Alcoholism is an allergy

You've never experienced withdrawal.

>thinking your brain isn't just another physical item that responds to other physical phenomena

waahhhhh

>"disagreeing" with science
you're like the people who say "evolution is ONLY a theory, after all."

en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Addiction

Read this, stop making stupid bait threads, and stop shitting up Cred Forums even worse than it already is.

>friend was a raging alcoholic
>partied all the time, fucked a different girl every night, did lots of dumb shit but it was usually funny
>gets a preachy, controlling gf
>she convinces him that alcohol is ruining his life and he gives it up
>friend eventually marries this bitch
>he now has a nagging wife, 4 kids, and works all the time in a futile attempt to pay his never-ending bills
>he still believes it's better than being an alcoholic

Nah m8, you're just a cunt.

op actually has a drinking problem and is looking for reassurance

geting mad at user ppl online. get over urself looser

living the "life"

While I can appreciate your belief in the strength of willpower, alcoholism is a literal chemical dependency. The very same chemical reactions required to have strong willpower are the same that crave alcohol and other drugs.

Addiction is real.

Depression, however, is not.

Apparently you can't stop sucking dick.

Yeah poor guy, why didn't he continue destroying his body?

Because you clearly aren't mad at people who say they have an addiction and complaining about it on the internet you massive fucking faggot.

Daddy's very sick!

Some people literally die if they stop drinking alcohol

It is?

You can't even stop visiting this site.

origionaly i was just trying to say that why would anyone give a fuck about ur life story or ur dads etc. go post in advice u fuckwit wtf has this got to do with anything, ur just geting more mad over some person u think is a huge fucking faggot ur so mad m8.

...

Took you a whole 5 minutes and you couldn't even come up with a decent comeback. You got fucking blown the fuck out.

No one said it's uncontrollable, I just said it's real. Of course you can will yourself to stop, just like you can will yourself through a marathon untrained. doesn't mean it's not damn hard.

Cred Forums is way more addictive than drugs.

t. guy who does drugs

>he thinks he has a soul

holy shit lmao you're just a stupid robot you idiot

>alcoholism is a literal chemical dependency.

That's true, but it takes time to develop a physical dependency, and there's plenty of time to stop or take breaks before that dependency happens.

BTDT

Nice non-response you fucking scrub.

Sounds pretty much like me. Just one kid though and my wife was surprisingly cool when I started drinking again after 3 years. We both needed it though because we were both getting on each other's nerves. She was a drunk too btw.

Or near impossible.

if you say so. clearly ur opinion is the only 1 that matters. the fact u feel the need to say u got fucking blow the fuck out just shows how pathetic u are.

ITT; an underage faggot tries to defend his shit habits to people who have experienced and have helped other deal with alcohol addiction.

Boo hoo you lost someone you never fucking met. I've lost 5 friends and a dog to their opiate abuse faggot.

Addiction IS real, you either have a problem with having one enough to stop or you don't. Anyone who says otherwise, and tries to glorify the pursuit of happiness or the relief the substance abuse provides, is being a pretentious cunt.

Try again with capitalization and something actually worth saying, bitch.

Tell me again how a fucking War Veteran is pathetic for having an alcohol addiction moron.

peter hitchens was right

literally just don't have the first drink

If you can afford it and you're not a mean drunk, being an alcoholic is a really entertaining lifestyle. Guaranteed you have like 100x as many interesting stories to tell as your sober friends.

Just hope you are the lucky one that has genes that make you indestructible from the damage is does to your body. Although, I'd probably take dying like 8 or whatever years earlier from liver damage if it meant a lifetime of adventures. I just don't want to be dying of stomach cancer when I'm 45.

not an argument

...

I can stop masterbating for a few days but not indefinitely.

Its not or you wouldn't be able to sleep longer than your "addiction" cycle

Its why smokers can sleep 10 hrs or more

they are not really addicted and the compulsion can't wake them

unlike an actual disorder

He never said those words. Fuck your a dumb cunt

> not an argument to not an argument.
> pepe.
Don't you have some more dicks to choke on around here somewhere?

Or are you still getting through your first millionth?

your gramps was a fag lmao

And you're quite plainly sucking his dick.

Refer to the OP, cocksucker.

I used to think addiction was full of shit until I felt it myself.

Like just stop doing it right?
The issue is that continuing to do your addictive behaviour feels better than not.
That sounds really simple, but that's how it is.

Like, I was drinking pretty heavily for a long time. I knew it was wrong and I knew I was hurting myself.
But at every few days I thought "Why deal with shit for one more night when I can just drink and be something like happy?"
It's just like I'm unhappy. Doing this makes me happier. Why stop?

W E W
E
W
L
A
D

this guy sounds like hes drunk raging replying half of what he has said makes no logical sense. Hes getting angry over nothing and keeps saying people are saying things they clearly arent.

Bigger man than you'll ever be, sweetums.

If anything depression is more real than alcoholism. You literally can't be happy if your brain blocks out serotonin and dopamine. Alcoholism is mostly people too bitch to deal with life.

We need to educate our dogs about the risks of drug use.

Drinking is fine, drinking every day by yourself to the point where you can't hold a job or have any kid of healthy routine isn't.

Some other things like opiates and crack, are rarely used recreationally and responsibly. People either like it so much it's all they want, or don't like it at all.

Sex and shopping addicts though, fuck those people. And being fat is in the same ballpark.

>sweetums.
Looks like his grandson is a flamer as well.

This guy is a flamboyant faggot.

How true is this?

100%, you retard.

> failing to take up the "big guy" meme.
For (you).

Nobody forces another person to drink alcohol.
It's a choice. They CHOSE to drink alcohol. They can put down the bottle at literally any time. They choose not to.

>B-B-BUT MUH ADDICTION! HELP ME JUSTIFY MY IRRESPONSIBLE AND DAMAGING DECISIONS!

Just don't drink the alcohol. It's that easy.

you have such a dependance on it, if you suddenly stop having it full stop your body goes intto shock or some shit like that. happens on alot of drugs too, you gotta be weaned.

>If anything depression is more real than alcoholism.

Skip to the part where the pharmaceutical/mental health industries are largely incapable of identifying and treating depression or things that might be mistaken for depression, ie giving autistic people meds for something that can't be helped or seroquel to kids under 18.

...

Says the guy who can't stop himself from posting utter bullshit.

I did say your wormfood ancestor was pathetic, I implied YOU'RE pathetic for getting so indignant about someone you've never fucking known. You're like black people who cry about slavery

Low-tier bait.

I WILL REMIND YOU that OP is and always will be a faggot.

...

Says the guy leaping to the defense of a retarded faggot on the internet who is quite plainly wrong.

Suck dick more, dipshit.

Thanks
Faggot

en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Delirium_tremens

Not him, but free will doesn't exist if you believe in a monist universe.
That is, if you believe that everything can be measured in some way, free will cannot exist.

