What does Cred Forums think of this man?

>He suspended the writ of Habeas Corpus without the consent of congress.
Allowed in times of war or Civil Insurrection
>He shut down newspapers whose writers
displayed any dissent to Union policy or spoke out against him.
Also allowed in times of war and sanctioned by Congress
>He raised troops without the consent of Congress.
The President was allowed to raise troops without consent until as recently as Vietnam.
>He closed courts by force.
Courts that were violating their mandate.
>He even imprisoned citizens, newspaper owners,and elected officials without cause and without a trial.
See, suspension of Habaes Corpus.

Not trying to defend Lincoln's choice to do those things, just pointing out that all of those infractions were more or less legal (and probably necessary to win the war). The Constitution is written in a way that Civil Liberties can be suspended in times of National crisis.

As full disclosure though, I don't think that curtailing those Civil Liberties, even if it was helping the Union cause, to be a correct choice. I think that Lincoln used deplorable methods for the wrong reason.

The Union should have waged war to free the slaves, and to free the slaves only, conquest should never have been the war's aim.

If Lincoln had survived the war, he would be remembered as a pretty bad president overall.

Also OP, read Battlecry of Freedom. It's the best one book coverage of the war. Foote's Narrative is excellent if you have the time and interest to read three large volumes.

Watch Ken Burn's The Civil War, and Gettysburg as well. Both are excellent films pertaining to the war.

>south is run by what amounts to a defacto aristocracy
>make their money through farming mostly
>import thousands of african slaves to work their fields instead of hiring their fellow country men
>keep fighting legally to allow more and more of these african slaves in because they also make money off of the trading of slaves
>gets to the point where a lot of places have more black slaves than free white people
>meanwhile, the rest of the south is full of dirt poor peasents who have no chance of doing better because the ruling class has basically tied a knot in society, making their few families set for generations, while ensuring others have no chance
>leave the union after its merely suggested slavery not spread to the rest of the states
>go to war over this
>is the bloodiest war in US history
>Lincoln planned to ship most of the slaves back to Africa
>is assassinated by a butthurt actor

Lincoln was right. the "hurr durr south will rise again" fags are just being edgy LARPers and have no idea what they are talking about

Meant for

>Shall we expect some transatlantic military giant to step the ocean and crush us at a blow? Never! All the armies of Europe, Asia, and Africa combined, with all the treasure of the earth (our own excepted) in their military chest, with a Bonaparte for a commander, could not by force take a drink from the Ohio or make a track on the Blue Ridge in a trial of a thousand years. At what point then is the approach of danger to be expected? I answer. If it ever reach us it must spring up amongst us; it cannot come from abroad. If destruction be our lot we must ourselves be its author and finisher. As a nation of freemen we must live through all time or die by suicide.

He has some underrated quotes.

He stepped all over the constitution and killed 600,000k innocent white americans

The south Shouldn't have Violated the castle doctrine

This, see Rome.
>united we stand
>divided we fall

>inoccent
kek

>>leave the union after its merely suggested slavery not spread to the rest of the states

nigger they knew that in ten years they could abolish slavery since they would be out numbers state wise

also there was no need to free the slaves... with Eli whitney and the cottan gin it was like having 100 niggers working for you, along with other advancements slavery was obsolete
lincoln fucked over the nation cause the north were jews and rased tarriffs like a bitch making it so the south couldnt buy other countrys industrialized goods

If he were alive today, he would see SJWs as no better than the CSA. He had no love of googles. They just drew the line in the sand in those terms and he responded as necessary to keep the Union from fragmenting into shit-tier anarchy.

Granting emancipation to blacks was a means to an end and a weapon of war. Had Lincoln lived, they would have all ended up in Liberia anyways. Unfortunately some dumbass peckerwood had to show him how johnny reb gets shit done and killed the only guy able to stick the pin back in the grenade.

>I will make Georgia howl.
What did Sherman mean by this?

>subtly implying Hitler was not a hero

SAUCE?!?!?!??!!?!?!?!?

He was a feels over reals sjw

An absolute hero.

A house divided cannot stand, and if he didn't keep the Brits or Frogs from entering the US by allying with Russia, the US would've turned into colonies again, or something as cucked as Canada now. Who do you think gave those traitorous rich Southerners the idea to secede? The (((international banks))) worked with the 1% of the South to use the very men they kept unemployed because of slavery to fight a war to better their own wages. France and the UK were going to come from the southern and northern boarder respectively after Lincoln was defeated to split the US as they saw fit, but Lincoln cucked them by allying with Russia who had a national bank at the time out of (((their))) control. When he issued the Greenback and keep the bank in control of the State, he effectively kept (((them))) from owning the US through debt.

