Why raising the min wage is also stupid

Why raising the min wage is also stupid.

Hang with me, if you think either of these two things make sense then it's because you have not yet thought the whole issue out.


Sand is not valuable because it is everywhere. There is a LOT of sand. You can go dig it up or make it yourself nice and cheap.

Gold is much harder to find, rare and has a lot of valuable uses (electronics, medical, beauty). Much harder to find = worth more.

- - -

If EVERYONE suddenly has $1,000 more dollars a month, all of the businesses know this. They know everyone still needs water, electricity, a place to live, bread, milk, eggs, whatever.

They start to slowly increase the price while keeping their eyes glued on the numbers. They will raise it until they lose more then they gain.

This will repeat with every. single. industry. The government is not going to go and price control all of our businesses.

- - -

For increasing the minimum wage.

When you increase/force a higher minimun wage a few things are going to happen. Businesses will fire excess employees, small businesses will fold (they can't absorb the loss like a big company such as Wal-Mart could).

Less people working = more unemployment. You end up like Puerto Rico which has enormous unemployment with a few people who can get jobs essentially responsible for everyone else.

- - -

Why is everything so fucking expensive now? See pt 2 below.

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The reason you can no longer graduate Highschool and be self sustaining is due to two factors.

1. Women are allowed to work and they do so. Now hold on before you get antsy, women entering the work force did something very big to the economy.

They increased the average earning power of a household. People on average had MORE money and businesses did just what I said they'd do in Part 1. They raised prices over time.

Now, instead of 1 person being able to comfortable afford the dream and raise a family, it takes 2 to tango. If you combine this with the lack of marriages and other long-term partnerships, we have increased poverty and wage slavery with no way out.

2. Population increase and the influence of cheap foreign labor. Be you a conservative blue collar worker or the most degenerate silicone valley, stripe sock wearing tranny...you have felt this pain.

Businesses seek outside where the laws are loose, the pay is cheap and the profits are out of control for them.

More open borders/foreign visas = Americas standard of living drops lower and lower.

You could have just said socialism will kill this country and avoided wasting time typing out all that shit that everyone already knows but conveniently ignores when theyre the ones getting the free shit

I don't think many of them have ever actually thought this through. Most Democrats outside of the self-hating white leader caste (the ones running for President and the 20 something college kids who run their outreach) are lower I.Q. people and 1st/2nd gen foreign citizens.

I think most of them truly believe the economy is all a big joke and that muh mana from heaven is an endless thing they're simply being denied by mean ol' people.

This is what happens.

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To a retard everything is socialism
Even though our capitalistic country has done it several times before to your dumbass hurr durr communism


How tho'

I agree with you.

The solution is a universal income.

you could like take an economics course or something instead of just spitballing all this nonsense you pulled outta your ass
It's not like NOONE understands how money works, but you don't

>Sand is everywhere
i just yesterday read an article in a science magazine that explained why we are running out of sand
>Gold is much harder to find
sure, but we still have so much of it that its used to make jewerly.

i dont even care about politics, just came to point out that these points are stupid.

So don't raise minimum wage because the coporate overlords will just raise prices and there is nothing we can do about it. Shills keep on shilling.

>government is not going to control price for all of our businesses
What are anti trust laws and price gouging laws?

Go get a real job dumbass.Life isnt free.

The fryer guy at McDonalds speaks.

Economics is fully rigged. Simply learning how it's rigged, is pointless. Not OP, btw. We are in uncharted territory now. Usually when the world went nuts with caste systems, lords, kings, oligarchs or any tyrants in general, populations would move or a war would settle things down. Moving is impossible now and trying to fight this completely corrupt system is just called some sort of terrorism, fascism, or communism and marginalized or squashed. We need any new system and the only way to find one is to talk and literally "spitball'.

good luck with that

your best bet is to elect politicians who aren't far-right douchebag billionaires but you don't seem to be able to manage it

The solution is to shoot any unecessary people in the streets. Ie those that take more money out of the system than they put in - the old, the mentally ill, the sick, and the handicapped (not like a useful amputee but those that are to obese to be productive). Also those with a iq more than 1 sd below the mean. Government would save trillions and everyone would be better off.

So you prefer the far-left billionaire douche bags? How does that change anything?

who said anything about far-left? you ain't even got any of them in the US,
dems are centrist at best
and no billionaires at all in power would be a good start

You're either against the far-left, or with them. The right is not good, but they are saints compared leftists. Under the current system, you slave away for not even close to what you're worth, get by or potentially make it into the middle or upper middle class. Your efforts make people that do next to nothing, rich. That is unfair, but it's stumbling along. The left wants a UBI or full communism... This will create a system where some work and contribute, some just "enjoy life" with mailbox money and all that money goes straight up to the 1% until the part that contributes all decide to "enjoy life"... It's all lunacy and not trying to find a solution is subversive in itself.

but IQ is a weighted thing. If you keep killing everyone 1 sd below the avergae, the average will increase(meaning iq 100 is not iq 100 from vefore) and if you loop this, you will end up with 1 person in the end.