Think about it this way.
A monist universe means it can be simulated given a sufficiently advanced simulating program. If you run that program again and again it'll do the same thing each time.
Think about it like if you simulate a billiard table.
If you run a program to ricochet a ball around the table, it'll bounce the same way each time.
A simple program can do that for a billiard table.
A sufficiently advanced one can do it to ever atom in the universe.

If you believe that is possible, then you must believe that free will does not exist.
Just like the billiards program, each movement is going to be replicated.
And our lives are just movements of atoms. Every thought and every belief.

I would think its probably more pathetic to be that straight-edge socially retarded and isolated guy on the internet who goes on rants about things he has absolutely no personal experience or knowledge of, all painfully and obviously rants designed to make himself feel better about his mundane meaningless life by trying to act superior to others.

But why stop?

Your dub-trips confirms He's addicted.

> gets told he's wrong multiple times.
> responds with f-f-faggot.

look whos talking

I only asked once, that was my first post newfriend.

I agree with this line of thinking about glorifying your vices, but at the same time I think everyone needs one. People should be more humble about certain aspects of their personality being looked down upon and that's all your vices should amount too, something you do for yourself that others disapprove of but doesn't really hurt anyone but yourself.

> more Pepe.

Stale meme is stale, just like your mom's vagina.

You could have easily researched the subject on wikipedia and found out. Why are you such a fucking faggot user-kun holy shit.

You're a dumbass. Alcoholism gets physical and if you try to stop you will go into seizures.

...

I'd love for the straightedge faggot itt to tell a heroin junkie

>dude it's just chemicals in your head
>You can stop any time man
>just don't shoot up
>it's that easy

It's pretty obvious when people such as the homeless have a problem when their only goal in the day, even straight from waking up is to get shit faced.

>looser
Wew, fucking stepped into retard land.

Member' that meme, guys?

no problem.i saw a doco where a guy wouldnt stop sshaking till he got down acouple mouthfulls of vodka. its all dependant on how long and how much you have.

I figured I'd ask here since people are talking about it ON A DISCUSSION BOARD. Also it seems your addicted to being a little bitch.

>i think i might have an alcohol problem
>i know! i'll purchase alcohol and keep it in my house so that if i ever feel like drinking it, it's just seconds away!
>or, i'll take time out of my day to visit establishments that serve customers alcohol!
>alcohol is bad for me, so I'm going to trade my hard-earned money for it!
>short-term pleasure is all that matters :)

shouldn't people like this just be round up and shot in the head? what's the downside?

grammer? lol....oh noe its the internet and he tpyed the wrong ways eghhhh oh noesssss

...

Nice comeback, that almost registered as an irritant. Unfortunately (for you) you're far out of your league with this Big Guy.

you realize such a thought experiment is easily countered by

>measure that a person has a 100% chance to do x
>inform person of this
>inform person that doing x means a 100% chance to die
>that person, with full knowledge of their 100% chance to die and the absolute certainty, before being informed, of their chances of doing x, then can decide whether or not to do x.

All you have left to do from this situation is quibble over whether or not the decision was a result of free will.

Either way, you're basically arguing that it is possible for a person to know the potentiality of all outcomes, but impossible for them to make a decision that wasn't predictable.

Thus, the "monist universe" is crap and its basically a thought-trap for the just-not-quite-smart-enough to have free will.

>big guy
right....

Let's forget about the fact that you can't go to sleep in the middle of a true addiction crave and that it will actually wake you up. I can excuse ignorance, but your argument shows that you're just stupid. The compulsion is on the conscious part of your brain, which is (mostly, and that small part can actually wake you up) shut off in sleep. For example, cocaine withdrawal leaves your brain with almost 0 dopamine production. Without dopamine you are physically unable to feel happy. Therefore the compulsion is due to you feeling incredibly depressed without the drug. Obviously mood is not as apperrant while you're asleep. Other withdrawals cause things you can't ignore even while asleep, like hypersensitivity and overactive bowels from opiate withdrawals. Addiction is literally physically real. What disorder do you consider more legitimate than addiction?

Except Alcohol has literally been around for tens of thousands of years and it's only recently that there has been such a backlash against it. Though the Romans did frown upon people who got too drunk.

Nice non-response, m80. You sure you're old enough to be on this site?

>Only recently

>be "alcoholic"
>the only way you can experience happiness/joy is while inebriated
>take drink, get dopamine
>want more
>drink more

Addiction by it's current definition is a poor descriptor of whats happening in such situations.

Oh look, a closet addict. Get help, friendo, you can't quit on your own.

wow nobodys posted it yet

youtube.com/watch?v=CDtIZZiySgA

Uneducated idiot spotted.

You're not understanding me.

I'm saying simulating the universe outside the universe.
If you simulate it within the universe, you're obviously going to influence it, thus ruining the simulation.

If the universe is able to simulated from the outside, then there is no free will.

Everything we see tells us that it is possible.

Im 34, so yeah. Also I'm not your m80 dick. Just reading what the other adults are talking about. How about you do the same.

What if the program is capable of producing NPC's that are capable of free will? What then?
The program just writes the expansion of much of the universe, however it's such a sophisticated program that it can truly evolve and and branch out.

It will control other details like stars being born and the universe expanding. However perhaps there's a particle X that can create free willed users and objects. Objects that can determine whether to press enter on this post or not.

My body formed a physical dependence on opiates due to a back problem I had, I continued taking them. When I tried stopping I got stomach cramps so bad I could hardly stand up.

I still stopped despite the withdrawal pains, anyone claiming that just because physically addictions can manifest that addicts can't be held responsible for their actions is a prick. Quitting just takes willpower, fucking get some.

Your thought experiment is fucking retarded. The person doesn't have a 100% chance to do X because the informing part would be included in the equation when calculating whether he will do X.

> not your m80 dick.
Legit mad ITT.

Im currntly going through DTs so Id say the chemical addiction part is real, but its not a disease. A prediliction maybe due to both nature and nurture, but not a disorder.

OP is addicted to overcompensating for his personal shortcomings with uninformed smug internet posts...and probably some form of cheetos.

That's just your reflection in the screen.

I feel like everything you're saying is somehow tautological.

>without dopamine you're depressed!
>compulsion is conscious but a result of lack of dopamine

etc.

You're also confusing non-neurological addiction with neurological addiction. Like the physical side effects of withdraw and chemical dependency with really wanting something and knowing how to get it.

>However perhaps there's a particle X that can create free willed users and objects.

Perhaps there's also an all-loving God, and leprechauns and imps and fairies.

You're supposing there is an "X" particle that is in humans and nothing else?

If you can simulate atoms, you can simulate everything. All of them.

Oh sorry, you need friends?

No... No my screen is covered in Smeg from where i've jizzed myself over how retarded this thread is.

Says the 34 year old posting on Cred Forums.

Not if you don't have the will power.

