten security even more than it already is. But memories are short, and I'm sure that the new batch of people coding in the kernel (and the new systemd monoculture around it, 250,000 lines what could possibly go wrong) will not remember when someone tried to slip a backdoor into the kernel by changing a comparison into an operator, and assigning zero to a user ID instead of checking for it.

History doesn't repeat, it rhymes badly. It's a matter of time.

Perhaps the FreeBSD folks have the right idea.

BSD does have the right idea. I'm hoping to see more small-time linux devs head that direction as they see what's going on with Linux.

I don't doubt the motives of the Linux people, but the licensing issues they've come up with to deal with contrib are going to end up working against them when things get rough. Meanwhile BSD is going to be largely unaffected.

Nobody is interested in taking over and incorporating BSD because they can just fork it and go do what they want no questions asked. That means the main project can stay on point and keep doing what they do best rather that letting monolithic fuckups like systemD get rammed through by big corporate clowns.

can't tell if this is for or against systemd

I'm tired. Tired of the ride, the ride that goes nowhere.

BSD it is...at some point I'll bring the home server down, blitz the drive, make a ZFS array, set services back up, and go back to not giving two shits because the server's so automated it practically takes care of itself. It took about a week to figure it all out, it'll probably take about the same amount of time to transition and re-install all the services I have to do the same.

Then I can finally have some bliss. Not having to watch as the Linux "community" slowly tears itself apart from the inside will be a schadenfreude feeling for me.

>Then I can finally have some bliss. Not having to watch as the Linux "community" slowly tears itself apart from the inside will be a schadenfreude feeling for me.

Welcome home.

Indeed.

Yep, specially Manjaro, since it''s following the same strategy Ubuntu did.

Systemd is basically turning Linux into RedhatBSD

It's fixing decades of inconsistencies bought on by hacking various subsystems with conflicting design philosophies together and curing the unnecessary configuration weirdness that the distros have inflicted on Linux .

Ultimately though once the BSDs find the manpower they are going to end up with their own new init solution somewhere between launchd or systemd in the end.

The systemd "controversy" is already blowing over.

they're also not in any way "major" other than OpenSUSE. slackware might still have a decent following but nowhere near the numbers of ubuntu based and fedora based. the others are completely irrelevant. you're really listing gentoo, lfs and puppy as major distros? there are combined maybe a few thousand people running them. that's being generous.

>carrying about your Linux software being commercially accepted

i wish i could still buy a boxed linux distro with commercial support from my local compusa

It will never, ever stop being mind-boggling to me how people have no issue with this AIDS complex system(d)atically taking over their computer. I've never been one to believe much in paid "shills" but this is the one case where after what I've seen, I'm really not so sure. No one at all has any problem whatsoever with this creepy milgov corporation dumping code into PID 1? Really?

They don't even pretend it's an "init system" any more for fuck's sake, if you want a laugh get a systemd fanboy to define exactly what it is

>not even a Pajeet would make such statements.
better get that rope, fampai

I'm just a Linux user and I'm completely fine that the developers choose the technology they think is the best.

To me it seems that systemd is evolution of the common Linux platform as all the major commercial distributions have adopted it with the exception of Google.

$0.02 in your account

I know the "pajeet" thing is satire and all, but it stopped being funny a while ago. Now it's just racist. You can stop already.

Upstart was crumbling from bad and shitty documentation.

It's like another Mir except Mir is getting more attention.

>Satire
You need to return to Tumblr.

I opened up a few of those and none were systemd's fault.
You compiled a list of all systemd related articles without even reading them and now you think you have the holy grail of "systemd is bad" proof. There's no point in trying to convince you otherwise, since you're a deluded idiot, which you proved the last time when you claimed that systemd has a built-in webserver just because you found a service file for Apache.

Clue: they can't. The scope keeps changing, and uncontained scope creep has always been the hallmark of a poorly run project.
The devs? *Which* devs are we talking about? The linux kernel hackers? They didn't choose it, frankly they don't give two shits.
>RedhatBSD
Not even close. BSD has a single, coherent approach to its development, but it does not enforce a specific arrangement; you can pull in other service managers as part of it. Contrast with the systemd approach of "all or none"; people will say "but I can still run XYZ if I want", but that's not really true, XYZ will clash with the deep integration that systemd is attempting. Pic is very related, it's a keeper, a graft designed to ensure that its host is compliant to the needs of ... others. Attempting to cut systemd out will, in turn, create pain (just like the keeper uses pain to ensure compliance).

Red Hat is what you meant. Keep BSD out of it. Pay me to be trained to use systemd, pay me to use systemd at work. I will not comply at home.

>Pay me to be trained to use systemd, pay me to use systemd at work. I will not comply at home.
Truly a revolutionary. Fighting the good fight. Meticulously chosen preferences and battles to fight. We need more people like you. The world will be saved if more people were like you ~

I'm not sure there's much paid shilling, but RH is a publicly acknowledged corporate affiliate of the intel and defense state orgs. People whose opinions matter are being subtly pressured to nod along or at least not make a scene. Contrib to alternative projects at the corporate level is doubtless seen as not in good taste. So then the lower level drones on Cred Forums just see the herd leaders moving and move along with it.

Considering most of Cred Forums is devoted to either Debian or Arch, both of which are converged to sysD already, the shilling becomes organic.

That said, anyone trying to imply that BSD is similarly tainted or will be is probably getting some kind of return on their shilling. That's just such a wild misstatement and contradiction of the facts. Only someone desperate to keep people away from BSD would use it.

Bottom line, the deep state corporate guys current taming Linux with sysD aren't happy that independent talent is fleeing to BSD. I'm a friend and contributor to both Free and Open. We have seen a 10 fold increase in donations and interest since the sysD blowup.

>To me it seems that systemd is evolution of the common Linux platform as all the major commercial distributions have adopted it with the exception of Google.
That should be a clue right there. Google, being a large entity, would not easily give up or cede control of anything it already has. This not only extends to its infrastructure, but also its products. Besides, systemd does not lend itself well to a mobile/constrained platform.