Everytime Superman (especially from the Snyderverse) eveyone says no one gets superman and there's never been a "real" Superman in theaters since Christopher Reeve
So my question is: Who is the *real* Superman?
What defines the real superman?
What makes him better than all the others?
What trades can I read featuring an accurate portrayal of Superman?
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>Everytime Superman
Is mentioned*
Charisma is not a dump stat.
If Deadshot comes off as more likable and personable than Superman you've fucked up.
Up, Up, and Away is the only Superman trade you need
>b-but post-Byrne isn't Superman
Pre-Crisisfags can fuck off
This is the only true Superman.
>So my question is: Who is the *real* Superman?
Christopher Reeve Superman is a piece of shit and not at all accurate to true Superman.
Superman is in the eye of the beholder, just like Batman. Probably due to their sheer popularity, both of them have gone through so many endless permutations in so many forms of media that whatever your personal version of the character is will be just as valid as anyone else's.
For me, the ideal version is STAS. Flawed, human, but still caring. He's putting one foot in front of the other like everyone else, he's not some sort of deity stripped of any recognisable humanity.
I grew up on reruns of George Reeves' Superman in-between Christopher's movies and I can say both have their own merits of being a great Supes. Personally, I think if you mix a bit of Chris with STAS Superman, you get a really solid look at the boy scout.
>For me, the ideal version is STAS. Flawed, human, but still caring. He's putting one foot in front of the other like everyone else, he's not some sort of deity stripped of any recognisable humanity.
Which is one of the reasons why I consider STAS so highly. There's a nice balance between human farm boy and alien protector to really give him dimensions beyond a jesus allegory.
George's Superman was a dick
>inb4 that's how Superman was
I know
This. Just give us this.
>What defines the real superman?
Superman is a guy that can do anything, but always chooses to do the right thing.
I subgested this one.
Superman and the Legion of Super-Heroes
Written by Geoff John, with Art by Garry Frank.
I love that Superman is drawn like Christopher Reeve here. The story is that in the future an Earth Supremasist movement retcon Superman has being human to push his agenda. Alien are hated and Superman lose most of his power to a red sun but keep on fighting.
There is good part of humanity in this trade. It is the second trade I imported.
>be not American
>don't give a shit about your weird patriotism
>get a little chocked up/feel sense of pride and ease seeing Superman standing in front of the flag
That's what Superman should be.
>>be not American
Except, you know, give the world alien technology/knowledge, destroy or arrest terrorists organization and dangerous psychopaths permanently, rid the world of hunger issues and a whole lot of shit problems that earth has. Nah that shit isn't important, I'm pretty sure a smile is gonna make the whole world better, that's why whenever we see the future it's a worst shithole than it is now.
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He never does. Even when he's made to promise, under duress, by a criminal, that he'll go to New Jersey before he goes to California and knows that this choice will result in the deaths of his friends, as well as other people. He doesn't make a cold-hearted calculation based on population density or economic data (both of which he surely knows), he doesn't make an emotional decision to break his word because those few extra lives he might save by doing so have a personal worth to him, and he doesn't beg for the lives of his friends, because he knows that the reason Miss Teschmacher wants him to go to New Jersey first is every bit as worthwhile, and the innocent she want him to prioritise - her own relative - has just as much right to live as anyone. He doesn't make the wrong decision; there's no right decision to be made. Nothing is more moral; it would be a false equivalence to claim though that nothing is more right. The only way Miss Teschmacher would release him was if he made a promise to save the people of New Jersey, who happened to include her relative.
So he did that, because even though it hurt him, even though he knew from the death of his own father that the pain would be unbearable, he was human enough to know he was faced by a woman who was in over her head and was facing her own equally unbearable pain, and he saved her from it. That's Superman. He's not a god, or a demigod, or a mortal man with powers that he occasionally abuses: he's your hero when you don't have anybody else or any power of your own and you need help. All you have to do is ask.
I think the thing that defines Superman is pretty simple. It's just a guy who wants to help as much as he can and be there for people who need it. He's like a big brother you can always count on. He shows that he cares and he wants to protect people. That's what I think it's the only thing you can't modify about his personality. How idealized or flawed he is is up to interpretation.
It's not rocket science.
You would love Red Son Superman.
Say what you want about Max Landis but the guy fucking gets Superman.
If Cavill has more scenes like this he will become more like DCAU Superman, who feels like about as definitive a Superman as you can get in many regards.
He was very Reeve-like in STAS. He was a lot more like MoS Supes in Justice League, hell they even made his costume a darker shade of blue and had him beat up Captain Marvel to show he'd gotten darker over the years.
Also let him wisecrack every now and then. Not Spider Man levels of quipping but adequate so he's not a silent brooding figure all the time like in BvS.
>and had him beat up Captain Marvel to show he'd gotten darker over the years.
The thing is in JLU we see that progression in real time. It's not skipped over, it's not implied, we see
"This is where Clark had his spirit broken by Darkseid".
We see 'This is where people were turned against him and he had to regain their trust"
We see "This is where Luthor got a full pardon despite Clark's best efforts."
We see "This is where Clark has finally had enough, after years and years and YEARS of bullshit thrown his way".