Decently true. Doctors will literally prescribe beer to people in hospitals to have with their food. It isn't done anymore, mainly because of better options available, but doctors literally used to put small amounts of vodka in ivs

I got friends, you just got mad cause I said I wasn't yours, poor sweet child.

youtu.be/1iAYhQsQhSY

Hi, alcoholic here, it's hard to "just put down the alcohol" when you are sweating, shaking, have constant diarrhea, can't sleep, have nothing but nightmares when you do sleep, and you want to kill everyone you meet for the smallest infractions

And you know how you make all of that stop? You drink.

>Historically the name "dipsomania" was coined by German physician C. W. Hufeland in 1819 before it was superseded by "alcoholism".[161][162] That term now has a more specific meaning.[163] The term "alcoholism" was first used in 1849 by the Swedish physician Magnus Huss to describe the systematic adverse effects of alcohol.[164] Alcohol has a long history of use and misuse throughout recorded history. Biblical, Egyptian and Babylonian sources record the history of abuse and dependence on alcohol. In some ancient cultures alcohol was worshiped and in others its abuse was condemned.

>Excessive alcohol misuse and drunkenness were recognised as causing social problems even thousands of years ago.

Follow along with me here. If one simulates a universe. Universe does x, y, and z, every time, in the same sequence, with every iteration, because no variables are changed or randomized each time. But If a variable is changed, then different things happen as a result.

So what you're saying amounts to, if you gather information, but don't include that information in your model, then free will doesn't exist.

> u mad.
> no u.

Manchild spotted.

>recently
Didn't God command that John the Baptist never take "strong drink"? That's in the Bible so, not too recent.

They did that in House like it was normal procedure. Maybe they still do that in some places.

...

Are you me? Seriously, I need to slow down quite a bit.

Like I said, quibbling over whether or not the subsequent decision is free will or not.

This. DTs go on for days even after the sweating and shaking. Sleepless nights and nightmares is the stage I'm in now. Trying not to get fired but I'm so tired all day long and I always look like absolute shit.

It's nobody's fault but my own.

I'm done talking with you.

> Biblical sources.
> Factual.

I could say the same about the Egyptian ones. As for the Babylonian sources I wouldn't be able to make an educated guess.

I would really say stop now, i have been in hell the last few days but I've managed to avoid drinking. I just gave my girlfriend my bank card and locked myself in my room to avoid talking to people

It's not. The whole concept is nonsensical.

heres a wild idea

don't try to cold-fucking-turkey on alcohol?

You realize that strong drink nowadays would qualify as a small beer considering that historically alcohol was used as an alternative to water, which was difficult to get ahold of?

So you can't refute it, but you don't buy it.

Thanks for chiming it.

Yes, the monist universe concept is nonsensical.

>Is there anything more pathetic than an alcoholic or drug abuser believing that addiction is real?
Neither an alcoholic nor a drug abuser, but it's real. It's not a disease though, or an allergy... I think. It's a chemical dependency.

The brain gets really fucked up if it doesn't have it. Think of a person who gets cranky if they don't drink coffee in the morning. They're dependent upon the morning caffeine boost. It's kind of sad to see.

There's also a problem with habit, but that can be worked out by retraining your brain.

Then again - as someone said - so can dependency.

And some habits can be kicked with drugs!

But if you quantify that information wouldn't your simulation be able to simulate that introduction of that information?

I was done before you were even born you motherfucker.

Consider the use of alcohol in religious festivals.

I've always prided myself on being able to give up anything at a moments notice

Smoking, alcohol, sex, chocolate, whatever

I've always been immensely proud that I'm seemingly immune to addictions through sheer force of will

Hell, I'll routinely give up doing things I love for a while just to or e they have no hold over me

Then one day it suddenly dawned on me that I'm addicted to not having any addictions

What do

How?
You believe in souls and spirits and shit?

The concept of free will is nonsensical. If you believe in it you literally believe in magic.

I ran out of money due to lending my brother emergency cash. I didn't have a choice.

It hasn't been easy but I'm past the window where you can die.

Its hard. I try, but my willpower is weak and I've been drinking hard alcohol for almost a year straight. I try to occupy my time with other stuff, but at the end of the day all I want to do is drink. I know it's a bullshit excuse, but I just can't find a way to distance myself from this shit.

We have more self-determination and "free will" than the worms that writhe in the dirt. Does that count?

Not the user you were responding to.

>just have a few drinks today, mr. alcoholic. Tomorrow, only one or two.
Lol, no.

Some people don't have the option. I've tried asking my doctor and she did nothing for me, the ER requires me to spend a week in detox but I'm in college so I can't miss 3 days of class. I tried to wean myself off but I just start getting angry if I drink but don't have enough to get drunk. White knuckling it it is.

That's what I'm saying. If the universe is measurable, free will can still exist, because otherwise you're implying full awareness of the universe (or even just a few feet in every direction and a few seconds forward in time) would leave a person unable to make any alterations or actions not currently simulated.

The fact that depression is over diagnosed for profit doesn't mean true depression doesn't exist in the same way that the fact that people un-ironically talk about micro aggressions doesn't mean racists don't exist. Not all diagnosed people are depressed because of their brain chemistry, but all who are, are physically unable to feel happy. Or at least are severely hindered.
Not him, but if you can change a person's actions by informing him of something then obviously the chance of him doing it wasn't 100%. You can't get a valid conclusion from inconsistent premises. Also, no free will doesn't imply that people can't respond to input nor does it imply determinism, not even on an individual level

We can make more complex decisions. That's about it.

You need a weaker addiction that still gives you something to keep you going. It's how I got off coke.

> that's about it.

I should think that's rather a lot, actually.

>almost a year straight

I'm at 10 years, I wish I stopped when I was still at year one

>freshwater was difficult to get ahold of
Since the agrarian age? Lol you sound like you're twelve.

...
>All you have left to do from this situation is quibble over whether or not the decision was a result of free will.

The monist universe idea is saying differing levels of awareness can have no effect upon any outcome.

A worm who realizes "that's a fucking bird" can't escape being eaten.

A mouse who realizes "that's a fucking cat." can't escape being eaten.

A dog who realizes "that's a fucking gun" can't escape being shot.

A person who realizes "that's a fucking scam" can't escape being scammed. Etc.

Its basically saying its possible to be aware of all things and unable to change anything.

That argument is a bit moot as a person would never be able to know everything in the universe and therefore that conundrum would never come up.

Can a person is a microcosm be totally simulated?
Can every atom in their body be simulated and every action therefore they would have?
If not, then why?

If you can simulate every atom in a person, you can simulate every possible reaction to every possible stimulus.
You must believe this if you if it is possible to simulate a single atom.

Not in terms of free will.

It's as hard as breaking up with my girlfriend was, maybe a little bit harder. But fuck that shit, I'm not going to give up because it's difficult. Fuck victims.