So put your words into action, and kys.

every time someone in the US uses the word leftist/socialist/communist to describe your centre-left Democrats I immediately assume you know fuck all about politics and just subscribe to right-wing propaganda
They are not perfect but are a fuckton better than the oligarch-gobbling Republicans and will move your country back towards the middle and towards sensible decision making. All the Rs want is power for their ultra-rich friends

Our left has changed quite drastically in the last 5-10 years. I voted for Obama twice, if that helps you understand.

how exactly? they seem much the same as through the Obama years. The DNC could do with opening up a bit more from establishment favourites, but what's the big problem in the last few years?

Are you ready to admit that you made a mistake with your vote in the last election? I know that it's hard for you to admit that you got conned but you have to be honest with yourself before you can be honest with the rest of the world.

The "Radical Left" is only radical when the Overton Window is so far right it is on the verge of falling off a cliff.

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Hyper-PC/SJW nonsense. They are openly anti-white, demographically. Those that used to fight for unions, the rust belt and the middle class are far more concerned with IDpol than those little problems anymore. They are openly communist, far more interested in the problems of immigrants than citizens and bow deeply to silicone valley and wall street. I voted for Obama because he was moderate, this is not the party of Obama anymore and even he has been called "alt-right" by the current leaders of the left. They are insane now, completely lost in a fake idealism even they can't properly define.

I will be voting Trump, 100%.

it's a short-term solution to get the economy flowing. it's just targeted toward a different socioeconomic class. increasing minumum wage, cutting taxes, lowering debt, it's all geared toward the same idea of flowing money in a different direction. you can do whatever you want but it always balances out regardless in a free market.

ah so nothing then, just propaganda and buzz words fed to you by Fox and the like

feel free to waste your vote
he ain't winning this time

I haven't watched any MSM in about 8 years.

Get your cry bucket ready, cultist.

I won't be crying, not American

Not op but you are legit retarded and don't understand supply and demand.

Jewelry is made out of gold *because* it is rare and therefore valuable.

And sand is common you dense motherfucker, go to the fucking beach if you think I'm wrong

Your arguments have been empirically demonstrated to be false. Raising the minimum wage doesn't mean everyone gets more money. Only those on min wage get more money so high wage earners lose income relatively.

Businesses don't hire fewer people as a result of higher minimum wages, not do they hire more people when wages fall. Profitability and productivity determine employment not wages.

Wages and prices do go up over time in a linked fashion, but this is a good thing. Real wages have increased as prices have increased and as women have joined the workforce. It is generally not true that people are worse off now.

In the USA real wages have not been rising for quite a few years. This is not the case in test of the world. So whatever is causing it is something fairly unique to the USAs economy. I suspect the structural framework and policy settings that have supported the large increases in corporate profits over the same time may play a large role.

ok Satan

I feel that way for voting Hillary, I sold out and should have voted third party

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Nigga the economy is booming and there is near record unemployment, and those ideas would hurt the economy.

Stop watching CNN and stop rationalizing bad ideas because you love Bernie

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I don't know if you actually read OP's post.

And how many of those jobs are low-wage to the point people are taking multiple jobs to get by?

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Your protest vote means so much...

Trump have been a lot less authoritarian than Obama. He didn't even killed 200 kids with drone strikes, only a general.
This is what Obama turned the cops into.

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Facts to them are like holy water to vampires.

What's better, to work an entry level job or to live in the street?

Well this is a 2nd grade understanding of eonomics. Take it from the MBA, STFU AND SIT DOWN.

Wow. Can you show us on the doll where the scary black man touched you?

Obama isn't president. He served his 2 terms without being impeached. And the militarization of our police force began long before he took office. All those bloated military budgets that were created under the Republican warhawks are mostly to blame. As all that stuff sat aging in warehouses and parking lots it was sold off to the cops. That's how your local police got their armored personnel carrier and their cool machine guns.

>He served his 2 terms without being impeached.
So will Trump.
The first impeachment was based on a fake news that couldn't even had a chance to be true, it was so embarrassing even democrats refused to follow.
The second is based on him investigating possible corruption. Try to impeach with that.

>And the militarization of our police force began long before he took office.
True, under Bush. Trump stopped the process. Obama made things worse.

>All those bloated military budgets that were created under the Republican warhawks are mostly to blame
Nope. The republicans AND the democrats are to blame. Your elections are nothing more than you chooing to kiss the right or left side of an ass and thinking your choice matter. The two parties agree on all the important issues and let you play with gay marriage and trannies.