But then (((they))) got a guy to assassinate him just like (((they))) tried with Andrew Jackson, and what (((they))) accomplished with JFK. Anyway, it was all for naught I guess, since Woodrow Wilson enacted the fucking Federal Reserve Act in 1913 anyway.

The civil war was not even close to slavery or even the South, it was about Lincoln keeping sovereignty of the United States for its people from the (((banks))).

And fuck Woodrow Wilson so fucking hard for undoing everything.

Don't shit on William Tecumseh Sherman with your stupid memes you fucking troglodyte. The man was little more than a blood-thirsty killer but he was damned good at it. I bet your some butt-hurt confederate flag flying loser who can't even begin to appreciate the complete and total ass-beating he handed down on those slack-jawed hicks.Yeah the wrong side won the civil war, but only because they had the best generals, and that includes this man. End your life faggot.

>The Union should have waged war to free the slaves, and to free the slaves only, conquest should never have been the war's aim.
Why would you go to war to free the slaves in a foreign country?

Because:

A. Slavery is the most morally reprehensible act one man can do to another
B. The Union was attacked by the South first, and not the other way around.

>Implying I'm a retarded Southerner
I have nothing but the utmost respect for Sherman and other Union Generals.
>Yeah the wrong side won the civil war.
The right side won you fucking traitor.

>A. Slavery is the most morally reprehensible act one man can do to another
Who gives a shit they are not American
>B. The Union was attacked by the South first, and not the other way around.
Was keeping some shitty fort in sc worth hundreds of thousands of lives?

The South was fighting for state rights. The fact they lost is what lead to Woodrow Wilson selling us all down river.

All the Union generals execpt Meade were shit
I say this as the great great great great grandson of one

>Our new government is founded upon exactly the opposite idea; its foundations are laid, its cornerstone rests upon the great truth, that the negro is not equal to the white man; that slavery — subordination to the superior race — is his natural and normal condition. This, our new government, is the first, in the history of the world, based upon this great physical, philosophical, and moral truth.
>Confederate Vice President Alexander Stephens, Cornerstone Speech

No they weren't

>lincoln fucked over the nation

again, THEY left before Lincoln even did anything.

and the cotton gin increased slaver dumbass. It was just a machine that separated the cotton to be used, it was a steampunk robot that went and picked it out of the fields.

Because of how effective it was, people started using up more land for cotton fields, which ment more slaves.

It was a barbaric institution and like I said, only edge lords and people who know nothing about it defend it

>Who gives a shit they are not American
Anyone with a moral fiber. I personally believe that slavery is worth fighting against anywhere it exists. I might be idealistic in that belief, but that's how I feel.
>Was keeping some shitty fort in sc worth hundreds of thousands of lives?
No, but utterly destroying the pseudo-Aristocratic assholes levying war on the United States was worth it.

The Union's biggest mistake was not deporting all Plantation owners.

The funny thing is if we let the south leave he would have never been elected

A little bit of both. But had he lived, reconstruction would've gone a lot smoother because he wasn't bent on revenge as a political point like the other Radical Republicans. He could've been a more graceful winner, but he understood that you don't kick the dog.

That said, alot of the things he did ran counter to the intentions of the Constitution, and some of the things he did ran counter to the Constitution itself

>Anyone with a moral fiber. I personally believe that slavery is worth fighting against anywhere it exists. I might be idealistic in that belief, but that's how I feel.
A tip of the fedora to you good sir
Also cuck

>actually trying to have a serious discussion with some tryhard newfag from Cred Forums who thinks Cred Forums is all about being as edgy as possible

Not an argument my friend.

Nice bait

> Enslaving people is redpilled
Kill yourself kike

>After the sacrifice of countless millions of treasure and hundreds of thousands of lives, you may win Southern independence if God be not against you, but I doubt it. I tell you that, while I believe with you in the doctrine of states rights, the North is determined to preserve this Union. They are not a fiery, impulsive people as you are, for they live in colder climates. But when they begin to move in a given direction, they move with the steady momentum and perseverance of a mighty avalanche; and what I fear is, they will overwhelm the South.
>Sam Houston

The south should have listen to Houston.

go back to Cred Forums faggot.

why do modern right-wingnuts call their party 'the party of Lincoln'

a huge faggot

Booth did nothing wrong

Lincoln was the first republican president

>muh ebil enslavement
Whats next? Are you going to get mad for using horses as carriers?
Niggers aren't human and therefore it was okay to enslave them. Even if they weren't there is nothing wrong with slavery.