You literally can just stop engaging in a behavior you're predisposed to do, and it being difficult is no excuse not to do it. Taper off if you need to, but if any user is as bad as I was, you need to get your life back. Get clean and you can be a person again.

If you get to that point, you'll be able to drink socially again, but you'll always have to carefully monitor your intake.

People actually believe this?

Remember when we used to call it what it really was? Poor impulse control and lack of will power?

It's the exact same with eating "disorders."

How's it going for you? This is posting
Good for you. I need to stop this asap, but again everyday I'm just working and waitng to get off and start drinking. I know people say you have to really want to (and I do) but the addiction is that bad.

When self-awareness enters the simulation, stimulus alone alters results.

Meaning being able to simulate every action/thought a person would have, then inform that person of that, would alter the simulation.

You think an entire community can drink from a single freshwater source?

And please don't tell me you're suggesting people would be drinking from rivers in the middle east where they still have problems with sanitation to this very fucking day.

I just stopped drinking after a 2 year stint.

What it was for me was being bored.
That sounds stupid but it was true.
I was bored and I hated every moment being sober because it just felt like waiting until the next moment I was drunk (i.e. drunk).

I moved in with family and I have a job coming up.
It's a lot easier to be sober now

>dude just stop drinking lmao

Mental health professionals really should be taking notes from experts such as yourself.

Maybe if more people heard this message alcoholism would be a thing of the past.

Why couldn't you simulate telling that person about the simulation?

In this hypothetical simulation, you can simulate every possible orientation of all atoms in their body.
That means every possible thought. All of them, including alerting them of their simulation. Including tell them their predicted behavior.

I really thought I was the only one on Cred Forums detoxing or struggling with this. Thanks for this thread guys, I needed this.

I didn't say compulsion is conscious, I said it's on the conscoius part of your brain. A feeling of sadness means nothing to a zombie.
Also, you're just moving the goalpost now but I'll play along. You agree now that physical addiction is real right(even though nothing in the OP specified physical or mental)? Do you not agree that physical feelings can affect actions? Do you think willpower is unlimited? Lastly, are you implying that if addiction doesn't 100% compel you to do something, it's not real? Is 99% meaningless?

Considered.
Doesn't mean the perils of its abuse were not known or frowned upon.

>>I literally wouldn't be able to stop if I have a drink.

Says a man who quit drinking.

AA was created to sell religion, that's not debatable, it's a fact. Their internal studies show their success rate is equal to people who quit cold turkey.

AA is phenomenal in selling their idea of "steps" (not forgetting the all important surrendering to a higher power) and the idea of people being without control (literally their program is this, that's why you need the "higher power" AKA god).

It's fucked up an entire generation. Now everything's an addiction and you're okay with being human trash because it's "not your fault maaan, it's a diseeeease".

Fuck all you spineless retards in the neck. You choose to do what you do.

When was the last time you fapped?

God bless Peter Hitchens

I agree. But even the Romans set aside times for wild excess where even the most debauched behavior was excusable.

en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Saturnalia

> that fucking feel when the roman version of christmas was essentially DRUNKEN ORGY TIME.

>AA is a scam
>therefore alcoholism doesn't exist

Quite a logical leap you made there, sport.

I work full-time, have my own house and live alone. I think that might be one of my problems. I don't have anyone to keep me in check. I'll have these days where I'm like "ok no drinking today". Then I get off of work, hit up the L-store and the same thing happens every fucking day. I don't know what else to do except get in contact with some family to put me on a money regiment.

>inform person of their predicted behavior
>they adopt new behavior
>inform them of predictions around new behavior
>they adopt new behavior

its a recursive feedback loop that on it's own would increase the amount of variations in behavior.

If you're going to try to argue that isn't free will, then you might just be too dumb for free will.

But of course you're talking about fucking monats so what the fuck, right?

/ck/ has good alky threads.

Good memes there too

Their brain is making decisions based on new stimuli. Where's the part where this "free will" comes in?

np, I'm getting some good info as well.

You literally need to admit to a bunch of strangers that you have no free will and repeat it all the time, basically admit that you're a sham cuck. Fuck that shit, I'll take cold turkey.

And fucking sitting around and talking about drinking for two hours a week? I didn't go to a fucking support group when my mom died, I grieved briefly and tried as hard as I could to put it out of my mind. That's how you fucking move on from anything.

Sitting around listening to other people fucking whine about their stupid problems is probably driving more people to drink than anything else. Stupid fucking program.

"no free will" means "the brain can't make decisions." Which is saying self-awareness can't exist.

You're just not understanding.
If you can simulate every atom in a human body, you can simulate EVERY possible reaction they could ever have.

Sure you could create a very long simulation, but it would be solvable. It would have to be because you can solve for one atom, you can solve for all of them given time/power

> when... died.
Not that user, but i know that pain. You're not alone.

>birthplace of civilization
>didn't have drinking water
You make a compelling argument.

>"no free will" means "the brain can't make decisions."
That's not it at all.
Decisions can be made. But they're predictable.

Humans are difference engines made out of atoms. That's it.

That is false. You're using a complete nonsense definition of free will. Not a definition that people usually understand when "free will" is talked about.

Yesterday.

I gave up fapping for 2 years just to prove I could after my 3-4 time a day habit wore me down. I did it, but it nearly drove me insane, I started fapping again once I started cumming in my sleep.

imo that doesn't apply the same was as an addiction (within reason) because it's a natural bodily function, like drinking water or eating food.

Gotta jerk off every now and then to stay sane I tell ya

You're not understanding.

Saying free will doesn't exist is saying sentience doesn't exist. Awareness doesn't exist.

>this
I've talked to family members and real friends about it and they've given me good support. They are great support, but I still manage to fuck things up.

>>AA is a scam
>>therefore alcoholism doesn't exist

AA introduced and popularized the "it's a diseeeease" narrative.

Their success rates are equal to just quitting, according to.. internal AA studies.

The narrative was always a lie. It was created to sell religion because you didn't have power to stop yourself (only god could).

They got you so good you're begging to have your balls handed back to you so you can do something with your own life.

>Quite a logical leap you made there, sport.

What the fuck kind of logic is "I can't stop drinking" from someone who stopped drinking?

>Be suicidal loser
>Decide "why not do drugs, maybe I'll die and at least it'll be fun"
>Do coke regularly for 5 years
>Regular binge drinking
>Smoke weed at least once a day
>Also do random other drugs if I can get them over 5 years from age 17-22
>Didn't die by the time I got my degree, became high school teacher
>Knew I was going to have to stop but was scared of withdrawing
>Put it off until the weekend before my first day teaching where I partied harder than I had in years and finished everything I had
>Quit cold turkey
>The only withdrawal I had was a mild headache for like 3 days

I don't even know how that worked out. Almost all of my drug friends have ruined their lives and I just turned out fine.
Now that I've stopped I have almost no friends and have no social life outside of teaching related events. I miss drugs

Yeah "medical experts" paid to coddle deadbeats and tell them what they wanna hear, that they're suffering from a "disease" instead of just being weak-willed.