>As all that stuff sat aging in warehouses and parking lots it was sold off to the cops.
It was not made for the cops and the cops have no use for it, except a few intervention units. You don't maintain order with military power unless you are a dictatorship. Even Macron don't do that in France.

I am glad to see you thinking guns are cools. So you are pro 2A? After all, the cops are racist, we can't count on them to protect us, right?

Maybe have a higher standard FOR YOURSELF & don't work for McDonalds & shit. If more people refused to accept low wages, corporations would have no choice but to raise wages to get employees. McDonalds where I live starts at $10/hr now because they can't find people to work for them & stay. Keep refusing to work for low wages & they'll go up or shitty businesses will tank like they're supposed to. That is, unless the gov't bails them out like they're NOT supposed to.

Minimum wage must be raised. Prices will continue to increase whether it's raised or not, so might as well raise to $15 in some states, $10 in rural areas.

Things cost 500% more than they did in 1980 but the minimum wage has only gone up 100%. The argument that it will increase prices is downright braindead.

yes, youre exactly right. this is why we need to abandon the government. nobody gets it tho

>When you increase/force a higher minimun wage a few things are going to happen. Businesses will fire excess employees, small businesses will fold (they can't absorb the loss like a big company such as Wal-Mart could).

ANY small business owner that can't afford to pay their employees a living wage, should fold. Who cares?

Restaurants are excluded due to tipping, but if some faggy construction company doesn't want to pay over $7/hr for lifting heavy shit all day, then they must fail and be out-competed by someone who will.


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And the money would come from... where?
And who would do the low added value and the unpleasant jobs?

Yo, dumbass! How come this shit works just fine in Europe? Germany for instance. You get 500€ if you can't find a job. It's barely enough to make it from one month to the next. Guess what, the prices did not jump by 500€.
Furthermore the part of the population that businesses are interested in are the medium to high earners (high does not mean 1%, that's a different story).
Nobody gives a flying fuck about a socially assisted person living on 500€/month. They are not designing the next phone/car/etc with that person in mind.
You'd think the rampaging homelessness would make 'muricans want to do smth about it - btw, you're the only developed society to have it to this extent.
But yeah, enjoy "freedom" and homelessness and the highest percentage of incarcerated population in the developed world.

I was kinda suprised, we started doing our warehouse at $15 an hour, so you think the office people or forklift drivers would want more right? Harder/skilled jobs and all, but it's like they don't care. Was really hoping they would demand more so it would trickle up and I could demand more (I'm in IT) . But yeah, the whole town is doing it, so there will be inflation and fuck us, but I guess people can feel better for a while...

it dosent

>if you can't find a job
Not so much of an UBI then.
Now, it have to stay low because the guy loose it if he start to work, so he is literately paid to be jobless. It have to pay significantly less than having a min wage job and paying taxes.
And the min wage cannot be set too high as some jobs just don't add a lot of value.

>the highest percentage of incarcerated population in the developed world.
This is another problem, and it is caused by private, for profit prisons made to milk money from the prisoner and politicians needing money for the campaign.
Once again, "your" political party won't go against it, they are in it.

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>They know everyone still needs water, electricity, a place to live, bread, milk, eggs, whatever.
>They start to slowly increase the price while keeping their eyes glued on the numbers. They will raise it until they lose more then they gain.
>This will repeat with every. single. industry. The government is not going to go and price control all of our businesses.
Yeah, this is how capitalism works. It's what they do right now. Are you retarded?

Look at this idiot trying to refute science.
Most sand is shit because it cant be used to make cement, Deserts are full of sand and wind has made it unusable, it is getting harder and harder to get sand and we are using more and more of it.

Congratulations, you just managed to discover a basic law of economics, all by your lonesome. How does it feel to simultaneously be smarter than most of /b, while still falling short of understanding the consequences of what you just wrote?

Because what you wrote is exactly why income equality can be used as a metric for human happiness and living standards (and is everywhere on earth outside of some political asshattery). Price indexes will always conform to the spending ability of their customers, which means that the price level will settle at the point where profit is maximised. Customers buying habits are influenced by a lot of things, and some of those things are the sense of luxury. That can come either from price, or quality, since humans are garbage and can't tell the two apart. What it means is that price levels may very well end up above what a lot of people earn, because the added price on the item generates more profit from those with more money, than lowering it so everyone can afford it would. But if most people earn roughly the same, that benefit disappears or is negligible, and what instead competes for market shares is quality. That's contributing to why the US (along with a lot of other countries) had so much innovation a couple of generations ago, but why it's stagnated now.