He was the greatest vampire slayer in history.

Also sage

Yes it is
You would die for other peoples freedom
That makes you a cuck
I never said I supported it I just said its not my problem
Back to rebbit

>Niggers aren't human and therefore it was okay to enslave them.

There are plenty of nigger slaves in Africa right now
Why dont you go over there and die for their freedom

Because most of them are U.S backed

>I personally believe that slavery is worth fighting against anywhere it exists.

Then why in God's name do you support conscription?

why dont you go back to Cred Forums?

come back when you grow out of your edgy tryhard phase and actually know anything about history or politics because you are adding nothing to the discussion other than "DUDE NIGGERS LMAO!"

Fuck this guy.

Booth was pretty based desu. He fucked more pussy than you for sure.

I don't support conscription or any kind of forced labor.

I thought I made it clear I do not agree with the Union's methods of winning the war.

Evil tyrant

He was America's first true dictator. His actions vindicated all the fears of the south.

>that filename

lol

>muh edgy meme
I am sorry but freeing black slaves in a forgien country is not worth one American life

>only because they had the best generals

Nigga you what? The South unequivecly had the best generals. And better troops. The Union won with sheer numbers and supplies.

Oh and kys

He would have shipped all the niggers back to Africa if he had stayed in power. Also he was a racist by today's standard, he just did not like slavery on moral grounds. Other men would have schoarched earth the south after the war he was rather measured in his response.

Please sauce.
Please.

start with Ken Burns the civil war, I thinks its on Netflix and try to learn something about the civil war

and then come back here when you've grown out of your angsty edgelord teenager phase and try to have a reasonable discussion because you come across as a stupid piece of shit.

you literally add nothing other than "DUDE NIGGERS LMAO!"

Then you are even more hypocritical than I first assumed -- you are against direct slavery because it "feels bad" or whatever but you are perfectly okay with the heavy tax burden put on the unconsenting Northerners to save complete strangers. You would rob me at gunpoint to save a homeless man on the other side of the nation.

>Other men would have schoarched earth the south after the war he was rather measured in his response.

utterly destroying rebellious parts of your country that you are about to bring back into the fold is retarded

So now not wanting to die for people I have no connections to makes me an edgelord?

>OY VEY MUH SHEKELS!

That file name is too high brow for this board.

He was a great man. Had it been for John Boothe we would've been nigger-free

>oy vey I am entitled to your shekels

Nothin, personnel is always a welcomed kek

>taking 70% of a man's wealth is fine but conscripting him for a few years is a violation of his rights.

youre a little worm of a man being edgy because you know literally nothing about the topic at hand other than black people were slaves at the time, and all you can do is keep making edgy generalizations like a child, so thats exactly how I will treat you.

you seem like the kind of faggot that browses gore threads and who doesnt have many girlfriends

Wars are not avoided on the basis of your feels. Having a Confederate ancestor doesn't legitimize your stupidity on this matter.

I'm very right-wing, but lets be real for a second Cred Forums.

The South was retarded, and anyone who thinks whites or even the world would be better off if the South had won is delusional. Bringing Googles to the New World was a mistake to begin with but Slavery was not the answer. And no I'm not using slavery in a scrupulous sense, ethics can go down the drain for all I care.

Slavery was detrimental to whites, everyone should know this. You had these huge plantation owners in the South who would buy up all the arable land and work it with slave labor, leaving whites dirt fucking poor. You guys can be edgy all you want and say Lincoln was a tyrant, wherever his intentions lied he did the right thing stomping that shit out of American history.

And don't give me that 'Oh but the South revolted because of states rights!' Pffft, yeah the states rights to own slaves...

WE
BIX NOOD
NOW

I'm a Southerner and I thought Burns' documentary gives the South a fair shake. He features Shelby Foote quite a bit and that man was based.