Why do you think Cholera epidemics were such a massive thing until the Egyptians figured out it was because of people pooping in the river?

>all the drunk abos butthurt at this post

lmao

Physically stop yourself from breathing then.

>He doesn't know the brain still functions like a machine with set functions that relies on triggers

There's a reason there's super-obese people, there's a reason waterboarding works, there are reasons why people get randomly depressed. No matter how hard you believe, your consciousness and belief of choice only exists as long as all the components of your brain work flawlessly.

Who gives a shit about AA? Everyone knows it's a shit organization. You're the retard who brought it up in the first place.

Even if AA had a part in the "disease" narrative that has fuck all to do with the science of addiction, which goes well beyond alcohol.

Exactly. Shits hard.

yeah honestly fuck drug addicts

You're saying quibble like its a meaningless point, it's not and it completely falsifies your stupid example. If my computer responds to my mouse clicks does it have free will? I knew it would do nothing if I just let it sit there, so obviously it must right?
>Its basically saying its possible to be aware of all things and unable to change anything
No it's not. Again, determinism implies no free will but no free will does not imply determinism. Of course a person can change outcomes if they have additional information. That doesn't mean his response to the additional information was not the same as a computer chip reacting to input bits.

>Decisions can be made. But they're predictable.
What if some crazy nut comes and kills your family and friends, this drives YOU crazy so you become a mass murderer. How's that predictable?

I can't stop drinking on my own. "On my own" being the key phrase there.

What does "weak-willed" mean? That doesn't sound very scientific to me.

They're illusions.
It doesn't mean they're not compelling.

It's purely academic.
We have to live our lives like free will exists. Believing or not doesn't impact our lives.

If you believe in a monist universe, you cannot believe in free will and that our awareness and sentience are illusions.

But at the end of the day, it isn't going to change anything I do because it's just academic.
To act on it would make you a vegetable

Get your genes tested, you likely have a genetic difference that allows you function normally.

>Cred Forums - deep philosophical discussion and cuck posting

>because they're lazy
>because they're being tortured
>because they're faggots

Fuck your SJW science, you have absolutely NO excuse for not being able to quit drinking.

Did doing coke for 5 years fuck up your body severely?

Billiard balls on a pool table.
That's all

Not like the "scientific" basis for "having literally no control over your actions" is any more scientific

>Believing or not doesn't impact our lives.

It should influence your opinions on vengeance and what people "deserve" in general.

>"having literally no control over your actions" is any more scientific

No one's claiming that is the case

Millions of dead people would tell you otherwise.

Then what are you calming?

That's basic neurosciences, you illiterate fuck

man i really like that sweater

what louis doc is that from?

To be fair, Daniel dennet does the same shit concerning free will and people gobble his shit up. He's just stating a dumbed down version of dennet's which is itself a water down version of free will made to be compatible with determinism or at least biology.

>and a dog
what?

I dated a girl who believed that.
She thought that no one was truly responsible for their actions.
Kinda glad things never went further because I can imagine that belief being a real doozy.

But like I said, the illusion is compelling.
I know it's not real but I feel emotions like any human.

It's like knowing that video is actually just flickering images, not true motion. You still see the motion despite knowing that it's an illusion.

That never goes away. You'll always miss it because it's awesome.

Not really. I used to get nosebleeds if I went hard and I gained and lost weight pretty randomly but I'm healthy-ish considering I never really work out and don't really try to eat well outside of school breakfast and lunch. I definitely wasn't good for me but it could have been worse

Then you agree it's just poor impulse control.

Like seeing a donut or slice of pizza and just thinking about how good it will taste and not whether you've had enough already or if it will affect your health.

>Who gives a shit about AA? Everyone knows it's a shit organization

Despite being informed of the significance in two replies you feign ignorance yet again. Are you that stupid or just ideologically motivated enough to have blinders on?

>Even if AA had a part in the "disease" narrative that has fuck all to do with the science of addiction

The science of addiction, yes. You might want to look that up.

Because it really doesn't make the case of it being a disease, or outside the control of people. The neurobiology of positive rewards is as old as Pavlov. There's no mystery there.

But since we built up this whole industry on avoiding consequences for your actions both legally and personally, we can't just let all those juicy government monies go to waste.

AA is what the government orders people as treatment. Something that has no efficacy at all.

If addiction is a disease, what is the pathology? Nobody can say. There's nothing but endless case study reports to draw on the victimhood narrative from, because the only thing neurobiology shows is that it's connected to pleasure and reward centers and neurotransmittors.

>I can't stop drinking on my own. "On my own" being the key phrase there.

And some people can't motivate themselves to go to the gym. Others can't stop shoveling food into their mouths.

Where does the victimhood narrative end? Obese people crying "it's a diseeease" is already happening.

1) Some substances are physically addictive 2) Some people are more prone to addiction than others 3) People's "willpower" is influenced by their brain structure, it's not some magical thing that you can just summon

>babby's first day in history class
Here's a question. You said that alcohol was used as an alternative to water because water was difficult to get ahold of. Here's my question. What were they making those "weak", as you put it, weak alcoholic drinks with?

>People's "willpower" is influenced by their brain structure, it's not some magical thing that you can just summon

But they still have control over their actions? And how do you measure "willpower", scientifically?

You're saying changing the scenario won't change the outcome.

So, yes, you're quibbling hardcore.

I agree with your idea that a narrative of victimhood is prevalent today. Conversely, most recovering alcoholics aren't like that. Taking responsibility for your actions is a major component of the AA program.

That people are stupid? What's new?

Says the guy comparing waterboarding with people who can't handle a drink lmao.

en.wikipedia.org/wiki/History_of_beer#Early_beers
> As almost any cereal containing certain sugars can undergo spontaneous fermentation due to wild yeasts in the air, it is possible that beer-like beverages were independently developed throughout the world soon after a tribe or culture had domesticated cereal.

en.wikipedia.org/wiki/History_of_beer#Medieval_Europe
> The use of hops in beer was written of in 822 by a Carolingian Abbot. Flavoring beer with hops was known at least since the 9th century, but was only gradually adopted because of difficulties in establishing the right proportions of ingredients. Before that, gruit, a mix of various herbs, had been used, but did not have the same preserving properties as hops. Beer flavored without it was often spoiled soon after preparation and could not be exported. The only other alternative was to increase the alcohol content, which was rather expensive.

>But they still have control over their actions?
Well their brain can make decisions if that's what you mean
>And how do you measure "willpower", scientifically?
You can't.

His mom was a street bitch who od'd in front of him under my porch. I took him in, but it was obvious he had demons. Ended up going out the same way. Maybe there's something to this genetic predisposition thing? All I know is I miss rocco.