STAS to JLU has content that only the slow burn of multiple series spanning a decade plus of material can provide. DCEU, by virtue of its format alone, cannot, and will not ever have that context, even if you ignore the hurdles its creative minds present as well.
The solution shouldn't have been "skip to the end of the context"
The slow burn and character development across the series for Superman is what I think makes him one of the best versions.
The DCAU has the benefit of over a decade of continuity from early 90's to mid 2000's. There's no doubt they've rushed with the DCEU, but the idea of Snyder's Superman sacrificing himself to gain humanities trust isn't lost on me. His death felt jarring but I think there's still room for a satisfying payoff in JL & MoS2.
I like Cavill , he has the charm and mannerisms of Clark Kent in real life. If they brought that to the screen I'd be a lot happier with his portrayal.
The problem I think, is that they were doing a jaded and cynical year 10 Superman (and the world around him) as a year one story.
If dying is what it takes to earn trust in the first place, then how the fuck is he going to KEEP that trust? Where's there to go? Escalation just gets silly once you've blown your load.
True, optimism would have been a nice starting point for the world around Superman, instead they went with a very postmodern sceptic setting, like you said that would have worked for a later film.
MoS is the origin, it's quite optimistic overall with the hope thing even if it has some dark stuff thrown in. BvS should have held back on the emphasis of scepticism against Supes, but it's kind of unavoidable after what happened in MoS...
The world seems to suddenly love him at the end of BvS anyway, I don't think Snyder showed us that the sceptics were probably a vocal minority and got carried away with all the debate scenes. He didn't show enough of superman doing hero stuff and gaining peoples trust which is why the death kinda falls flat.
Where is this from and why is Lois being such a bitch? Is it just early morning crankiness or some rough patch or something?
The comic book tie ins actually show a lot of that, which means it was thought of but just never shown in the movies.
ikr I loved those comics and they needed to be in the film. Those moments are when he feels like Superman most. Hopefully man of steel 2 can right the wrongs of previous films.
>"Clark is the real person" is the absolute definitive take on the character
Yeah no, that particular part is bullshit. Who's the real personality it's up to interpretation. Don't forget that "Clark is the real person" existed only for 30 years and "Superman is the real person" for 50. And there are still modern stories where Superman is the real person, like All-Star. Everything else he said is spot on, yeah.
What Superman is all about is being a god among men, but being more human that most of man. He is a symbol of hope. He always tries to do the right thing.
The epitome of with great power comes great responsibility.
He's usually holding back, because he does not want to hurt people. He also holds back to try to reduce as much collateral damamge as possible.
Main reason why Lex Luthor hates Superman is because Lex does not trust anyone, and feels that Supes can go rougue at any time. (And he's also a megalomaniac that needs to feel like he is in control)
It baffles me how writers, across many versions of Superman tend to get this wrong. I don't even read Supes comics, but I respect his legacy.
Also, DCAU Supes power levels were not as over the top as comics are. (Most of DCAU was fairly toned down) and I always liked that. It was more about the writing and stories than their power levels.
Action Comics #765, good issue. Superman has a sick day and the Joker visits Metropolis with Harley.
It leads into an interesting arc with a reveal about Lois that actually really surprised me For the last month Lois is really Parasite in disguise and has been sleeping with Superman slowly making him sick and draining his powers, Superman fucked a pink blob pretending to be his wife basically
OP, we're all Superman.
Lower power levels I'm fine with, inconsistent ones bother the shit out of me and that was the flaw I think the DCAU had the most trouble with. Superman could be battling space gods one day then getting hurt by some low powered gun the next. Comics in general have this issue but it felt much more pronounced in the DCAU, especially with Superman, though others suffered from it as well.
Why is there a terminator in the moon?
>MoS is the origin, it's quite optimistic overall
We're just going to have to disagree on that.
Tie in comics aren't necessarily written by the same people that do the movies or canon. I mean shit, we know what happened to the Leader in MCU tie in comics.
The message of Hope is, it just gets downtrodden by the constant death, destruction and cynicism that real life brings. I still like the first flight scene though. And the ending with the Daily Planet. More scenes like those would have gone a long way...
Parasite gets around. Didn't he also rape Luthor?
Man of Steel 2 needs the pink man.
Superman's come to do what Batman never could, rape the Joker...
Definitely, I think Parasite would be interesting to adapt to the big screen. No idea if he raped Luthor but I wouldn't put it past him. Hope they don't waste him on Supergirl or something, I'd probably cringe at that.
This was a weird moment, DCUO was a crazy comic. Not as crazy as Injustice but it was the trial run for DC video game tie-ins I think. A little underrated.
Christopher Reeve was both a blessing and a curse to the Superman character. On one hand, he made the character feel real to lots of people and catapulted Superman to greater heights. On the other hand, people think that the character, which is older than the 1978 movie one and had many, MANY more comic book interpretations over the years, is only "right" when he acts like Christopher Reeve's version.
It's weird, people get that today's 007, for instance, is different than Sean Connery's 007, but to lots of people there can only be one version of Superman and any attempt to deviate from that or show another side of the hero (like the lonely alien or god-like figure) is simply wrong.