This

>because you know literally nothing about the topic at hand.
What are you basing this on?
The war could have easliy been avoided I we wanted
My great great great great grandfather was a union general

The Colonial Secession of 1776: Good

The Southern Secession of 1861: Bad

get your shit together, America

That's the main thing that really chaps my hide about the whole thing. Rebelling against leaders who overstep their bounds is supposed to be a good thing in America...Yet we're supposed to hate the South, because of slavery which was on its way out anyway.

Brazil didn't need to slaughter a million of its own in order to end it.

>What are you basing this on?

the fact that you have done nothing but post edgy bullshit that any Cred Forumstard could come up with, so stop pretending you arent. You reek of newfaggotry desperately trying to fit in

>Rob you to save a homeless man
No, that homeless man made the choice/choices to be homeless.

A slave does not choose to be a slave.

I would vote to levy a tax to help free a slave on the other side of the country, and I would not hold it against you to vote against that tax, as is your right.

Again how is not wanting to die for foreigners edgy?

he was going to send blacks back 2 africa before that democrat faggot shot him

"We have the choice to avoid a war, so therefore we should avoid the war." No. America is the greatest nation on Earth, and the safest nation because of its' relatively peaceful neighbors and the oceans. Counterfactually had the South stayed independent we would be where India and Pakistan are today. People had to die to prevent turning this great nation into a shithole based on muh states rights

USA government schools call the events of 1776 the revolutionary war / american revolution.

But that's false.

We didn't try to change the government of Britain. We didn't claim to be the real British government.

We _left_ a nation we no longer wanted to be part of. The word for that is Secession.

I don't know when in US history it started, but "secession" is a racist evil thing that the south only did because racist and racist and also racist!!!111

The events of 1776 should be taught as the War of American Secession. Putting the word "revolution" in there anywhere is incorrect.

Ask yourself: why would government schools teach you secession is racist, and then use the wrong word to describe the founding of our own nation?

So youre just going to use circular logic after I call you out? Have a good life

>I would vote to levy a tax to help free a slave
What is stoping you from buying a plane ticket and freeing slaves keyboard commando

if he lived i think he would've succeeded in sending googles to liberia. but we will never know

>Counterfactually had the South stayed independent we would be where India and Pakistan are today.
Extremely dubious claim.

We have some how been able to avoid war with Canada
What circular logic
You are just calling everything edgy

Too bad he was assassinated, he was going to ship all niggers back to Africa so I wouldn't have to see any unless I was reading National Geographic.

yet the most plausible

>The Union should have waged war to free the slaves, and to free the slaves only, conquest should never have been the war's aim.

I hope you realize that nobody intended to free the slaves at the beginning of the war and Lincoln 'freed' slaves in rebel areas mainly to fuck with the war effort of the South.

The re-conning that Northerners liked niggers in the 1800's is retarded. Northerners hated niggers. Read some first hand accounts. The civil war was not fought over slavery.

No because we poo in the loo

He was the original JFK.

it's often called the American war of independence as well fampai

not that it really matters

Just another puppet and horndog

Also the reason Lincoln held off on the emancipation proclamation was he was afraid the army would mutiny

fpbp

>Slavery is the most morally reprehensible act one man can do to another

Why? Explain yourself.

the south left the north because the north was breaking the law

the north fought the south because Lincoln didn't want to lose the southern states.

Slavery was WHY the south left. UNION was why the north fought.

the war was very unpopular in the north
see: draft riots
see: suspension of habeus corpus
see: suppression of free speech / press

it wasn't until lincoln fully adopted SJW abolitionist rhetoric of his day that he was able to wrap up a moral cause and get the north to continue an unpopular, pointless war

also, go look up lincoln's quote on his goals. his goal was to preserve the union; if he could do that with slavery, he would. The topic of how slavery got resolved was immaterial; preventing southern secession was his focus

look for jefferson davis's Senate speech (jefferson davis was a US Senator prior to the war). Davis argued that it wasn't appropriate for the south to nullify illegal/unconstitutional laws; that this was lawlessness and immoral. Rather, he argued (eloquently) that if the federal government were no longer going to abide within the limitations set forth in the constitution, states had no choice but to back out of the union.

as the war went on, and things looked bad for the south, there was at least one southern leader who proposed ending slavery on the CSA side in exchange for a truce. E.g. that guy wanted southern independence (and no war) more than he wanted slavery. The rest of the CSA leadership obviously didn't go for it..