Yes and no. You make the decision to do drugs, a lot of people will won't be able to make themselves quit. There's a big divide between free will and addiction. They are not the same thing.

>Is there anything more pathetic than an alcoholic or drug abuser believing that addiction is real?
Skimmed milk

>free will
>real

HA

>Well their brain can make decisions if that's what you mean

Well, this is what me, Peter Hitchens, and lots of other people say. Yet it seems to me that some people argue that people who are addicted to substances "have no control"

How am I saying that at all? You're just strawmanning now. I'm saying it doesn't matter if the outcome changes, there's still a giant leap to get to free will. For the third time now, no free will doesn't imply determinism.

Addiction makes the choice to not partake in the substance immensely more difficult, that's the difference, but everyone has a choice in the end.

That's what got me.
I always had a choice.
But I liked to drink more than the alternative

They say that because the impulse can be utterly overwhelming. You can see it at work if you put a mouse in a cage with a clean water bottle and a water bottle with morphine in it. They will drink the morphine water until they die because they can't fight the impulse.

Alcoholics one

>They say that because the impulse can be utterly overwhelming

I don't know of anyone who denies this.

They drink morphone until they die because they have no fucking self awareness and limited agency. Being an actualized himan man means you should know better you goalpost-moving faggot.

>himan man

Shit. Funny typo at least.

>narrative of victimhood

If anything there needs to be a greater "narrative" of victimhood in society. Bad parents, school bullies, and other people who inflict severe mental illness and life-long suffering on others starting from a young age are not held culpable for their life-ruining actions, which are frequently worse than murder.

Wow, everything I thought about addiction was wrong. I didn't realize there was a firm science behind it, and people -know- what causes it, and there's even a metric to compare how addictive substances are. This fucking blew my mind.

Seems like the cure is stopping use long enough so the FosB gene "turns off".

I've never really given a shit about academics ever, but it's really fucking interesting how a gene can cause all of these processes to happen like a sub-program for a computer. How the hell does it know how to do that?

I don't see how humans are that much different. I mean the human would probably stop drinking if he was told he was going to die if he kept drinking but that's about the only difference.

Alcoholism isnt partying every night til the sun rises. Its waking up and doing shots before you drive to work, running home so you can drink, making sure you have enough booze before you get too shitfaced to drive and get more if you run out. Its really fun puking and shaking after drinking 8 gallons of alcohol in a week. Then your friends and family eventually hate you because youre an embarrassing asshole. Then you stop for six months but after a bit you say you can totally handle it and start over only worse than before.

One gene doesn't have that much control over you, don't kid yourself.

Neither of your wikipedia references offer any kind of answer to my question. Do you know how beer is made? Do you not realize that you need FUCKING DRINKING WATER to make it? Here's another one for you. Ever hear of a guy called Socrates? This guy named Plato wrote about him. He wrote that Socrates used to drink people under the table. It's good reading, you should check it out when you get older.

And then, of course, you have people who say "it's your fault you're a piece of shit"

which isn't entirely false, but it's certainly not true

That's a good beer bruv.

Perhaps it reacts differently with material that is living though. I.e. gives them free will.

Or that particle is always striving for life, but cannot find the right conditions to grow and see it done. In it exists free will.

The simulation is just certain parts of the universe. I.e. the creation.

>2016
>still thinking you're anything more than a meat computer

The article never really said it did, but the over expression of that gene is a measurable thing in addicts across the board, and is perhaps a large driving force behind the behavior that drives addiction.

So is AA just a total sham? AA states that nobody knows what causes addiction and that you need God (a higher power) to overcome an addiction.

>Perhaps it reacts differently with material that is living though.
On an atomic level, what's the difference?

I admit it would be difficult to discern right from wrong, but it's most definitely true. People harassed by their peers, especially from a young age (by budding sociopaths who are the products of inept parents who should have been sterilized) are having potentially severe ane lifelong suffering inflicted upon them. This is overlooked by society. It's actually worse than overlooked, because students who respond violently to bullies are made to feel like it's their fault.

"Take responsibility for yourself" is one of the most pervasive platitudes in society, usually parroted by people who have had it easy and want to feel smug and superior and act like their "successes" are due to their own perseverance rather than just pure luck.

Addiction is real, it means your genes are shit and you should die off before you breed.

This is joe rogan tier shit. Suppose something. It's possible right? Therefore it must be true

> 10 minutes later.
Long enough for me to brew a cup of a tea even.

brotip; one of my exam papers at uni was on ancient fermentation practices buddy. got top marks for that paper. The point is that the process of fermentation sterilizes harmful bacteria. But you didn't think about that, did you?

No, No you were just being a faggot on Cred Forums.

>So is AA just a total sham? AA states that nobody knows what causes addiction and that you need God (a higher power) to overcome an addiction.

AA is 100 years old, they can be wrong on the causes but right on the solution.

Some people need to feel like their under control of a higher power, and literally nothing else will work for them. If that works, is there anything wrong with that?

My uncle was an alcoholic,
He couldn't stop even when his liver was being destroyed. It's real.
Although I dont consider myself an addict I enjoy my booze but if they ever told me I needed to quit forever, I dont think I would be able to

It's not something you can really explain in words, you just kind of have to experience it to know. It's like having the girl of your dreams butt naked in front of you, rubbing her pussy, whispering in your ear to fuck her, and you have a huge hard on and every cell in your body is telling you to go.

If that works, is there anything wrong with that?

Sure, it makes me angry that being a delusional, gullible moron is a clear advantage in society.

I'm serious, that makes me extremely bitter.

You sound like you want society to be one giant kindergarten class. No thanks, I like having to overcome challenges. Weaklings like yourself don't deserve free passes just because you're weak.

My uncle was an alcoholic too.

His circulation in his legs got so bad from the booze that they had to cut open his legs, clean out his veins and arteries, and sew him back up.

When he got home from the hospital, he sat in his chair and got so drunk that he shit and pissed himself, and all over his wounds. They had to amputate a leg because the infection was so bad.

To his dying day, he said he did not have a drinking problem.

Lol you are one pathetic bastard. But if you need to count this as a "win" please do so. Just know that I'm laffing at you.

Free will doesn't exist with social contracts.

Not at all, I just want people who commit severe crimes upon others and then hide behind flaws in society to be punished severely as they deserve. You're an ignorant, dumb cunt who has no education, formal or informal, so you don't know or understand the relevant facts. You probably think the mind is a mystical entity because you have a low IQ and you're just generally worthless.

Nice non-response you arrogant dipshit. I bet you haven't seen the light of day since the last time you stepped out from your mancave.

What's so fucked up is AA has a strangle hold on 99% of the rehabs and sober livings across the US. It wouldn't be a big deal if the program worked more than 10% of the time, and if AA proponents didn't outright LIE about how successful the program is.