The method to achieve income equality is not to raise minimum wage though, and I have no idea why the US and other countries insist on this method. The right way to do it is by empowering the labour force, primarily through unions. Yes, we've all heard about the shitty US unions. But there's other countries with unions and those unions have forced employers to pay living wages, meaning most people can afford most goods, which in turn means low poverty, and high levels of happiness.

If this was a different place, that allowed more text and less retards, I could clarify the points I made further. btards however will undoubtedly polarise this as a dem/rep problem.

1) UBI money would be printed fresh, stealing the value of the money held by the American people
2) This money would them be distributed (unfairly) to the American people but mostly to the politically connected, so it's a redistribution system from the middle class to the lower class (some) and to the upper class (most)
3) All businesses see that Americans have an extra $1000 to spend AND the money has been devalued, so the price of goods changes to cover the difference. The price difference would not be obvious. Something that used to cost $5 would not cost $1005, but the average monthly total cost of good would increase by approx $1000
4) The country's productivity doesn't change, but people are no longer economizing because they've been artificially induced into consumption by government officials to falsely believe an outdated economic model where consumption drives the economy.
5) Rentals go up, and thus rental prices go up per the demand. People get angry. Politicians set price caps. Rental owners have less reason to build rentals. Price goes up from lack of supply. People who have rentals remain, but new entrants into the market cannot get good rentals anymore.

All of these government programs go the same way.

That's not an argument you retard

based on your argument, then why do multibillion and multimillion businesses need bailouts? When they fail, shouldn't they just fail?

Stopped reading here. No one with half a brain, doesn't expect and WANT consequences.

You're talking about inflation, retard, whether it's caused by more people in the workforce, scarce resources or whatever. The problem is that wages aren't being raised in line with inflation, brands that have near monopolies in their industry are setting prices higher than people can afford, capitalism based on a meritocracy is the fairest way of distributing wealth for sure, but it only works if products and services are priced fairly, otherwise industries blow a big old bubble and need bailing out 10 years down the line when they've raised their prices so high everyone is buying with finance and they all default, leaving nobody capable of buying more of the shit they were being extorted for in the first place.

Capitalism left unfettered has been shown to fuck up just as much as extreme socialism, we're like a decade past the recession and there's still morons like you who don't see how the greed in big business/banking etc leads to economic destruction. Raising minimum wage isn't a solution in and of itself, but alongside basic shit like price caps for essentials like rental housing, food and toiletries it undeniably lowers income inequality, without the need for huge tax hikes.

And once you do find that half a brain, you'd see the post doesn't claim that "no consequences" is the goal.

your post is stupid
raising minimum wage is stupid because it raises the expectations of what you can get for that money. Why would they hire some no experience kid straight out of highschool for 15$/h. Raising minimum wage simply raises unemployment

The kinds of jobs that pay minimum wage don't require any experience, why shouldn't McDonalds pay their employees enough to sustain themselves with? Why is that so problematic? Seriously, look at the profit margins of big businesses like Amazon/McDonalds/Starbucks etc who pay around minimum wage, it's fucked. There would be no detriment to the functioning of the brand were they to raise to the agreed upon living wage for any particular region they operate in. But they don't, because fuckin the guys in charge are dragons who just love hoarding gold coins or eating them or some shit idk.

>3) All businesses see that Americans have an extra $1000 to spend AND the money has been devalued, so the price of goods changes to cover the difference. The price difference would not be obvious. Something that used to cost $5 would not cost $1005, but the average monthly total cost of good would increase by approx $1000




So everyone will just stop working. Why kill ourselves if we can't afford anything?

Nice presentation.
Also incredibly simplified.

This thread seems really hard on you, kike-bro. Maybe you should stop?



Wages have been stagnant despite inflation. So when people made 7$ an hour 15 years ago, their wage was worth more than 7$ an hour today. You can’t just ignore inflation, it’s an obvious flaw in your reasoning.

The more I read it over, the more I think it's super obvious bait.


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So you saying that only successful educated fuckers should have normal salaries while a simple working man should die in a hole because of muh capitalism? Fuck you

Sand is acually about to run out, theres people experimenting with dessertsand so we can use that instead.

Most of the jobs aren't "entry level" office work, they are shitty jobs like "cashier" or "burger flipper"

its easy for people to know what should be done, and how it should be done when they are watching from above. the choice isn't as black and white as refusing money to work. your average american cant afford a $500 unexpected emergency. what makes you think they can wait out unemployment for the off chance a company will higher their wage? america loves cheap labor, and they aren't going to start raising wages on bottom of the barrel jobs in retail and food service because of a public out cry. they'll do what any company does. figure out the cheapest way to continue production, which in that case is automation. i think theoretically you're correct, and i 100% agree with you that companies should not be bailed out because that is not a true free market, but for your average person who has to deal with stressors like which bill to pay, how they're going to feed their family, the over draft fees and so on, it just isn't feasible to boycott a company till they comply.