Yes, because Canadians and Mexicans are cucks. Trumpfags and Hillaryfags can both coexist in this nation because of blood.
Two extremely populous nations, each with nuclear weapons, strong militaries, constantly having border skirmishes and threatening to go to war over contested territory?

>Also OP, read Battlecry of Freedom. It's the best one book coverage of the war. Foote's Narrative is excellent if you have the time and interest to read three large volumes.
>Watch Ken Burn's The Civil War, and Gettysburg as well. Both are excellent films pertaining to the war.

This.

Ken Burns the Civil War is pretty much the definitive series on the war up to this point

He was a politician.

He was a Republican, but more important, he won. They want to claim the mantle of a winner.

>>Lincoln planned to ship most of the slaves back to Africa

This cannot be over stated.

>tries to figure out what is funny about the picture
>sees alphabet pictures on top
>sees portrait of obama
>what letter is that?
>letter: N
>why is there an N for Obam
>WHEN YOU SEE IT

my search did not disappoint.

Two points for your consideration,

A. The Constitution was adopted by special State conventions, NOT the State Governments, who seceded. The State Governments never specifically agreed to the Constitution in the first place. The only two Confederate States that held referendums, Virginia and Tennessee, were not even unanimously for secession (see, East Tennessee and West Virginia).

B. Even if were concede that Secession wan legal, than the sovereign nation of the Confederate States attacked the sovereign United States in a blatant act of aggression on a lawfully held tract of Union land.

I'm not physically fit to fight in a conflict for one, and I am not in a financial situation to fight a one man war on African slavery on the other.

Alone I can do little to stop slavery, working with many others I can make a difference.

I am very, very aware of this fact.

That's why I stated earlier that I believe the war was fought for the wrong reasons.

Taking a person's agency without their consent is a moral evil. Killing a person is also a moral evil, but slavery is akin to torturing them first.

At least chattel slavery. Other kinds of slavery are still horrific, but I will admit they are less evil than chattel slavery.

>Taking a person's agency without their consent is a moral evil.

Why is it morally evil to take a persons agency without their consent?

>I'm not physically fit to fight in a conflict for one, and I am not in a financial situation to fight a one man war on African slavery on the other.

>Alone I can do little to stop slavery, working with many others I can make a difference.
It sounds like you can do absolutely nothing other than demand someone else do something about it

t. butthurt confederate shithead

your points are well offered.

However, by what mechanism is an island off of the carolinas obviously the property of the north? Just because the north says so? Just because the North still has some troops there?

I'm afraid not. The position of the north is that ALL of the land belonged to the north. The south obviously disagreed.

Re-read this:

en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Battle_of_Fort_Sumter

Unironically both depending on your point of view. For me, he was a tyrant. For many around me, he's a hero. The worst part is that he set the precedent of big government in the U.S. without Lincoln, there's no way Wilson could have gotten away with half the shit he did and FDR likewise.

t. Constitutionalist Southerner who no longer lives in the South.

>. The worst part is that he set the precedent of big government in the U.S.

THIS

It's how I feel.

I know that isn't an argument, but it's all I can offer really.

I respect your right to feel the opposite, for the record.

South Carolina legally sold the Island to the United States government prior to the war.

You can't sell land to a government and then try to claim it's your by relative place.

Ken Burns the Civil War also features two of my favorite pieces of music.

Jay Ungar -Ashokan Farewell written in 1982 although the tone fits the film.
youtu.be/L_qIhrB73Uo

And the Jacqueline Schwab version of Johnny has gone for a soldier, the original tune of which was made popular during the Revolutionary War.

youtu.be/AfBXXfO150U

also, folks should read Winston Churchhill's speculative alt-history, about the South winning:

winstonchurchill.org/support?catid=0&id=2615

Ashokan Farewell used to devastating effect in the closing scenes of the first episode

youtu.be/AfBXXfO150U

>Yeah the wrong side won the civil war, but only because they had the best generals
Nigger what?

Dat last line by the narrator.

>mfw

That was obviously based on the fact that you couldn't move large enough armies through the ocean

I haven't actually seen the doc, but here's my favorite period piece.

youtube.com/watch?v=gz6Jk8RttlE

How the fuck did you hear it I went to the wrong song it was supposed to be this one

youtu.be/fY1lmeL22jg

I Googled it stop being such a faggot and check your links next time

You're right though , it is really moving piece.

They use that song in the film too, they use a lot in the Ken Burns film

No shit, but he makes a good case for the Union.