There is just so much wrong with AA, don't get me started, it pisses me off just thinking about it

I know exactly what its like. I've posting in this thread. It's difficult, sure, but far from impossible and having consciousness and medical data gives you a framework for changing your own behavior. If you're a rabid fucking animal, by all means, drink yourself to death. After years of abuse, I cannot anymore afford to be less than a man. The fact that you're trying to rationalize this behavior means deep down you know better. Don't be a victim. That's for women and children.

>No thanks, I like having to overcome challenges

You mean you want to maintain the delusion that the challenges you """overcame""" are equal to those faced by people you call "weak."

An organization that helps millions of people makes you angry?

You can critique their methods all day long but how many people have you gotten to give up alcohol for good?

>baby crying
That's all I heard when reading your post.

Lmao, my interest in this mostly academic, I don't drink that much myself.

"Quotes" don't ""change"" the "meaning" of """"""""""words.""""""""""

Their methods don't produce sound results. Long-term sobriety for AA members is abysmal, and worse yet they discourage and shame other programs that could very well work better, all in the name of a very false sense of pride. It's sad. It's wrong. It's limiting.

Ah shit, sorry, I meant for to be a reply to My bad.

Unless you're going to one of those cushy luxury rehab centers ,you're success rate at your local one ins't going to be much better.

I used to do Heroin , was also an alcoholic at pretty much the same time.

I stopped not through some extensive outreach program, NA 12 step cult shit or anything.

just

fucking

stop

you are a PUSSY

It's wrong if what they do doesn't work for most people. A generous success rate is 10% for aa. It's horrendous, it's obvious for most people that's not a good motivator. The worst part is that you're REQUIRED to accept a higher power, they don't even accommodate the majority of people for whom this is not a good line of thought. It's just another Christian based solution that doesn't work, like abstinence education.

Can you post a pic of your perfect genes? Yeah, thats what I thought.

What part of my sentence gave an assertion of truth you fucking mongrel?

Then people can quit and try something else if they're butthurt atheists. If it helps even 10% of people, at a reasonable cost, then it seems to have done its job

>can't stitch the hitch

I'm just telling you what it feels like, I never said it's impossible to change your behavior. I started doing a recovery program called SMART, which is basically a CBT and REBT cognitive therapy aimed at addiction. It worked pretty well for me.

>Somebody on Cred Forums admitting that they were wrong and being genuinely excited to learn something new

I-Is this sarcasm guys?

You're a sociopath

The problem is you're discounting the existence of free will because you can't imagine a situation where it existing is simpler than it not existing.

I've presented to you the idea of simulating every action a person will ever undertake, then informing that person of the results of that simulation, information that even accounts for the inclusion of full knowledge of that person's every action, and I'm saying doing so utterly removes all deterministic influence by increasing awareness to the point where determinism can no longer have hold of a person unless they so choose. To say a single choice that isn't the result of determinism is tantamount to free will.

The point I'm making is awareness equals will. But a monist universe actually has to discount all conceptualization of awareness to function at all as a model for the universe. For once awareness enters the equation, it causes endless recursive loops.

...

This addiction isn't a disease it's more like very severe ocd

What monetary incentive would the rehab industry have to use/develop a system that actually works?

disorder and disease mean the same thing

The point is not to smother out programs that could work for other people dude, which AA has done time and time again

SHHH dont let them know, they think AA isn't just a slush fund for old Christians that used to drink sometimes.

they even pass around a little bowl for you to put donations in, just like church!

it may work for some, but so does religion.

That's a curse though, not an addiction.

If sociopathy means you aren't a slave to stimulus-response loops, everyone should strive to be a sociopath.

they don't though

you've undergone some serious 12 step brainwashing I see

I don't even care about AA at this point. I'm mainly just making the point that capitalism and rehab are diametrically opposed. For if rehab worked, you'd only be able to sell it once.

No no no. They claim it works 100% of the time, and if it doesn't, it's the participants fault exclusively. They're, in some way, deficient, and something is wrong with them. This sort of attitude is dangerous, especially for an addict. Why do you think people get on drugs in the first place?

He's not wrong, it's just incredibly difficult and there are consequences (sometimes fatal) of stopping yourself from doing certain drugs/drinking (going cold turkey.)

I was addicted to opiates for 7 years, moved to FL, away from all of my contacts to get clean. The first three months were hell. Literally hell. But I've been clean for six years now.

There is some merit to his post, though. Substitute drugs like methadone, most rehab clinics, places that coddle you, etc, try to shift the blame for your problem onto something else but ultimately, the only way to get clean and STAY clean is to genuinely want to stop from the bottom of your fucking soul, to want to stop so much that you're ready to take the pain of it.

Right I got your point, but most of those rehab places are just modified 12 step programs but you pay 30grand to stay at their cozy resort.

They do. You just have poor comprehension.

>methadone

this is some fucked up shit to give to people.

I've heard from my nurse friend that they call them "lifers" because they will never stop their addiction

More like you pay 30grand to stay at a really shitty resort that won't let you do anything.

There wouldn't be any incentive, and addiction wouldn't be a cash cow. Fuck people

So many uneducated fucks in this thread

There's a reason CIWA protocol exists in healthcare.

t. Nurse Practitioner

You're talking about chemical/physical dependency.

The addiction industry is built around psychological addiction.

There's a huge difference.

at what age can I drink heavily until it starts to actually cause damage? 27 btw and the hangovers are becoming apocalyptic

You should check out the suicide rate of AA members that relapse. All the rhetoric they take to heart so when they slip they consider themselves irredeemable and commit suicide.

Its a factor of how long you've been drinking heavily, not when you start.

Genes play such a big role there it's impossible to give a useful answer

>then it seems to have done its job
screwing over 90% of your customers is doing its job? AA is just a name people know, as opposed to raccoon city drug and alcohol rehabilitation center, so it's what they'll go to when seeking help. It's a shame that most people's first place to seek treatment has a 9 in 10 chance of failing to help them. Do you think a failed treatment doesn't hurt anyone's motivation to seek further treatment? Do you think it hasn't done more harm than good? Did you know about 15% of AA members are court ordered or have it as a condition for parole?

>muh genes

the human genetic code lacks sufficient resolution to govern conscious behavior

they develop the dependency due to their addiction
they are directly related

Any age.
Drink too much and your body takes a hit.

DTs have no age limit either and those can kill.

Also I'm 27 too and hangovers aren't so bad for me.
Never had one of those photosensitive ones that tropes keep harping on about

Jesus, I don't even want to know

We weren't even talking about behavior. Also, you are a complete imbecile.

did your genetics make you say that?

My genes interacting with my environment did.

not him but free will isn't real you little faggot, nothing made him say it but the fact that he would was determined since the beginning of time

>was alcoholic and heroin user + whatever else I could get my hands for like 2 years
>ween the alcohol down to -notgonnadieifIstop- levels
>quit everything else cold turkey

its really pretty simple
I did the same for cigs

I can have a drink now and not feel the need to get blasted.

People are just weak pussies who cant control themselves (or secretly don't want to)

>screwing over 90% of your customers is doing its job?

They're not customers

>free will isn't real
>but nothing made him say it

determinism is a trap for the mentally retarded desu

As in permanent damage? Who knows, that would be dictated by other factors as well. Genetics, exercise, diet etc

>The first three months were hell. Literally hell
fuck off liar. withdrawal lasts for like a week, albeit a really intense and hellish week. After that it's just manageable cravings. For me personally, after a month of no opiates is not as bad as after a month of no cigarettes.

you sure are fucking stupid

>some people have worse brains than me, hah!

Do you also point and laugh when you see a Down's Syndrome kid walking to school?

Well just know you were right about how dangerous that is. They think their failure was because God abandoned them, I mean if he was keeping them from drinking and then they did clearly he's gone right?

>he went to a school where they unironically allow retards to disturb the class

BWAHAHAHAHAHHAHA

You live in a corporatist society. Everything is a product and everyone is a customer.

You suck dick faggot ass.

well then that means you're the exception
not everyone can be a special snowflake like you
stop thinking everyone is the same and you'll realize how fucking dumb you are

>some people are retarded as fuck
>that means addiction is a real disease that is untreatable unless you pay people money to walk you through it

thanks for the laugh

If addiction is a disease everyone has it.

Or he redefines himself out of existence, since drinking is objectively bad and god is the personification of good.

prove it

>mfw my father is in hospital for causes directly related to his alcoholism for the 6th time this year
>this is also the 4th time he has broken his ribs (this year) because of being drunk

>he is on so much pain medication and is detoxing so roughly from alcohol that he started urinating on the floor involuntarily when he got up

I wasn't talking about the hardcore physical withdrawals. If you think that's all there is to getting clean, you don't know what the fuck you're talking about, or you were hooked on some mickey mouse shit.
>a fucking week
What were you hooked on, Advil?

The fuck would I lie about this? I'm ashamed as fuck that I was hooked on this garbage. If you choose not to believe me, whatever I guess. Just sharing my personal experience.

members, whatever.
the points stand.

Holy shit dude

>stopping yourself from being a weak willed slave to chemicals means you're a special snowflake

12 step goons are the worst, you people are like a cult.

I have no clue what you're trying to say but it sounds like a hell of a strawman

Everyone's brain is somewhat prone to addiction. Some people's brains are more prone to it.

Downs Syndrome people have no choice but to be born with their disability

Addiction is the very definition of a CHOICE.

If you want to talk fallacies, yours was "false equivalency"

wow man you're so independent who don't need no man. like I said not everyone's the same otherwise niggers wouldn't be niggers

this is me btw. good luck even coming close to me in life

>Some people's brains are more prone to it.

Every human brain is hard wired to seek dopamine. A person's susceptibility to debilitating addictions is an inverse measure of how many different dopamine triggers they've been able to build up over the course of their life.

>wow man you're so independent who don't need no man.

You're a real intellectual, you sure you're not a nigger yourself?

Not that guy, but a lot of what we believe as Americans (and even how our society is structured) is actually just bullshit perpetrated by corporations so you buy shit you don't need.

The American car industry is a great example. Our thoughts on personal hygiene are a meme perpetrated by dudes who want to sell more soap. Even milk is a lie, and is really not much better for us than a can of soda. All of these beliefs are just propaganda by huge corporations

You fucking moron. With the "worse brains" comment I was obviously referring to the fact that some people's brains are more prone to addiction and have worse impulse control, just from genetic factors alone.

Yeah, but if we're going the route of denying the entire concept of free will then the idea of being "pathetic" should be non-existent.

>milk is a lie

but Calcium is good for your bones user

Yeah I think it's a bit more complex than that. Impulse control for example is highly dependent on the person's prefrontal cortex.

nah niggers can't into medical field. also not an argument. thanks for the laugh tho

Impulse control is simply a measure of how pleasurable it is to resist/indulge in an impulse.

People need cars and deodorant, user.

It has to do with long-term vs. short-term thinking too.

i was on 100mg oxy a day, twice that if i was trying to actually get high.
>If you think that's all there is to getting clean
it literally is, or at least the part that made OP make this thread (other than trolling). If you make it past the first month, you don't have much more of an excuse than the average person for getting hooked on opiates again. The point is anyone can get hooked on opiates but those who keep relapsing months out where likely going to be nobody, addiction or not.
>what were you hooked on, Advil?
that's literally how long withdrawal lasts. and past the midpoint, the worst is over. Shows how little you know and how likely it is you're lying.

... just feeds directly into what I'm saying, yo.

>Just started 1st day of bible class

We do need cars, now that our cities have been structured around them, and since everything is spread so far apart due to the "everyone needs a car to be freeee" meme propelled by car manufacturers.

We do need deoderant, but we don't need to bath with soap everyday. Our bodies are pretty good at cleaning themselves, listerine and body wash advertising just made us extremely paranoid about how we smell for generations, so now a daily soapy bath is the norm.

This is why nobody likes standing behind you in the check out line.

Shut up adam

Then why are you still a faggot shitposter and not a scientist or some shit?

It's not, that's an outright fabrication to sell more milk. Milk isn't even particularly dense in calcium, you can get higher 'doses' of calcium from certain herbs and natural foods.

Like 99% of our beliefs, lives and rituals are dictated by people who want us to buy stuff. That's the greatest definition of living in a capitalist society.

Congrats on all these yous, pal. Are people really taking the bait or is it some sort of meta-bait that Im not aware of?

Have you ever heard of PAWS? It's very common among opiate addicts.

A big reason why people go back to drugs is because they used those drugs to cope but failed to replace that void with something meaningful. It's not a sign of weakness, it's a sign of stupidity and failure :)

laughed way too hard at this

>certain herbs and natural foods

please detail them

how do i make hot chocolate or pudding without milk?

Idiots in this thread believing in the 'free will' meme. Everything in life comes down to the luck you are dealt and the fate you make out of that luck. Any decisions you make to incur that fate simply come down to neuro-biology, and the cause and effect of the universe that led you to who you are and decision's being made.

Thanks

sesame seeds, chia seeds...even oranges.

I don't know, maybe you shouldn't be making such things you fat fatass, fat fat fatass

>Our thoughts on personal hygiene are a meme perpetrated by dudes who want to sell more soap
Shower every other day or every day, apply deoderate so you don't smell like shit?You can't argue you don't need personal hygiene, what the fuck.

You guys should check out David Eaglemans 6 part series "The Brain". He's at the bleeding edge of what we know right now about the brain. m.youtube.com/watch?v=UV_Fe3nCuFI

It doesn't do you any good to believe that

>but if free will was real i would be le happier XD

literally any pro free will argument

how does it serve you to believe you have no free will?